Winter commuting

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Randochap

Senior hunter
It stands to reason that using the roads in winter with rain, fog, etc. is going to be more hazardous. However, I got hit in July on a clear road, at noon, on a clear sunny day.

All you can do is follow the highway code, signal your intentions clearly well beforehand, ride a straight line and and make sure your bike is set up for winter riding and you and your bike are well lit.
 

fossyant

Ride It Like You Stole It!
Location
South Manchester
Rando, how's your recovery going ?
 

davidg

Well-Known Member
Location
London
Chamfus Flange said:
People love stats, but most people don't understand love. Toss a coin as many times as you like and the chance of getting a head is still 50% (slightly more if you believe QI). The same with travelling down a busy road. No matter how many cars pass you the likelihood of an incident with the next is the same as the previous one.
I agree with those who take less risky roots to reduce risk, but time has no effect.

I agree with you that time has no effect if you mean the history of what has happened, but not if you mean how many times you do something...

given the probability of an event happening the more times it may be caused, the more likely it is to happen!
 

GrasB

Veteran
Location
Nr Cambridge
davidg said:
I agree with you that time has no effect if you mean the history of what has happened, but not if you mean how many times you do something...

given the probability of an event happening the more times it may be caused, the more likely it is to happen!
You could put this another, way if you toss a coin once what's the chance of getting a head? Now, toss a coin 10 times, what's the chance of getting a head on one or more of those throws?
 

davidg

Well-Known Member
Location
London
it's a 50% chance each time, however if you toss it 10 times then the probability of getting a head once more more is much much higher
 

Tynan

Veteran
Location
e4
two of my three serious accidents happened in perfect conditions, clear sunny day, dry roads etc etc, the third was peds running from behind a van, I don;t think the dark had anything to do with it

Good lights and viz and a sensible route and good riding is plenty at this time of year imho
 
Long Post - Need to Get Stuff off my Chest!!

trio25 said:
I wonder if part of the problem is more people commuting in cars due to the weather/darkness?
Partly that and of course poor weather brings its own hazards: ice (not just dodgy for falling off, but also dodgy when Mr HaventGotAClue slides on it and sideswipes you), reduced visibility in rain and fog, Mr and Mrs CantBeBotheredToCleanTheWindows peeping out through the letterbox in the ice / condensation on their windows, all those types of things.

It sometimes seems as though people are in more of a hurry when it's wet .. presumably they worry that their car will melt if it's out in the rain too long. And you'll get the people who must never be touched by a drop of rain, ever. They can be spotted legging it quickly from their house hunched down tight under an umbrella while they run the 20 yards to their car without looking where they're going ..

But after this morning, I dunno: is there something in the air. Can't blame the weather: it's bright, clear, sunny and not windy down here in the South East. I generally have an incident free commute, mainly due to the route I use I think. But this morning ..

Incident 1 was rather amusing actually. It was just after a "classic" large-ish crossroads roundabout. I was turning left, onto a short section of dual carriageway (30mph limit though - on a business park), then needing to turn right* off that road to get across onto a bridleway. As I approached the rab, there was a car on the approach to my right who I assumed was looking to go straight over (he was in the right hand lane of his approach, not indicating, and the right turn from his direction goes nowhere). But no problem, there was stuff on the roundabout so he'd stopped giving me plenty of time to get onto the dual carriageway.

I generally get into the right hand lane of the two lane bit as quick as I can (I only have a couple of hundred yards before I turn off) and I prefer to get out and ready rather than try to switch lanes at the last minute. I maintain a good strong right signal and there's the left hand lane for stuff to get past me should they wish. (It is a 30 limit, slightly downhill, so I'm typically over 20mph even on an MTB sat up flapping my arm about).

This morning, about halfway to the turn off, I could hear some big car acceleration noises going on behind me so do a glimpse behind to see the car I'd spotted at the roundabout doing the go-as-fast-as-I-can-up-behind-that-bike-then-brake-at-the-last-minute manouveur. Then, he sat right behind me, clutch in, blipping the throttle. A little worrying: we're going downhill remember and in that state he's hardly got full control of his vehicle has he? But I'm going to turn off in a few seconds so I'm not that worried.

You could see all the way down the next few hundred yards to the next roundabout, there were no vehicles between us and that roundabout, the left hand lane was completely clear and there was nothing behind us so if he was in that much of a hurry to get to the red light clearly visible at the next rab he could have used the left hand lane; I know you're not supposed to overtake on the left but I was approaching a junction and signalling right. But no, he seemed to want to make some sort of point to me .. alas, it was too subtle for me and so I didn't quite get it.

