Bradford Cycle Lane

[NorthernDave]

The work on this scheme (in East Leeds at least) is taking an age and weeks go by with very little appearing to happen.
The quality of work looks pretty poor in places too - rough tarmac, gutters higher than the road surface (so water won't drain into them), other places where rain water simply sits rather than draining away, the list goes on.
It also appears that bus shelters have been placed so that cyclists will have to ride through the bus queue near Ebor Gardens...

 

[Flying Dodo]

So it's not a safe design. You don't only have to give way to the side road, but traffic behind you on the main road. I can't look through 270 degrees at once - can you? If not, it's not possible to use that layout safely. Would anyone like to calculate how far to one's left a rear-view mirror would need to stick out to give useful visibility back over one's right shoulder?

So it's contrary to official guidance, policy and the original plans agreed with cycling groups, but it's being funded from "Cycle City Ambition" budget. Not much ambition being shown there, is there?

I'm sorry that you have to suffer such lethally-dangerous crap but why would you want to inflict it on others? Misery loves company?


And there, in a nutshell, is part of the reason why cycling in this country still suffers lots of crap from councils. The "I certainly wouldn't make a fuss" mentality

You're right. However the main reason why councils put in that sort of design is that (sadly) in the UK motor traffic has priority. Cyclists don't have the legal backing, nor, more importantly, the culture that is inherent in places like the Netherlands. There, by default, drivers slow down and wait for cyclists crossing junctions as a) they often have priority and b) if they hit a cyclist, then the driver has to prove the cyclist was at fault.

It's going to take a lot of time for coucils to decide to put stop lines on roads before the cycle lane rather than after. But yes, the more we as cyclists push back and complain about poor and unsafe design, the better, and hopefully things will change.

 

[NorthernDave]

I've been out and cycled a section of the Cycle Super Highway (CSH) today - here is what I found.

I started at the Ring Rd / Barwick Rd junction in East Leeds on my road bike and headed towards Leeds on the same side of the A64 as traffic also heading that way. Although not officially open, this section appears to be effectively completed apart from signage (the poles are in, but no signs fixed on them yet).
The surface is that slick black tarmac that hides imperfections and has a habit of retaining ice during the winter. No-one has yet explained what processes have been put in place to keep the CSH running year round, but Leeds Council do not grit / clear pavements outside a small area in the city centre so it seems unlikely that gritting / clearing the cycleway has been budgeted for.
On my road bike, the initially smooth looking surface is actually quite poor and rough to ride on in places and there are several changes of aspect that aren't easily identifiable from the saddle. In places it is bordering on uncomfortable to ride on. There are also ridges where joints in the tarmac surface could have been resolved better.
More concerning is that in many places the CSH isn't wide enough for two bikes to comfortably pass each other - faster riders are going to have to drop onto the adjoining path or the road to get round other cyclists safely. This is a recurring theme.
Where the CSH crossed side roads, the CSH has priority and this is marked by "Give Way" lines on the roads and the roadway is raised in a 'cushion' for cyclists to ride across - however cyclists will still have to check up to 360 degrees around them at these points due to road layout. There are also sharp turns coming off these sections, so there will be a need to slow down to avoid overshooting onto the pathway (perhaps this is deliberate? I suspect not though...). I ended this ride at the junction with Foundry Lane (Killingbeck Police Station), feeling underwhelmed at what has been delivered given the timescales and cost.

Heading back the other way up the hill, this time on my hybrid.
The section past the new fire station is not yet complete, so I joined the CSH at the junction with Inglewood Drive. This section also appears virtually complete apart from the signs.
Whilst the hybrid is a more forgiving ride, the surface still didn't feel great. Again, the CSH is too narrow for two bikes to comfortably pass in many places, which appears to be a basic design fault and it's difficult to believe that this got past the drawing board stage. Again, the surface is that slick black tarmac. Whilst I used the CSH, two cyclists on passed me on the A64 dual carriageway. read into that what you will.
The layout here suggests it will be a "shared space" rather than segregated cycleway / path as on the other side of the road.
At the brow of the hill by the Aldi, works are still ongoing, but to be blunt the junction with York Rd / Barwick Rd looks downright dangerous.
The CSH hugs the kerb right next to the dual carriageway and goes straight across the mouth of the junction (crossing what is currently currently a ghost island), so again cyclists will need 360 degree awareness before proceeding ,even with right of way (presumed given all other junctions on this section) as traffic turning off the 40mph A64 will be right on top of them, along with the need to cross traffic queuing on York Rd to join the dual carriageway. Dangerous doesn't even appear to cover it.
The next section is laid out but unfinished and again suffers from a lack of room to pass without going onto the adjacent footway.
From here the CSH turns to use side streets running parallel to the A6120, which isn't ideal but is a better option than using the 70mph dual carriageway!
At the top of Hansby Drive the CSH takes a new tarmaced section through a hedge and alongside the dual carriageway to the Windmill Roundabout. This is OK, but the hedges are the type with inch long thorns which are shed all over the new surface - signifying a lack of practical thinking during the design / planning stages again.
From here the CSH crosses the incredibly busy York Rd / Seacroft Gate (A64/A6120 roundabout, 24 hour Tesco) directly off the roundabout which is busy and for long parts to the day will necessitate judging gaps in traffic off the roundabout one way and then negotiating traffic queuing to get onto the roundabout going the other way to get across.
It then used existing underpasses as 'shared space' to negotiate the roundabout. These subways are narrow and prone to flooding in moderate rainfall - a problem that has been known about for at least 5 years, but which has yet to be resolved.

