FNRttC The Fridays Tour 2016

[frank9755]

I'd go for Netherlands or Brittany. My thoughts:

Bordeaux to Med: It sounds like an awful lot of trouble to go somewhere a bit average! Riding alongside a canal is ok for a few hours, but after a while, it gets a bit same-y. If I was doing that amount of travelling, I'd like to go somewhere a little bit more special. There are certainly far nicer parts of France.

Berlin: I like rides to a destination but I voted against this one last year (and suggested the Netherlands as an alternative), and the reasons still apply. Germany is a beautiful country, with friendly people. There are some wonderful tours to be done there, but this isn't one of them. The distances are just a bit too long for comfort. And imagine if we'd done it this year and had a week of beating into a headwind. That could happen again! Doing a good tour in Germany would mean flying. For a one-way trip from Hoek, I'd go for somewhere like Strasbourg, which is a bit closer than Berlin, has lots of interest, and would give a very varied and interesting route (Maastricht, the Ardennes, Luxembourg and a bit of the Vosges).

Brittany / Normandy: We all know that cycling in France is great. I don't know about the route to Caen but I once did a tour from Roscoff around Finisterre - the very end bit - and I'd recommend that. The highlight is the small towns that you go through, which are very French, but with a Breton twist (enclosed parishes, with church + charnal house and other amenities in a little walled compound), and very pretty and friendly - with excellent food. Also it's the right size - c.40-50 miles per day - and it's not very hilly. As a consequence, the countryside is pleasant rather than dramatic, but there are lots of sea views (and the best moules frites I've ever had). The roads are very quiet. It seemed as if people didn't bother to lock their doors when they went out. At the very fin of the terre, it get's a bit strange - as such end of the line places often do - but in a nice way.

Netherlands (+Belgium, Luxembourg, adjacent bits of Germany): There are certainly loads more tours to be done here. I'd like to go along the Ijsel, to Maastricht, up the coast towards Texel, to Edam, up towards Groeningen. That's probably enough for three tours. There's no shortage of cycle routes. This year's tour was great but, if there was one thing I'd suggest, it would be taking in more of the small cities (eg Delft, Gouda, Leiden, Haarlem, Edam, Hoorn, Zwolle, Deventer) as, for me, they are the real highlight of the country. I can understand why we didn't do that this time as navigating through cities with a group is generally a pain, but the Netherlands is different. These places are designed to be cycled into and out of. When Titus and I ended up staying in the wrong place, we went through Haarlem (which is stunning) and it hardly slowed us down. Distances could always be trimmed slightly - but it would be worth it.

So my order of preference would be:
1. Netherlands
2. Brittany
3. Berlin
4. Bordeaux

 

[frank9755]

OK. So, if not Berlin, there has to be an alternative iconic destination in northern Germany that is slightly more attainable.

Hamburg.
Or other Hanseatic ports, Lubeck, etc. They may have got a bit wrecked in the war, though. And I/m not sure it would be a great ride over, either. We could follow the N Sea route. I think mmmmartin has done that

 

[mmmmartin]

Does European Bike Express go to any of starts or destinations?

It's covered in the beautifully-crafted and much-thought about preamble that you read before posting:

• the European Bike Express does not run to Bordeaux in September BUT this year it did a "Narbonne pick-up" heading north at the end of the season so that may be an option. This will depend on the date of the tour.

 

[EltonFrog]

It's covered in the beautifully-crafted and much-thought about preamble that you read before posting:

• the European Bike Express does not run to Bordeaux in September BUT this year it did a "Narbonne pick-up" heading north at the end of the season so that may be an option. This will depend on the date of the tour.

Sorry, I skimmed read it and missed that bit.

 

[StuAff]

Their website is wrong! Or at least it was when I went over in August. You need to phone Eurodispatch to make the booking, and they do take bikes without any packing or disassembling.

+1. £25 a leg to/from Paris, Brussels or Lille. Planning to use it next May. Peeps on here have used it without issues.

 

[StuAff]

Further thoughts:
Frank's arguments seem pretty strong to me. So I've changed my mind, Low Countries (not just Netherlands!) wins out for me. I'll go with his order of preference on the others- but I still like all of them
Purely out of self-interest, I would prefer at least the option of using a non-folding bike. Chutney proved a most excellent touring machine on my solo trip to Belgium, but the marginal gains from not having a hinge, a touch lighter weight, and having disc brakes, etc would be somewhat handy on the trip, if complicating getting to and from it (possibly, depending on destination).
All this is moot of course if I don't get the 'right' leave....I might well know what I've got this month.

 

[Andrew Br]

Just come out with it Stu: you want to take your new bike.

 

[StuAff]

Just come out with it Stu: you want to take your new bike.

Do I? Are you sure?

 

[StuAff]

An idea occurs. I love the idea of Berlin but do appreciate that the distance might be prohibitive and the logistics of getting back more so. What about a loop, starting and ending at Hook, into Germany and back? No need for vans, cars, aeroplanes, Trans-Euro Express, or the dreaded European Bike Express.