I turned into the bit that crosses the island between the opposing traffic flows and off he went at full bore. Amusingly, the bridleway I went onto skirts back towards the road he was joining after a few hundred yards and, despite me havnig to wait for a while to cross onto the bridleway, I noticed him still sat at the red light as I passed. I gave him a cheery wave as I headed off down the bridleway. :biggrin:

The second one was a bit more worrying. There's a point on a housing estate where I need to turn right off the main drag through the estate onto a side road. The turning comes just after a sweeping left hander and is basically at the start of a straight bit which would be a good overtaking opportunity for any following cagers .. so I always make darned sure that I make it clear I'm turning off.

This morning, as I approached the bend before the turning, I was being followed by a car that didn't seem bothered about passing: he'd sat behind on a bit where he could comfortably have got past. I was in secondary, doing 20-ish in a 30 limit, so I figured he just wasn't in that much of a hurry.

As I approached the corner before the turning, I did a check behind: car still a way back, good. Move to primary, check again, start signalling right and gradually start slowing down (back brake only: still signalling right), another check, slow some more, move out a little further ready for the turn (not too far: don't want him squeezing up on my left), another check just as I get to the turning, right hand back in to make the turn, and hear an engine start to rev.

"Blummin Hell", I thought, "why suddenly so impatient - let me make the turn first; there's not room to go by on the left yet". Then my life saver check just as I started turning showed that he was trying to come round me on the outside!! :smile: I hastily aborted the turn and ended up sat in the middle of the road - he meanwhile had finally realised that I hadn't just been stretching all that time I had my arm stuck out, hit the brakes and gone further right, mounting the kerb on the road I was trying to turn into.

I looked at him, he looked at me with his mouth hanging open. I stuck my arm out and said, "what did you think this was for?". He informed me that I was female genitalia and that I should go forth and multiply and, this much eloquence having exhausted him, wheelspun off up the road.

Sadly, I didn't get his number plate and neither did the two builders standing nearby: they called across to check I was OK and said they'd watched it all unfold and thought they were gonna be picking me up out of the gutter. "Good job you did that last look", they said. Indeed! :ohmy: Ironically, they were there to fix a wall that had been wiped out by someone who'd been playing at F1 round the estate and had spun off on the corner there.

* being on a business park, it's one of those dual carriageways with gaps in the islands so you can get into / out of side roads. Means you have to cross the two lanes of traffic going the other way, but hey it's a 30 limit!!
 

swee'pea99

Squire
Numpties a go go this morning. Couldn't believe it. Spent 2nd half of journey repeatedly muttering 'not *another* one...'
 

upsidedown

Waiting for the great leap forward
Location
The middle bit
Lazy-Commuter said:
Partly that and of course poor weather brings its own hazards: ice (not just dodgy for falling off, but also dodgy when Mr HaventGotAClue slides on it and sideswipes you), .................................


Good report there LC, you obviously know what you're doing and are a very confident rider.
I have a right turn off a busy rural road, traffic is normally happy to sit while i signal and then go. I do try to do a lifesaver but have become a bit complacent about it lately, your 2nd incident has just made me realise i should do it every time, thanks.
 
upsidedown said:
Good report there LC, you obviously know what you're doing and are a very confident rider.
I have a right turn off a busy rural road, traffic is normally happy to sit while i signal and then go. I do try to do a lifesaver but have become a bit complacent about it lately, your 2nd incident has just made me realise i should do it every time, thanks.
Ah, you're too kind upsidedown. The lifesaver is force of habit from my years on motorbikes, though I've not had one of those for a few years now. The transition to cycling that I've made over the last couple of years has mostly been helped by what I've read on here, and in Cyclecraft of course.

I don't always get it right, but I'm far more aware and confident than I was 18 months ago. Thanks to all the experienced guys and gals who post here.
 

HobbesChoice

New Member
Location
Essex
So, in one way it's reassuring that it's not just me noticing the change (this is my first year and therefore first winter commute). But in the other it's not very reassuring at all as a commuter that the rate of people mentioning accidents on here seems to have really increased very recently.

Although, having everyone give such good explanations of the roads they've been on and the positions they've taken and their avoidance maneouvres does help those of us who try to learn by others experiences. I find I look behind me a lot more at the moment (which isn't easy when I'm trying to avoid wet leaves, puddles, pot holes and puddles hiding pot holes).

But with all these accidents and the amount of near misses on here each day I may have to start doing a roll call! Can you all gather here at 10am and again at 10pm as a make shift "school assembly" so that we can make sure everyone is here and safe please? Obviously, anyone not here at said times will need a letter from your parent/guardian/partner along with some form of "good will gesture" to make up for any worry you will inevitably cause by your silence! :?:

(is it sad to admit that when I hear about an accident on here or on the news I check to make sure certain people have logged on already today so I know they're ok??? :welcome: - it is, isn't it???)
 

potsy

Rambler
Location
My Armchair
Today was cold and dry,then the rain came for last 5 miles:sad:
Way home was showery not too bad so went into Altrincham to the library,came out it was bucketing down got soaked on the 2ish miles home.
Oh can't wait for summer and all the good weather we are due:smile:
 
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