So, a less than impressive first ride to be honest, which is a crying shame. This was a once in a generation chance to really make an impact and a lack of practicality, combined with poor surfaces really has seems to have let at least this section of the scheme down.

 

[growingvegetables]

... a less than impressive first ride to be honest, which is a crying shame. This was a once in a generation chance to really make an impact and a lack of practicality, combined with poor surfaces really has seems to have let at least this section of the scheme down.

Just a tuppennyworth - that's the "glass half empty" pov?

The "glass-half-full" - it's far better than I expected. Some good work, retrofitting segregation into some very unforgiving situations. I've been riding bits of the same stretch for weeks now. It is "Pootlers' Way", slow - and damned good for lazy, leisurely cycling. If my kids were still young enough, I'd happily use it with them. Or do my shopping trips on it. So far, the raised cushion and Give Way signage across junctions has worked well for me - but that may be down to drivers being confused; could well be different once they're used to it.

For the commute
- 25mph+ downhill? That's what the road is for!
- >10mph and the granny gear hill climbs? I'm very glad of the CSH.

For the budget, we were never going to get the complete realignment of York Road. Not even of the Melbourne and Barwick roundabouts.

 

[Pete Owens]

But @Milkfloat even if they stopped trying today, there would be all the crap they've already built. The cheapest and possibly best way forwards is if they fix the crap.

The cheapest and best way forwards is simply to remove all the crap.

Return all the shared use pavements to the exclusive use of their legitimater users - pedestrians.
That solves the problem of dangerous left hooks at a stroke.

Remove all the narrow (less than 2m wide) cycle lanes - instantly returning more road space to cyclists.

Now of course this might not please the segregation fundamentalists, for who will champion any dangerous rubbish so long as it has a cycle symbol painted on it - but it would be welcomed by anyone who argues for legally enforsable standards.

 

[mjr]

The cheapest and best way forwards is simply to remove all the crap.

Removing would indeed be one way of fixing the crap and is definitely appropriate in some places, but:

Return all the shared use pavements to the exclusive use of their legitimater users - pedestrians.
That solves the problem of dangerous left hooks at a stroke.

Hardly solves it! I've been left-hooked while riding on the carriageway, saved only by performing an emergency turn, and I doubt I'm the only one.

Also, let's return the crap conversions, but keep some purpose-built/rebuilt cycle tracks which are pretty good. Let's not throw the babies out with the bathwater.

Remove all the narrow (less than 2m wide) cycle lanes - instantly returning more road space to cyclists.

I can't think of any place where that particular move wouldn't help right now... maybe offer highway authorities the alternative of making cycle lanes 2m+ wide instead of removing them?

Now of course this might not please the segregation fundamentalists, for who will champion any dangerous rubbish so long as it has a cycle symbol painted on it - but ...

Why would anyone worry about "segregation fundamentalists" who don't actually exist outside of the imagination of a few right-to-the-roads fundamentalists?

 

[MarkF]

Bradford is extremely hilly, the centre sits in a bowl, I'll be amazed if this sees much use at all. I often commute cycling from the North near the canal and across the centre, I doubt that I see another cycling commuter 1 day in 10. The Bradford-Leeds canal highway is a dogs dinner too, a hotch potch of different surfaces, some very poor and daft cobbled speed bumps at the bottom of locks.

Residents fume at traffic chaos caused by Thornbury roundabout cycleway roadworks

 

[mjr]

Bradford is extremely hilly, the centre sits in a bowl, I'll be amazed if this sees much use at all.

