This may be controversial

[asterix]

Just the sort of person I was on about. If you wasn't there I don't think you have a valid opinion. I was, so therefore I believe I know more about "said situation" then half the muppets here ok? If you've got any thing else to say on the matter or any of the twots that liked your witty reply want to chip in then feel free.
I wont waste my time on on the sycophantic back slapper brigade (you know who you are).
Sorry to the OP for this side track ..again glad your son is ok.

I simply fail to understand your problem with the comments on this thread nor why you should be offensive about what is on the whole a civilised debate. We have the freedom of speech in the UK and on a forum it is quite possible to walk away and cool off if you feel the need to abuse people exercising that freedom.

We also don't have conscripted armed forces. Anyone in the forces joined it willingly, aware of the job description. It is a dangerous job and those involved don't always get a fair deal. However, there are other dangerous occupations outside conflict.

Of course we can have an opinion without having to visit a war zone into which our government has, on our behalf, sent troops. We elect that government to make the decision to do so. We might feel they are wrong, we might feel this way precisely because we dislike sending the sons and daughters of people like the OP into such dangers. We are entitled to say so.

My parents were both active combatants, my uncle was a fighter pilot, his son was a fighter pilot, my grandfather was in the infantry. I've never been in, or even felt the inclination to join the services although I have lived in regions where there was conflict.

 

[avalon]

I personally don't believe anyone, even the troops fighting in Afghanistan, understand what's going on out there, but I do think they and those who give the orders have to find a way of justifying it to themselves otherwise they wouldn't be able to do the job.

 

[ufkacbln]

I agree also, but at what price

To quote an old military saying....

The Fortune of War
'and I'll tell thee plain
Is a wooden leg
Or a golden chain

Dates back many years to before the Marlborough campaigns

 

[ufkacbln]

There are a few points that need clarification....

The military is often a career choice like any other job path with a qualification and experience as the aim. In many jobs the military experience and qualification id rated highly by employers


That is why the areas of the country that are deprived are often over-represented in the military. NO local jobs, no local training, a dead end socially...... then the Armed Forces offer you a way out of that, and people take it. Going to an active area is something that one is aware of, but is not a high priority in the decision making process.

Secondly the problem with Afghanistan and indeed Iraq was that it was a politically motivated invasion by Bush / Blair based on lies, untruths and misinformation with short term goals, and no planned strategy.

That is why there is such a mess. We have created a vacuum that history shows will be filled by the strongest and most fundamentalist groups so any "improvements" made will quickly be reversed, and the clampdown will be detrimental to all thiose who have embraced these changes

Finally it is Politicians who make wars, not the military.

 

[ufkacbln]

[QUOTE 3014204, member: 1314"]Just finished reading an article in The Sunday Times today by Christina Lamb, writing from Afghanistan. There's a big section in her big spread about how 'tall and blonde' female journalists aren't safe (of which she's one in case we forget).

I mean no personal disrespect for those UK/European citizens who have died and suffered out there for whatever reason, but this is just white-middle class self-obsessed voyeurism. It's not about 'doing good' but simply earning a wage, maintaining an image as the Great White Liberal, or justifying one's vocation as a soldier.

Anyway, how many 'tall and black' female journalists are working for The Sunday Times? Less than the number of 'tall and white' female journalists in Afghanistan I'd guess.

(As posted earlier I think this thread should be in CaD anyway)[/QUOTE]

Of course this then leads to the debate about whether we actually have the "right" to impose Western Standards, Religion and morals on an Islamic state

 

[hoopdriver]

[QUOTE 2437991, member: 1314"]As this is cafe I'm going to be gossipy. Back in the day I used to go out with a Kurdish girl who loved in Brockley. She'd come over by herself as a refugee from Iraq and had qualified as a Social Worker. She was liberal but all her family, she told me, were very, very, very conservative. Then one of her brothers came over as well and stayed over at hers one night when I was there. He didn't know I was seeing his sister. She was about 5' 7"; he was 6'3", wiry, never smiled and had these piercing blue eyes that looked straight through you, and the confident gait of a wolf.

He'd spent a few years in Afghanistan fighting for the Mujahadeen against the Russians. I slept on my own that night. At 2 or 3 am I heard my door open and shut. He was checking to see I hadn't crept into her room. I still wonder what he would have done if I had crept into her room. Anyway, we didn't last long, she had a love-child with a married man, then I lost touch.[/QUOTE]
Love the description of the guy. Really well observed and written

 

[ScotiaLass]

I am so glad your son is okay! My heartfelt thoughts and prayers go to those who lost their lives - RIP lads.
My daughter lost mates and had some return minus limbs.
I asked her some years back, if she was worried about being posted there and I'll never forget her reply. She just said:
"I'd be a liar if I said no. But I was trained to do a job and knew what I was getting into when I signed on the dotted line (she was 17 years and 9 months old). Don't worry about me mum, we're a family in the Army and we will always have each others back".

 

[ufkacbln]

[QUOTE 2437991, member: 1314"]As this is cafe I'm going to be gossipy. Back in the day I used to go out with a Kurdish girl who loved in Brockley. She'd come over by herself as a refugee from Iraq and had qualified as a Social Worker. She was liberal but all her family, she told me, were very, very, very conservative. Then one of her brothers came over as well and stayed over at hers one night when I was there. He didn't know I was seeing his sister. She was about 5' 7"; he was 6'3", wiry, never smiled and had these piercing blue eyes that looked straight through you, and the confident gait of a wolf.

He'd spent a few years in Afghanistan fighting for the Mujahadeen against the Russians. I slept on my own that night. At 2 or 3 am I heard my door open and shut. He was checking to see I hadn't crept into her room. I still wonder what he would have done if I had crept into her room. Anyway, we didn't last long, she had a love-child with a married man, then I lost touch.[/QUOTE]

That's what I call contraception!

 

[ufkacbln]

LOL you joker. "EVERY SINGLE FEMALE SOLDIER" every one? Really? Because you get a few that can't get enough, so I doubt that they would even dream of ticking that yes to that box!

Garbage?
It's true you idiot.
Some women in the army are very very promiscuous is that better?
And hatred? Hatred of what? I liked those women and so did the rest of the company

Sorry to the OP, but this post needs to be challenged as irrelevant, inappropriate, and ill informed. However it does unfortunately illustrate the attitudes of some service personnel so does a service form that point of view

It is inappropriate to judge anyone by their sexual history and assume that because they are sexually active they cannot receive unwelcome attention or be the victim of inappropriate sexual harassment is simply unbelievable.

I think that anyone who has served will realise that there is often "banter" that is part of service life and then there is a deeper more worrying aspect which is abusive and inappropriate. This needs to be recognised, and dealt with.

Let me give you an example.

We had one girl who was a very "outspoken" and would give as good as she got. For example she was flashed at in a pub, so brought all her friends across and asked for another look as her friends could not believe how small it was. She dealt with it confidently.

However she became the victim of a guy whose friend had a brief fling with her. He had assumed that she would go out with him and sleep with him because she had slept with his friend. At first she treated it as a joke, but a sustained campaign of inappropriate suggestions and being groped led to an incident in a dining hall where the guy walked up behind her and put his hand up her skirt. She turned round and slapped him across the face. He then complained that she had assaulted him.

That is where I became involved. Throughout he really saw that he had done nothing wrong or that he had driven her to this point. His "understanding" was that she was "a Nurse", and could not see that his attention was unwelcome.

She did not deserve this, had not provoked, initiated or encouraged this.

She would certainly have ticked the harassment box

Once again my apologies to the OP and hope we can get this back on track