ALU- Frames - How long...

[mickle]

They are also butting the weld areas much more substantially nowadays to increase the thickness around the weld. One thing of note is also whether the finished frames are sent off for post welding heat treatment as failure to do this will knock off up to 40% of the post extruded/aged strength

Are they really? When did they start doing this please?

Depends entirely on the material, 6061 needs to be heat treated to T6, 7000 doesn't. Many makers use 7000 precisely because dispensing with the heat treating process reduces production costs. 7000 frames are a bit heavier, cheaper, but no less strong than 6061.

 

[Fab Foodie]

Lastpubrunner, much though I'm a fan of Steel ( I own a 1950 531 Holdsworth, an early 80's 531 mtb and am restoring an early 90's 531st tourer), I can tell you that one of the issues with steel is simply cost. Try buying a decent steel bike under £800, there's little choice. Try finding an Alu or Alu/Carbon road-bike for £800 or less and there are zillions to choose from and most will be nice to ride.
Steel's not everything however, my Nivachrome tubed Omega was far harsher to ride than my 2004 Alu giant.
The frame material is one issue, how it's put together is another.

 

[Mr Pig]

If you could open your mind for long enough to take a spin on a cycle made from a material which doesn't date from the 1930s you might learn something.

Maybe he'd learn than he doesn't like Aluminium frames?

I agree with him that most buyers are swayed by the desire for the latest thing, despite often having no idea what difference it will make to them in the real world. Even cheapo bikes have disk brakes these days despite the fact that these brakes are probably going to give more grief and have no real advantage for them. Suspension forks on bikes costing a hundred pounds which do nothing but add weight and instability.

The desire to have the latest thing clearly 'is' one of the reasons why people buy one product over another, and hence why manufactures make them.

I 'opened my mind' long enough to try a steel bike against a Rockhopper yesterday and I bought the steel one! Is your definition of a closed mind one that doesn't agree with yours?

 

[mickle]

For your information I own six bikes, five of which are steel.
I don't disagree with much of your post, in fact I designed the Kona Smoke as an antidote to the hordes of full suspension framed monsters on the market. What I object to is the implication that anyone who rides a posh bike made of exotic materials is only doing so because they have been told that that is what they need and that they are a fashion victim.

 

[Mr Pig]

What I object to is the implication that anyone who rides a posh bike made of exotic materials is only doing so because they have been told that that is what they need

Well, I think a lot of them are.

I'm into Hi-Fi and for many years, over twenty, I used amplifiers made by a company called Naim Audio. Naim advertise heavily in the British Hi-Fi press, receive great support from British reviewers, have a very strong and loyal dealer network. To be honest they have an ultra-slick propaganda machine and know how to use it. In my teens I had really decided I wanted a Naim amp before I'd even heard one! When I had enough money I walked into the shop with my mind already made up. I heard what I wanted to hear.

Many years later I no longer have any naim products in my system, and am far happier with it, but I still know lots of people who blindly follow the herd. This 'sheep' mentality is present in every walk of life. We have a Sony Trinitron TV that we bought used from someone locally. The guy we bought it from said:

"I don't really get it. The LCD TV we've bought is the same screen size as the Trinitron, the picture isn't as good and because it sits in the corner dosn't even take up much less space. She (the wife) just wanted one!"

I see this every day. Don't you?

 

[mickle]

With all due respect you are missing the point.