That it would prevent situations such as the above?
Who's at fault?
- Thread starter Rubber Bullets
- Start date
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That it would prevent situations such as the above?
IMO, while the driver didn't run a red - it changed while he was stuck in the junction - he should not have proceeded until there was enough space to get completely through the junction.
See HC #178
So he was completely in the wrong for abusing his horn, and for abusing you.
See HC #178
So he was completely in the wrong for abusing his horn, and for abusing you.
Not in Swindon, as an experiment they turned off the traffic lights at one of the main roundabouts, since then I have seen so many crashes and near misses.
For me as a cyclist I used to consider it a "safe" roundabout but now it has become a game of russian roulette every time I go across it.
fossyant
Ride It Like You Stole It!
- Location
- South Manchester
Both were impatient. Driver could have waited, especially being third in line - so long as he isn't blocking the junction. Rider could have let him through.
Typical two road users being inconsiderate.
Typical two road users being inconsiderate.
Hi. I've signed up to answer the OP on this thead! I've probably met you at some time on this route, I do it daily. This is a difficult junction - coming from the opposite direction you show, which is the most difficult, the official stop line is a long way short of the junction and its uphill. It takes me 12 or 13 seconds from a rolling start to cross the whole junction, which can put one in conflict with "Clarkson" setting off from the left if/when the lights turn against you half way across, so for years (19) my practise (specifically for this junction) has been to wait for the lights to change on the corner well ahead of the proper stop line and then cross the intersection when the light turns green in my favour, which also then gives me a chance to get into primary to pass the line of parked cars after the junction before I get caught up by overtakers from behind me.
But if there are already cars stranded in the junction before I cross which is common travelling East as you descibe, the pragmatic solution is just to let them get out of the way first and I'm still at the head of the queue to get through when the way clears. Some timid or sensible drivers do wait if the lights turn against them and they're out of the way. Some still wait even if they're in the way. The advance stop line for cyclists has only been a relatively recent innovation and doesn't solve anything although it gives a route past waiting traffic to the front of the queue when its busy. I've tried all different tactics for this junction and settled for the one I use (and you describe me to a tee!) out of long experience.
But if there are already cars stranded in the junction before I cross which is common travelling East as you descibe, the pragmatic solution is just to let them get out of the way first and I'm still at the head of the queue to get through when the way clears. Some timid or sensible drivers do wait if the lights turn against them and they're out of the way. Some still wait even if they're in the way. The advance stop line for cyclists has only been a relatively recent innovation and doesn't solve anything although it gives a route past waiting traffic to the front of the queue when its busy. I've tried all different tactics for this junction and settled for the one I use (and you describe me to a tee!) out of long experience.
HLaB
Marie Attoinette Fan
If the driver had to cross/ give way the stream of traffic he should have gave way but if he was left in a awkward situation (blocking traffic) common-sense/ courtesy would say let him proceed. Live and let live though, it doesn't matter if the cyclist was in the correct if there was a collision and they became 6ft under. As an aside that junction does look awkward but conversion to a rbt would only make things worse for cyclists; it may help motorised traffic flow but if the vehicle streams are unbalanced maybe not. Re timing of the lights would probably be a better solution but the existing timings are probably capacity driven. Redesign of the layout may help but they're may be constraints on that (land space) and it'd be more costly.
OP
OP
Rubber Bullets
Senior Member
- Location
- Torbay
Thank you to everyone who has taken time to comment in this thread, I didn't get a chance to log on yesterday, and am delighted by the amount of opinion and advice I've received.
A number of people here have summed the situation up very well for me thanks.
Jacks, I'm delighted that you were moved to join just because of me
. I commute from Paignton to Torbay Hospital, and am usually passing through there at 7:50ish in the morning, and back at some point after 5:15 depending on how smartly I can get away from work. I may well have seen you at some point. I agree that the road round from the Grand and Torquay station is a nightmare, and I always try to time my approach so that I don't have to stop. I do use the bit of pavement cycle lane there, one of the few I do, as it helps me to achieve this. I do always stop in the box though, as I can't quite bring myself to go through and up onto the corner, though it is clearly a sensible and safer option. This has been made more difficult for me since I swapped from spd type pedals to road shoes and speedplay pedals. I find it difficult to clip in on uphill starts, and have on a few occasions had me foot slip off the pedal, (actually the slope up to the lights at Torre station are worse, the first day I was on the new pedals I had to stop a few car lengths back, on the steepest bit, and when I tried to go again I almost joined a very surprised and irritated man in the passenger seat of his convertible Mercedes!
RB
A number of people here have summed the situation up very well for me thanks.
Jacks, I'm delighted that you were moved to join just because of me
. I commute from Paignton to Torbay Hospital, and am usually passing through there at 7:50ish in the morning, and back at some point after 5:15 depending on how smartly I can get away from work. I may well have seen you at some point. I agree that the road round from the Grand and Torquay station is a nightmare, and I always try to time my approach so that I don't have to stop. I do use the bit of pavement cycle lane there, one of the few I do, as it helps me to achieve this. I do always stop in the box though, as I can't quite bring myself to go through and up onto the corner, though it is clearly a sensible and safer option. This has been made more difficult for me since I swapped from spd type pedals to road shoes and speedplay pedals. I find it difficult to clip in on uphill starts, and have on a few occasions had me foot slip off the pedal, (actually the slope up to the lights at Torre station are worse, the first day I was on the new pedals I had to stop a few car lengths back, on the steepest bit, and when I tried to go again I almost joined a very surprised and irritated man in the passenger seat of his convertible Mercedes!RB
its 176. being the 3rd and moving when traffic is already coming across is normally wrong, you'd only be able if theres a long gap..... "i've cross the white line" , well yeah, and you shouldn't have...
176
You MUST NOT move forward over the white line when the red light is showing. Only go forward when the traffic lights are green if there is room for you to clear the junction safely or you are taking up a position to turn right. If the traffic lights are not working, treat the situation as you would an unmarked junction and proceed with great care.
176
You MUST NOT move forward over the white line when the red light is showing. Only go forward when the traffic lights are green if there is room for you to clear the junction safely or you are taking up a position to turn right. If the traffic lights are not working, treat the situation as you would an unmarked junction and proceed with great care.
