It and the follow ups are very good, looking at the action of perverse incentives: eg bounty on dead cobras in Delhi, resulted in increase in Cobras as folks bred them to collect the bounty.....
A sad state of affairs
- Thread starter Psycolist
- Start date
Page may contain affiliate links. Please see terms for details.
It and the follow ups are very good, looking at the action of perverse incentives: eg bounty on dead cobras in Delhi, resulted in increase in Cobras as folks bred them to collect the bounty.....
ColinJ
Puzzle game procrastinator!
- Location
- Todmorden - Yorks/Lancs border
Or turning the heating up with the windows open in NI to benefit from a fuel subsidy!
Or turning the heating up with the windows open in NI to benefit from a fuel subsidy!
Exactly!
I think I read that the mayor at that time, who took the plaudits for the "broken window" policy, got lucky. It was something to do with poor mothers a decade or so earlier being able to access abortions. Thus, crime rates fell, because no-hope kids were not born to later become criminals.
steveindenmark
Legendary Member
I do not know the ins and outs of police pensions. I was retired out of the police at the grand old age of 33 on medical grounds following a RTA which broke both of my arms and right leg. I had commuted my 12 years army pension contributions and had 6 years in the police. I have been paid a good pension each month since I left the force and will get it until I die. The rate it increases constantly surprises me. If I could turn allmy other pensions over to the police, I would. They certainly know how to use your money.
It is not surprising that officers who retire after their full service can live comfortably.
The police pension scheme is unfunded. There is no investmet pot. Your pension is paid from a combination on current members' contributions, employers contributions and general taxation.
Unfortunately this is what annoys many people not on police pensions, they are too good, or were. Correct me if I am wrong but does not £1 in every £7 the police get go on pensions.
steveindenmark
Legendary Member
As I said I do not know the ins and outs of police pensions, but I am well looked after. If it annoys people who re not policemen, maybe they should have signed up.
So they should be. On a day to day basis, for years. They have some bloody awful things to deal with. A policemans best defence is black humour.
So they should be. On a day to day basis, for years. They have some bloody awful things to deal with. A policemans best defence is black humour.
I think that teachers pensions are funded the same way.
I suppose no other employment has bloody awful things to deal with then. As for joining up, is there the space or the money for 40,000,0000 police.
Drago
Legendary Member
- Location
- Suburban Poshshire
Indeed. If you or I run a triangle shaped Ponzi scheme, using new members subscriptions to make previous members rich, we'd be arrested. Yet that's exactly what the Government does.
I make no apologies for my police pension either. It was hardly a freebie, having shovelled a full 15% of my salary into my pension since I joined the Army. How many people save even half that, yet then complain their pension isn't enough? For me it's compensation for nearly 30 years of military and police, crap pay, poor conditions, being shot at (once in the army, once in the police), being blown up (once in the army), being stabbed, being assaulted multiple times, including breaking an elbow which required 2 lots of surgery and a year of recuperation (and it'll still never be right), dire hours and mediocre pay. I'm not complaining, I made my choice, gritted my teeth and did my duty, and my sole consolation for all that sacrifice is a pension.
If I didn't like if I could have gone on the boats in the Indian Ocean doing anti piracy work for £200k, or BG work for a similar amount, and worked 3 or 4 years and retired. Or I could have used my degrees to probably push me into 6 figures (was offered £80k to work for Hughes first time I speculatively applied) so having foregone such financial opportunities such as those to serve my country I'm quite comfortable taking my pension by way of some small compensation, even if that pension was hardly a freebie and cost me a lot of money over the years.
If it were not for that there would have been no incentive to devote the best part of my working life to public service. Might have done a few years in each, but there would have been no reason to stay long term, gain experience, learn skills and specialisations for which I didn't get paid any more. It takes about 5 years to become a fully rounded and competent front line copper, and without the pension there is no reason to stay beyond that. Indeed, the modern pension is pretty average and as a result the incentive is no longer there for most officers, so turnover is on the increase and the average length of service that the average officer now holds is a little over 6 years, barely dry behind the ears, and the Government is slowly getting the police service it deserves as a consequence. Good luck to them.
I make no apologies for my police pension either. It was hardly a freebie, having shovelled a full 15% of my salary into my pension since I joined the Army. How many people save even half that, yet then complain their pension isn't enough? For me it's compensation for nearly 30 years of military and police, crap pay, poor conditions, being shot at (once in the army, once in the police), being blown up (once in the army), being stabbed, being assaulted multiple times, including breaking an elbow which required 2 lots of surgery and a year of recuperation (and it'll still never be right), dire hours and mediocre pay. I'm not complaining, I made my choice, gritted my teeth and did my duty, and my sole consolation for all that sacrifice is a pension.
If I didn't like if I could have gone on the boats in the Indian Ocean doing anti piracy work for £200k, or BG work for a similar amount, and worked 3 or 4 years and retired. Or I could have used my degrees to probably push me into 6 figures (was offered £80k to work for Hughes first time I speculatively applied) so having foregone such financial opportunities such as those to serve my country I'm quite comfortable taking my pension by way of some small compensation, even if that pension was hardly a freebie and cost me a lot of money over the years.
If it were not for that there would have been no incentive to devote the best part of my working life to public service. Might have done a few years in each, but there would have been no reason to stay long term, gain experience, learn skills and specialisations for which I didn't get paid any more. It takes about 5 years to become a fully rounded and competent front line copper, and without the pension there is no reason to stay beyond that. Indeed, the modern pension is pretty average and as a result the incentive is no longer there for most officers, so turnover is on the increase and the average length of service that the average officer now holds is a little over 6 years, barely dry behind the ears, and the Government is slowly getting the police service it deserves as a consequence. Good luck to them.
Last edited:
Drago as you know I have written before that I think those who were promised it should get it, however I do think a lot of public sector pensions were and some still are over generous with tax payers money. Just my personal opinion of course and I am sure many who do not even get those pensions will disagree with me.
You and me, that is who.
I think most of the police are on a generous package right now, if we put more tax money into the police what do you think would happen? would we get more back out on the streets, would they just pay higher wages to the same staff.
Drago
Legendary Member
- Location
- Suburban Poshshire
Certainly there will be people who've done nothing more than shuffle paper, chair meetings, contributed little to the grand scheme, and endured nothing more dangerous than a paper cut, so there are doubtless individual cases where those receiving it aren't truly worthy.
And yeah, we're all getting the police service the Government thinks we deserve, leaving them free to door cyclists without fear of reprisal.
I explained in my previous post what alternative employment was - and still is - open to me, and the salaries they command, so unless you're a very senior officer one can hardly describe the pay as 'generous'. Most of the motor trade techs I know - my kid Brother was one - earn more on bonus for less working hours than a 6 year PC. Indeed, my Bro recently took a job at a Coca Cola warehouse in MK that pays as much as a Sergeant on max service...
As for getting more 'back out on the streets', do you think they have cupboards full of officers sat there doing nothing. As of when I left a few months ago the only folk not out and about were specialist posts, such as child protection etc, very senior scrambled egg, and those injured expected to return to full duties at some point. This idea that there are rooms full of bobbies wearing slippers and eating biscuits hasn't been true in my first hand experience once the last century. Most back office functions are being done by civilian staff, but as they're being made redundant to meet the tightening budget pressures then more and more bobbies will be pulled off the streets to back fill these roles, which don't simply go away. When over 90% of your operating costs is staff, all this guff the government trots out about streamlining, and smarter working are rubbish - the're no meaningful meat left to trim, the only savings that can be made are staff.
Last edited:
