What have us cyclists been saying for ages?

[Ming the Merciless]

Last summer noticed that one of TFGMs upgraded beelines simple road pelican tooucan crossing at the end of a cycle route took an age to change to red when the button was press. This is not what beelines is all about I though, so I fired off a fault report.

In fairness they sent an engineer out who tested the crossing and replies directly to me statiing that the crossing as encountered by me had a 90 second delay from button being pressed to the red sequence starting.

He took my point and apologeticly changed it to a 60 second delay if there had been be red within 2/3mins.

The reasoning is to allow people crossing to build up and avoid too many changes and stopping the traffic too often. In practice you stand there on your own waiting like a turkey for Christmas and In reality people don't wait, they chance their arm and cross.

I dunno I sort of seems like it's paying lip service to the notion of prioritising cycling and walking without actually doing it.

I have issues with the bee lines project anyway, mainly that there is no money for ongoing maintenance which falls to local authorities. The same local authorities that can't afford to repaint a 100m cycle lane or an asl box.

Why not let the motorised traffic build up rather than inconvenience pedestrians and cyclists?

 

[Tom B]

You may well ask. Any stopped MPV traffic usually catches up to the rest of the traffic at the major junction towards town or at one of the numerous side junctions heading the opposite way.

I'd sort of accept a delay if it only occured if the button was pressed a few seconds after the last red cycle finished.

 

[Drago]

The people causing the delays should suffer. Every effort should be made to smooth the way for those who don't gridlock the roads.

 

[mjr]

Didn‘t realise you are also icowden. Either way, I’d say 13 years between first TL and first car does not class as a significantly pre dates.

I didn't realise your message was meant to be a private conversation and you'd posted it in the wrong place.

I'll correct the other mistakes in the message after an insignificant delay, if I'm still alive and remember.

 

[Ming the Merciless]

I didn't realise your message was meant to be a private conversation and you'd posted it in the wrong place.

I'll correct the other mistakes in the message after an insignificant delay, if I'm still alive and remember.

I was responding to icowden as I’d quoted him. Besides your dates for first car we’re out by 100 years 😂

 

[confusedcyclist]

Main point is, we all know that if we remove motorised traffic from roads we can also remove traffic lights. The mass spread of traffic lights is primarily down to motorised traffic.

Primarily, yes. But the Netherlands still has to use traffic lights to signal congested cycle paths in densely populated urban areas. We can perhaps cope without them in quieter areas, and maybe outside peak times in the dense areas, but not always. Even large crowds of pedestrians, particularly during events, need to be sufficiently controlled otherwise there is a real risk of fatal crushing. Signals may well be human, not electronic lighting, but it's still traffic management of sorts. Of course, these are problems of large urban conurbations and metropolises, and not your typical market town.

 

[mjr]

I was responding to icowden as I’d quoted him. Besides your dates for first car we’re out by 100 years 😂

No, it wasn't. A steam engine is not a car, just as a policeman directing traffic is not a traffic light. You have to draw the line somewhere sensible, else the first car is probably before Christ!

 

[classic33]

No, it wasn't. A steam engine is not a car, just as a policeman directing traffic is not a traffic light. You have to draw the line somewhere sensible, else the first car is probably before Christ!

Explain Mary Ward, Kings County then.

 

[Milkfloat]

Explain Mary Ward, Kings County then.

A steam powered vehicle with a limit of 4 mph in the countryside and 2 mph in urban areas is quite a bit away from the modern idea of a car

As a side note - the first passenger carrying self propelled vehicle in 1803 was run on closed roads in London, so already a sign of the motorists view of might is right. After that first run, they crashed it and the idea was given up for monay years.

 

[icowden]

Explain Mary Ward, Kings County then.

I think when we talk about infrastructure for cars we are really talking about the birth of mass produced cars in 1913, rather than occasional steam powered vehicles. Roads at the time of Mary ward would have predominantly been filled with horse pulled carts and carriages (or just horses). Traffic control was still required, just using people rather than traffic lights.

With the mass production of cars, suddenly fully surfaced roads start being a requirement. Speeds start to quickly increase, and traffic lights start saving money. Then we get the development of the electric circuit along side and the invention of the microchip which again explodes growth of traffic management which can be done more effectively and on a far greater scale from a control centre (usually).

Going back to the "point" (which has now almost been completely lost in a debate about the history of the motor car). Routes in the UK have a long history. We have roman roads. In "newer" countries such as the US, new cities were designed pretty much alongside the motor car rather than being based on existing farmland and residential areas. Sure they may have re purposed some native american routes, but most US towns and cities were/ are built using a grid system, and as there is lots of land, it tends to be a widely spaced one.

So UK roads weren't designed for cars, just re-purposed for them. Hence they can tend to be narrow, twisty, illogical etc. I agree with @mjr and @YukonBoy that lots more could be done to improve roads for all users, and that designing idiotic cycle lanes isn't a good solution (plenty of those around me).

 

[Ming the Merciless]

No, it wasn't. A steam engine is not a car, just as a policeman directing traffic is not a traffic light. You have to draw the line somewhere sensible, else the first car is probably before Christ!

It was a car the engine happened to be steam but just as with modern cars the engine is often an ICU. The type of engine doesn’t change whether it was a car.

 

[Johnno260]

They’re planning to increase my village by over 50% it’s a joke, in the town hall meeting they pitched it to us as almost all trips will be done using the existing sustainable cycle paths, there are zero paths.

there were three avid cyclists in the meeting and the guy was quickly shot down in flames, it got worse though as he said traffic increase would be a min as traffic was clocked going avg 40mph through the village, so 40 in a 30 is ok? lol

 

[Mike_P]

I cannot wait to see what happens locally to me, North Yorkshire proposed a relief road for Harrogate which went to a public vote and the majority opposed it in favour apparently of sustainable transport measures. Suspect the vast majority voted against the road and not for the sustainable stuff. Wait till they find out the sustainable measures mean deterring car use