to the cab driver in Haringey...

[CotterPin]

For a lot of cyclists, undertaking is considered more convenient (no need to overtake, use the opposing lane and then cut back in) and is also perceived as being less risky - it's therefore not really "amazing" that the majortiy of cyclists prefer to undertake rather than overtake.

And, of course, bike lanes encourage undertaking. My personal beef is not people undertaking as such but when you see cyclists attempting to squeeze up the insides of motor vehicles of all shapes and sizes even when there is absolutely no space to do so. Apart from being downright dangerous, it just looks rude, like you're trying to shove past someone in the post office queue.

 

[PBancroft]

And, of course, bike lanes encourage undertaking. My personal beef is not people undertaking as such but when you see cyclists attempting to squeeze up the insides of motor vehicles of all shapes and sizes even when there is absolutely no space to do so. Apart from being downright dangerous, it just looks rude, like you're trying to shove past someone in the post office queue.

Indeed. I go one step further than that: If there's a fair sized queue ahead of me, I tend to treat myself as a car, and wait. Probably plenty of arguments for and against doing such a thing, but if I needn't p1ss off ten drivers by dodging past them when they're going to overtake me a little durther down the road anyway, then I'll wait.

It kinda seems to me like the cyclist equivalent of drivers who overtake then stop, or turn left... there's just not a lot of need IMHO.

 

[Notsoblue]

And, of course, bike lanes encourage undertaking. My personal beef is not people undertaking as such but when you see cyclists attempting to squeeze up the insides of motor vehicles of all shapes and sizes even when there is absolutely no space to do so. Apart from being downright dangerous, it just looks rude, like you're trying to shove past someone in the post office queue.

I totally disagree with this. What on earth is wrong with filtering through stationery traffic? Part of my commute takes me along the Marylebone Road in central london, its usually very busy and at times the traffic can be heavily congested. Are you suggesting that you wouldn't pass all the traffic because its "rude"?

 

[LOGAN 5]

It's amazing how many people are intimidated from overtaking properly on the offside. It's actually very easy, and easier still to negotiate back across the lane of traffic to the cycle lane. With a bit of practice it's possible to negotiate back across two lanes of traffic.

I'm not intimidated by overtaking on the outside at all and do so on many occasions. When there's a cycle lane on the inside I'll use and should not be bullied out into the road by bad driving. On this particular road there's a hill and I'm on a slow bike so not making good progress and the queue of traffic goes on for about 300 yards virtually at a stand still. It's possible to use the cycle lane right to the top of the hill and negotiate the traffic light junction at the top before any of the queuing cars catch up as they get stuck in another jam after the lights.

If the queue is just crawling with maybe a foot or two between each other then it's tricky to get in between them and back on the inside. Of course it's possible to negotiate this and as you say even two lanes but on this stretch of road given the length of queue and its speed, the gradient etc then it was easier to go up over a dropped kerb on an EMPTY pavement to avoid the taxi. It seems a ridiculously long way round to go on the outside to go past the taxi (which certainly wouldn't have let me cross back in front of him as it was his intention in the first place to obstruct me) and maybe one car and then get back on the inside.

Long explanation for a simple manoeuvre complicated by inconsideratte driving by yet another cab driver.

 

[BentMikey]

People rarely drive with a foot between their and the next car, and an overtake even in the now stretched circumstances has still got to be better than riding on the pavement. That's for 5 year olds after all.

 

[LOGAN 5]

People rarely drive with a foot between their and the next car, and an overtake even in the now stretched circumstances has still got to be better than riding on the pavement. That's for 5 year olds after all.

er yes they do actually. And when they're going so slow they're not looking or expecting a cycist to want to come right across them from the outside and it can annoy them.

Pavements are for peds and 5 year olds but sometimes if they're empty and traffic conditions are dangerous then they're the safest option. Having said that I rarely end up on the pavement.

 

[hackbike 6]

I ended up on the pavement at Whipps Cross when that ambulance went past.

 

[CotterPin]

I totally disagree with this. What on earth is wrong with filtering through stationery traffic? Part of my commute takes me along the Marylebone Road in central london, its usually very busy and at times the traffic can be heavily congested. Are you suggesting that you wouldn't pass all the traffic because its "rude"?