Like that idea.....

 

[ianmac62]

I've voted for "If The Fridays are going, sign me up!" Like Adam, I need to put my thinking cap on before I can make constructive comments.

 

[StuAff]

Like that idea.....

Further to the above....(shamelessly aimed at the football Fridays)

 

[mmmmartin]

Another idea. A German removals business might be quite happy to transport a couple of dozen bikes back to Hook in an otherwise idle pantechnicon.

Indeed, and @redfalo has asked on German cycling forums for advice on local friendly "man and van" operations that might help. A quick look at the established, big, freight operations such as DHL shows they are set up for a continuous supply chain for, perhaps, a florist or widget maker that wants one lorry shifted every night, or day or week rather than a one-off. We were hoping for a man and van with a Transit, and no doubt such things exist and if Berlin (or similar) is the option we might even find one. Alas so far without success.
One answer might be to hire three minibuses in Berlin at about £250 each for one day, with each carrying seven riders and their (dismantled) bikes, and drive to the Hook and drop the riders and bikes then return it to Rotterdam where we could drop off the van fleet. On top of the van hire cost there would be another driver on the insurance, fuel, tolls, insurance etc. These things have an annoying habit of doubling the basic cost of the hire.
And we'd need six Fridays capable of driving a loaded minibus full of people and bikes across north Germany after a week of riding 120k every day, possibly into an icy headwind: not impossible but it's a big ask when you thought you were just signing up for a ride with your mates and find you're responsible for the lives of six others. It's a seven-hour drive, plus stops and 450 miles. Passengers have an entire day in a minibus, crammed in with seven dismantled bikes. We could pick up the minibuses the day before and break the journey at a motorway hotel overnight.
So this can be done. It's not easy. If it was, everyone would do it. But this is The Fridays: if the overwhelming weight of opinion and enthusiasm is for Berlin, it will be Berlin. But as yet we're not sure how to get back.

 

[StuAff]

Indeed, and @redfalo has asked on German cycling forums for advice on local friendly "man and van" operations that might help. A quick look at the established, big, freight operations such as DHL shows they are set up for a continuous supply chain for, perhaps, a florist or widget maker that wants one lorry shifted every night, or day or week rather than a one-off. We were hoping for a man and van with a Transit, and no doubt such things exist and if Berlin (or similar) is the option we might even find one. Alas so far without success.
One answer might be to hire three minibuses in Berlin at about £250 each for one day, with each carrying seven riders and their (dismantled) bikes, and drive to the Hook and drop the riders and bikes then return it to Rotterdam where we could drop off the van fleet. On top of the van hire cost there would be another driver on the insurance, fuel, tolls, insurance etc. These things have an annoying habit of doubling the basic cost of the hire.
And we'd need six Fridays capable of driving a loaded minibus full of people and bikes across north Germany after a week of riding 120k every day, possibly into an icy headwind: not impossible but it's a big ask when you thought you were just signing up for a ride with your mates and find you're responsible for the lives of six others. It's a seven-hour drive, plus stops and 450 miles. Passengers have an entire day in a minibus, crammed in with seven dismantled bikes. We could pick up the minibuses the day before and break the journey at a motorway hotel overnight.
So this can be done. It's not easy. If it was, everyone would do it. But this is The Fridays: if the overwhelming weight of opinion and enthusiasm is for Berlin, it will be Berlin. But as yet we're not sure how to get back.

Whether Berlin's a start or end point, it won't be easy by any means.

 

[frank9755]

Indeed, and @redfalo has asked on German cycling forums for advice on local friendly "man and van" operations that might help. A quick look at the established, big, freight operations such as DHL shows they are set up for a continuous supply chain for, perhaps, a florist or widget maker that wants one lorry shifted every night, or day or week rather than a one-off. We were hoping for a man and van with a Transit, and no doubt such things exist and if Berlin (or similar) is the option we might even find one. Alas so far without success.

This kind of movement would either be removals companies (eg Shore Porters, www.shoreporters.com) or there are brokers who fill otherwise empty backhaul. There is one site called www.mtvan.com and another called www.uship.com. The broker services tend to be more expensive if you don't have much date flexibility. I've not tried to price it ('cos I don't think it's a great idea!) but I wouldn't expect it to be cheap...

 

[Flying Dodo]

Erm, this all seems ridiculously overcomplicated to me. Surely there are other options for loops from Hoek that don't involve all this travelling in cars/vans/minibuses/buses/trains before we even start cycling? (Two days in cars? Sorry but no thanks.) If we can cycle from Hoek into Germany and back, why not do that and keep it simple? Berlin as a destination doesn't anywhere near outweigh the travel faffing for me especially when, as Frank says, there's so much of the Netherlands that we haven't seen yet.

I'd agree. All the other options just seem so much hassle with long, tiring options to get to the start/end.