Bristol is extremely hilly and The Centre sits in a bowl, yet it has quite a lot of people cycling there. Admittedly Bristol have done well with a few flattish routes, but Bradford's flattish routes seem to run North-South and the major roads have some of the flattest whereas I'm guessing the primary desire line is East towards Leeds...

 

[MarkF]

Bristol is extremely hilly and The Centre sits in a bowl, yet it has quite a lot of people cycling there. Admittedly Bristol have done well with a few flattish routes, but Bradford's flattish routes seem to run North-South and the major roads have some of the flattest whereas I'm guessing the primary desire line is East towards Leeds...

I don't think Bradford (central) has any flatish routes at all, I live in the Aire Valley, north of Bradford and that (W-E) is very busy with cyclists, as is the canal.

 

[classic33]

Bristol is extremely hilly and The Centre sits in a bowl, yet it has quite a lot of people cycling there. Admittedly Bristol have done well with a few flattish routes, but Bradford's flattish routes seem to run North-South and the major roads have some of the flattest whereas I'm guessing the primary desire line is East towards Leeds...

Coming to & from Bingley/Shipley is about the flattest route I can think of. Other than that its nearly all uphill out of Bradford. The road to Queensbury has a bit of a slope on it though.

 

[MarkF]

Coming to & from Bingley/Shipley is about the flattest route I can think of. Other than that its nearly all uphill out of Bradford. The road to Queensbury has a bit of a slope on it though.

Yes, that's the bit I use into Bradford, Canal Road.

 

[classic33]

Yes, that's the bit I use into Bradford, Canal Road.

The "Low Route' & not the "High Route"!

 

[PMarkey]

The road to Queensbury has a bit of a slope on it though.

Nice easy run into both Halifax and Bradford though

Paul

 

[classic33]

Nice easy run into both Halifax and Bradford though

Paul

Getting back as easy?

 

[NorthernDave]

Just a tuppennyworth - that's the "glass half empty" pov?

The "glass-half-full" - it's far better than I expected. Some good work, retrofitting segregation into some very unforgiving situations. I've been riding bits of the same stretch for weeks now. It is "Pootlers' Way", slow - and damned good for lazy, leisurely cycling. If my kids were still young enough, I'd happily use it with them. Or do my shopping trips on it. So far, the raised cushion and Give Way signage across junctions has worked well for me - but that may be down to drivers being confused; could well be different once they're used to it.

For the commute
- 25mph+ downhill? That's what the road is for!
- >10mph and the granny gear hill climbs? I'm very glad of the CSH.

For the budget, we were never going to get the complete realignment of York Road. Not even of the Melbourne and Barwick roundabouts.

Sorry if my earlier post came across as overly negative, but it's incredibly frustrating to see what should be a world class piece of infrastructure beset by such a series of poor planning, poor layout and perhaps worst of all, poor finishing. I'd also politely suggest that 25 mph downhill would be easily achievable to virtually anyone using the CSH simply by freewheeling on long sections of the route, so that will be quite commonplace and the layout / surface quality should reflect that.

Obviously a segregated cycleway on a key arterial route is a good thing, but it could have been so much better with a little though. The real problems lie a decade or more ago though, when LCC and Metro were persuaded to to install a hugely expensive guided busway down much of York Road, where the tram / monorail / maglev should have gone. This is now only used by one of the four bus companies that operate on the route, with the rest of the buses using the ordinary carriageway. This means that space that could have been given up to a proper integrated transport solution for all road users simply isn't there any more.

That said, there are more direct and dare I say easier to cycle routes from Leeds city centre out to the east - a more sensible solution for anyone heading outbound from (say) the Selby Rd junction would be to go along the Wykebeck Valley Cycleway and then up South Parkway, where there is currently ample room to put in a fully segregated cycleway before the redevelopment of the area gets underway.
Similarly from Foundry Lane, the route could have moved away from York Rd completely and crossed the playing fields to rejoin the existing route at Stocks Approach - a shorter route, with a lesser gradient and fully away from traffic and pollution.

My final bugbear (for now) is the section up past Ebor Gardens, which (again) isn't wide enough for two bikes to safely pass in many places and thanks to ridiculous repositioning of the bus stops AFTER the CSH work, means that cyclists will be forced to squeeze between passengers queuing at bus stops on their way up the hill.

In many ways it's a typical Leeds City Council outcome - a basically good idea, poorly executed.