The key word in my earlier post was "squeeze". Nothing fundamentally wrong with filtering but what I object to are the people who virtually have to scramble onto the kerb to squeeeeezzzzzze up the inside of a vehicle. They are like zombies on the march. Somewhere in their brain they can hear the mantra: "Must get to front of traffic, must get to front of traffic ..." and it appears to block out all common sense!

I filter on the inside and the outside where there is space. I do both with caution and when I filter on the inside I am always conscious that I am putting myself in a position where most drivers are not looking out for me. Sometimes, like Kaiputh, if there does not appear to be any safe way through I will make like a car and sit where am I in the middle of the lane.

 

[BentMikey]

er yes they do actually. And when they're going so slow they're not looking or expecting a cycist to want to come right across them from the outside and it can annoy them.

Pavements are for peds and 5 year olds but sometimes if they're empty and traffic conditions are dangerous then they're the safest option. Having said that I rarely end up on the pavement.

*ding* Sees username, understands use of the pavement. LOL, j/k!

If they really were that close, and I strongly doubt it, then there will be such congestion that you'll have no trouble overtaking shedloads of cars properly. Worrying about annoying drivers by overtaking them seems silly to me, it's normal experience to be overtaken by cyclists in queues, whichever side they pass.

Going by your posts, I think you'd benefit from reading Nutty's filtering notes here:
http://www.nuttycyclist.co.uk/cycling/filtering-1.htm

Much more effective than either undertaking or riding on the pavement.

 

[4F]

[quote name='BentMikey;348574 Worrying about annoying drivers by overtaking them seems silly to me' date=' it's normal experience to be overtaken by cyclists in queues, whichever side they pass..[/quote']

Damn right, nothing better to bring a smile to your face filtering past endless queuing traffic.

If they are that annoyed about it then maybe they should consider cycle commuting as well

 

[Origamist]

Going by your posts, I think you'd benefit from reading Nutty's filtering notes here:
http://www.nuttycyclist.co.uk/cycling/filtering-1.htm

Alarm bells start to ring in my head when I see quotes like this:

"Here I hope to discuss a way of making very good progress through traffic, with 100% safety to the rider."

I find it difficult to take the rest of the advice seriously - even though I'm sure it's well meant and based on experience.

 

[LOGAN 5]

*ding* Sees username, understands use of the pavement. LOL, j/k!

If they really were that close, and I strongly doubt it, then there will be such congestion that you'll have no trouble overtaking shedloads of cars properly. Worrying about annoying drivers by overtaking them seems silly to me, it's normal experience to be overtaken by cyclists in queues, whichever side they pass.

Going by your posts, I think you'd benefit from reading Nutty's filtering notes here:
http://www.nuttycyclist.co.uk/cycling/filtering-1.htm

Much more effective than either undertaking or riding on the pavement.

My last comment on this thread.
I find your tone and comments condescending and patronising.
What was a tale of a how a taxi driver deliberately blocked a cycle lane has turned into criticism (and lessons for correcting my behaviour!) about how I got past him.

 

[Notsoblue]

The key word in my earlier post was "squeeze". Nothing fundamentally wrong with filtering but what I object to are the people who virtually have to scramble onto the kerb to squeeeeezzzzzze up the inside of a vehicle. They are like zombies on the march. Somewhere in their brain they can hear the mantra: "Must get to front of traffic, must get to front of traffic ..." and it appears to block out all common sense!

I filter on the inside and the outside where there is space. I do both with caution and when I filter on the inside I am always conscious that I am putting myself in a position where most drivers are not looking out for me. Sometimes, like Kaiputh, if there does not appear to be any safe way through I will make like a car and sit where am I in the middle of the lane.

Ah fair enough, I've just had random abuse shouted at me by drivers (especially on the Marylbone Road) who seem to resent the fact that cyclists aren't held up in a gridlock!

 

[BentMikey]

I'm sorry you interpreted it that way, and yes, you're right that of course the main problem is the taxi driver, not your riding.

OTOH, your comments imply that there are better ways to handle the problem than you did, so don't be too surprised that someone wades in with an alternative method of dealing with stuff. I hope you can gain some knowledge from Nutty's notes, as I think they're very good. They certainly helped me to change from the overly submissive riding I used to do, and make better progress.