What excuses will be used to increase electric car tax?

[DRM]

It is perfectly possible to drive most of mainland Europe (including France), without paying tolls. We have done it at least once a year for the past 30 years.

It’s possible, but it’s quicker to use the Autoroutes & pay the toll, But if iirc what I was suggesting was if foreign drivers purchase a vignette, before leaving the ferry,rather than us having toll roads, all these Eastern European HGV’s and Vans pay to use our roads while unfairly competing for haulage work with higher taxed UK trucks.

 

[Andy in Germany]

It’s possible, but it’s quicker to use the Autoroutes & pay the toll, But if iirc what I was suggesting was if foreign drivers purchase a vignette, before leaving the ferry,rather than us having toll roads, all these Eastern European HGV’s and Vans pay to use our roads while unfairly competing for haulage work with higher taxed UK trucks.

Funny, that's what the German hauliers say too.

 

[DRM]

Funny, that's what the German hauliers say too.

That’s because they have huge diesel tanks down each side of the tractor unit, at a guess they will hold around 1000 litres giving them around 2400 mile range, they are instructed to fill up in the cheapest countries only, or get the sack, So there is no fuel tax paid either, the annual tax on a 44 tonne artic is either £1850 or £1350 depending on emissions in the UK, I’ve no doubt that non of the Eastern European countries pay even half of that, so how can UK companies compete, I’m sure the German hauliers are in the same boat as UK hauliers, plus the drivers will be being paid peanuts compared to ours so it’s a no win situation for them

 

[Andy in Germany]

That’s because they have huge diesel tanks down each side of the tractor unit, at a guess they will hold around 1000 litres giving them around 2400 mile range, they are instructed to fill up in the cheapest countries only, or get the sack, So there is no fuel tax paid either, the annual tax on a 44 tonne artic is either £1850 or £1350 depending on emissions in the UK, I’ve no doubt that non of the Eastern European countries pay even half of that, so how can UK companies compete, I’m sure the German hauliers are in the same boat as UK hauliers, plus the drivers will be being paid peanuts compared to ours so it’s a no win situation for them

Only £1850 or £1350? For access to the entire UK road network for an entire year? Not a bad deal really,as the roads are supposed to be part of the common good, and are paid for by our general taxation. That amounts to a hefty subsidy of the road transport industry.

I remember an American railway manager saying that the UK's road system was the last bastion of socialism: it was made by the state and given to the citizens practically for nothing as long as they were willing to queue...

 

[DRM]

Only £1850 or £1350? For access to the entire UK road network for an entire year? Not a bad deal really,as the roads are supposed to be part of the common good, and are paid for by our general taxation. That amounts to a hefty subsidy of the road transport industry.

I remember an American railway manager saying that the UK's road system was the last bastion of socialism: it was made by the state and given to the citizens practically for nothing as long as they were willing to queue...

Absolutely it is subsidised, I believe it used to be £2500 per year, but was reduced to help combat the complaints of unfair with regard to the huge amount of foreign trucks on Britain’s roads, that had carte Blanche to undercut everyone one else

 

[Andy in Germany]

Absolutely it is subsidised, I believe it used to be £2500 per year, but was reduced to help combat the complaints of unfair with regard to the huge amount of foreign trucks on Britain’s roads, that had carte Blanche to undercut everyone one else

Hmm. I wonder when the rail transport network can look forward to the same treatment. To be fair, you know...

The German response is a toll for trucks on Autobahns, which all trucks have to pay. Despite the German haulage compalies predicting Armageddon, it seems to work. All we need to do now is have a toll for cars and we'll be properly fair...

 

[DRM]

Hmm. I wonder when the rail transport network can look forward to the same treatment. To be fair, you know...

The German response is a toll for trucks on Autobahns, which all trucks have to pay. Despite the German haulage compalies predicting Armageddon, it seems to work. All we need to do now is have a toll for cars and we'll be properly fair...

Sounds fair, then ensure everyone pays up the same amount, a years toll could be the same as a years tax for a British truck

 

[Andy in Germany]

Sounds fair, then ensure everyone pays up the same amount, a years toll could be the same as a years tax for a British truck

You pay by mileage on Autobahns as far as I know. It is based on GPS and there are some restrictions for trucks off the Autobahns so they can't just drive on main roads.

 

[BoldonLad]

It’s possible, but it’s quicker to use the Autoroutes & pay the toll, But if iirc what I was suggesting was if foreign drivers purchase a vignette, before leaving the ferry,rather than us having toll roads, all these Eastern European HGV’s and Vans pay to use our roads while unfairly competing for haulage work with higher taxed UK trucks.

I understood what you were suggesting, I was just disagreeing with the idea

We lower the tax on our trucks

UK truck companies could work in mainland Europe, using fuel which is generally (but not always) cheaper than UK

At the speeds Trucks are limited to, it is very often just as quick to use the free "N" roads (France), or, equivalent in other countries.

In the days when I worked, and was travelling in a car, I did sometimes use the Toll roads, since it was possible to (legally) make use of the speed advantage.

 

[Andy in Germany]

I understood what you were suggesting, I was just disagreeing with the idea

We lower the tax on our trucks

UK truck companies could work in mainland Europe, using fuel which is generally (but not always) cheaper than UK

In a matter of months UK truck drivers will no longer have freedom of movement and as a third country we have to take what permits the EU allows. As I understand the number of permits issued will be relatively small.

I suspect that the future will be of trailers or containers being dropped off at ports and picked up off the ferry on the other side. This could also apply to channel tunnel traffic.

This could have the advantage that rail transport may become more viable, at least on the European side: a lot of trailers travel by rail here and it would make sense to run a service to the UK. Running it in the UK may be more difficult as the UK's trains have to be smaller.

 

[BoldonLad]

In a matter of months UK truck drivers will no longer have freedom of movement and as a third country we have to take what permits the EU allows. As I understand the number of permits issued will be relatively small.

I suspect that the future will be of trailers or containers being dropped off at ports and picked up off the ferry on the other side. This could also apply to channel tunnel traffic.

This could have the advantage that rail transport may become more viable, at least on the European side: a lot of trailers travel by rail here and it would make sense to run a service to the UK. Running it in the UK may be more difficult as the UK's trains have to be smaller.

Yes, I was suggesting how we could/should have done things, instead of taking our ball home and spoiling the game.

We (Haulage operators) could have even gone all free market and set up East European Subsidiaries and competed! (sorry about the language).