"Airnimals" look straight out of scrapheap challenge

Discussion in 'Tandem and Other Bikes' started by bonj2, 27 Jul 2007.

  1. bonj2

    bonj2 Guest

    continued from

    The same tired old mantras "you make yourself look an idiot", "you're prejudiced", "you're irrational" - change the record.

    I've asked questions which still haven't been answered, namely (1) surely the distance the handlebars stick out from the stem, and the length the steerer tube extends above the headset causes a much higher than normal forward and downwards moment about the headset, putting much higher bending stress on the steerer tube, and (2) if they're any good why aren't they more popular?
  2. OP

    bonj2 Guest

    Yeah yeah yeah, I get the gist of it - somebody's done scientific research to prove using physics that smaller wheels theoretically have advantages.
    But please answer me the question of why bikes in the tour de france don't have casters then?
    Why aren't 22" wheels more popular on road bikes, if they're that good?
    You can link to all the equations in the world if you want, but it still doesn't make sense if no-one uses it! There must be some reason why there's a difference between theory and practice.
  3. OP

    bonj2 Guest

    OK. It will bend the steerer tube fractionally, but under normal riding won't be enough to break it. But surely it's better not to have that bending stress if you can avoid it. I would imagine the slight bending will cause the headset bearings to wear fractionally faster.
    WHY, though?!
    And under what grounds are they 'very good'?
  4. Yorkshireman

    Yorkshireman New Member

    In all good faith I posted a link to a site that deals exclusively with the machine in question, and the man who designs and builds them. I also posted extracts from the site that covered some of the areas that you appear to be lacking information/knowledge in. It's obvious (to me anyway) that you have no real interest in this subject other than to try to take the piss from those of us who are prepared to take you seriously, so I won't waste any more of my time. I'll leave you with a short resume of Dr Alex Moulton's work and qualifications :-

    Dr Alex Moulton CBE RDI FEng
    Dr Moulton is an outstanding British Engineer whose whole professional life has been devoted to research, development, design and manufacture of advanced innovative products for sale in world markets.
    His successful designs, which have been commercially exploited in world-wide markets including Japan, Germany, Switzerland, the USA and the UK include:

    Rubber Suspension for Mini car
    Hydrolastic Suspension for BL110 car
    Revolutionary Moulton Bicycle
    Moulton Safety Coach
    hydragas Suspension for Allegro and Princess cars
    The Alex Moulton Bicycle
    hydragas Suspension for Rover Metro
    (Awarded Royal Academy of Engineering MacRobert Award)
    The Moulton APB Bicycle

    Dr Moulton's Achievements have received recognition in many ways:
    The Diploma di Medagli d'Oro, Milan
    Queen's Award for Technical Innovation
    Honorary Doctorate, Royal college of Art
    Elected to the Faculty of Royal Designers for Industry
    Honorary DSc, University of Bath
    Elected a Fellow of The Royal Academy of Engineering
    (Subsequently Vice President 1985-88)
    Elected Master of the Faculty of Royal Designers for Industry
    Hon DSc, Cranfield University 1976

    Dr Moulton has had, and continues to exert a major influence on British engineering design technique.
  5. OP

    bonj2 Guest

    Great. The only new information there is that that website was written by the designer of that bike, about that particular bike. Well he would claim it's the best thing since sliced bread, wouldn't he - if he's designed it.

    Why aren't they more popular then, if they're that good? Post more statistics if you like - I'll only keep asking the same question, so you might aswell at least try to answer it.
  6. Yorkshireman

    Yorkshireman New Member

    I'll admit to anyone that I'm not the sharpest knife in the box, but even at my fairly advanced age I'm still eager to learn. I believe I have learned something to-day ... I thought that you played the fool/cretin for a laugh ... now I realise that you're not playing ....:thumbsup:
  7. OP

    bonj2 Guest

    So you can't answer the question - so we're all agreed then. They're crap.
    But oh no! Hang on! There's scientific evidence that smaller wheels are better than larger ones! Who can argue with scientific evidence? So, there can only be one explanation - the people who ride bikes with small wheels must be the ENGLIGHTENED ONES!
  8. Yorkshireman

    Yorkshireman New Member

    If you're asking me Bonj ... Which question were you directing at me? Regarding smaller V larger wheels, it's horses for courses. Lots of people are able to argue with scientific evidence (providing that they look at it). The people who ride bikes with small wheels are the people who choose to ride them for a particular reason/purpose ... Next.
    And where did you go just now ... sneaking off for warm milk and biccies ... without offering em round :thumbsup:
  9. OP

    bonj2 Guest

    Why smaller wheels aren't more popular on non-folding bikes if they're that good.
  10. Yorkshireman

    Yorkshireman New Member

    Haven't a clue Bonj ... It's not a question I have had reason/interest to research. I don't know why Marmite isn't more popular than it is either. :thumbsup:
  11. OP

    bonj2 Guest

    Marmite is quite popular. Popular enough to be sold in pretty much every supermarket, spar and corner shop.
  12. Yorkshireman

    Yorkshireman New Member

    Right Bonj, just been shopping (on the small wheeled non-folding shopper), and yes I did see Marmite on the shelf. I asked one of the store supervisors (the lengths I go to to educate the younger generation) what the turnover was like for that particular delicacy ... She replied "Very, very slow ... Don't Know why we stock it, but it's very long dated". Whilst at the supermarket I checked the bike racks ... Out of 30 bikes that I saw 10 were 'small' wheelers' of varying types. On the way back home I called in at the LBS and guess what ... they had 4 'small' wheelers on the shop floor display, and are able and prepared to order others if required. Now whether these observations/results are peculiar to my area or not I don't know, neither do I know if they are significant in any way nor do I rally care.:thumbsup:
  13. Flying_Monkey

    Flying_Monkey Toll Collector on the Road to Nowhere

    Yes, but only some time after wading in with an opinion that was based almost entirely on ignorance (you didn't know what the bike was, why it was made the way it was etc.). In other words you tried to pretend you had some rational basis for what was basis for what amounted to nothing more than laughing and pointing.

    Please do us a favour, and go do some of your own research on folding bikes, and on the Airnimal. It's no particular fun discussing with someone who is not interested in learning.

    And, BTW, small-wheeled bikes are specifically banned by the UCI in road cycling events... something you could also easily look up yourself.
  14. Yorkshireman

    Yorkshireman New Member

    Bonj isn't up for discussion FM. His favourite game is Poking the Cat with a pointy stick and see if it spits/bites/scratches (if he realises that some of us might be having more fun than he is ... :thumbsup:).
  15. ufkacbln

    ufkacbln Guest

    I tour with an Airnimal because it carries full panniers, and I can clear my heels.

    It is a proven design, and an adaptation of a geometry which goes back as far as the 1920s with the straight tube. It is fast, comfortable and safe with common sense.

    By that I mean if set up properly - in the same way as leaving the nuts on a car wheel undone is unsafe. The QR and pivot on the seat stem is solid and does not move or flex. The same applies to the bottom bracket.

    Suspension is not really an advantage at this level as it does not compress that much, but does smooth out rough surfaces on 25mm tyres at 100 psi!

    For folding - typically I look at the trains. Sensible companies like SCotrail and Virgin no problem. Those with stupid policies and poor allowance for space - a minute to fold and a minute to unfold is shorter than the time taken to argue with the train staff!
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