Beware 09 numbers! Or 'Is Ofcom more use than tits on a boar hog?'

Page may contain affiliate links. Please see terms for details.

swee'pea99

Squire
Just read an article in Guardian Money about so-called 'Information, connection and/or signposting services (ICSS)' (their official name). A variant of premium rate lines, what these ones do is connect you to, eg, Amazon's 0800 line, then charge you anything up to £3 a minute for the duration of your call.

That's it. That's all they do!

"Amazon is just the tip of a huge consumer iceberg. A quick trawl of other “connection services” suggests there are many out there offering to put people through to a vast range of household names, including Marks & Spencer, Tesco, John Lewis, npower, O2, BT, Sky, Argos, Asda, BA, Royal Mail, HMRC, the DVLA, TV Licensing and even the Dartford Crossing."

And they are allowed to do it.

How is this legal? This is theft. This is outright, clear, deliberate, shameless thievery, which doubtless thrives at the expense of the elderly, the young, the none-too-bright - in short, the vulnerable.

What really sticks in my craw is that it's yet another example of 'The Establishment' - by which I mean not just Government/Whitehall, but the whole cabal of rich, powerful people - brazenly turning a blind eye to - worse, directly colluding in and benefiting from - utterly immoral behaviour. Because you can be sure that this thrives because BT takes a good slice of that £3/min, and because the likes of OfCom go along with it.

This could be made illegal. It should be made illegal. But it won't be made illegal, because rich and powerful people have their noses in the trough. And it's mostly the poor and inarticulate who get fleeced. It's a disgrace.

So, warn your elderly relatives, warn your teens - any number beginning with 09 is the number of a thief, working with the their co-thieves, BT, and their thieves' protectors - the Government; and that number will steal their money faster than you can say 'what a bunch of lying, thieving, conniving scum'.

Rant over.
 

Beebo

Firm and Fruity
Location
Hexleybeef
It is a third party scam, nothing to do with the actual supplier.

It is a bit like 118118 charging similar sums to connect calls.
 

Paulus

Started young, and still going.
Location
Barnet,
It has been that way for many years since the privatisation of the telecommunications companies. 118 118 for example costs £3.49 to put you through to a number, plus £3.49 per minute up to a maximum of 60 mins. Plus your access charge from your provider. A call to them can be very costly.
 

Drago

Legendary Member
Ofcom are sheet. All they care about is the money coming in by auctioning off the spectrum. Anything else they do grudgingly at best, or not at all at worst.

Radio amateurs call them OFCUM.
 

Bobby Mhor

Legendary Member
Location
Behind You
Ofcom are sheet. All they care about is the money coming in by auctioning off the spectrum. Anything else they do grudgingly at best, or not at all at worst.

Radio amateurs call them OFCUM.
^_^
I just was in touch with them yesterday about my call, pretty efficient since the last time when they issued me a G version of my call.
 

mjr

Comfy armchair to one person & a plank to the next
How is this legal? This is theft. This is outright, clear, deliberate, shameless thievery, which doubtless thrives at the expense of the elderly, the young, the none-too-bright - in short, the vulnerable.
That's telecoms for you. Unless they've clamped down, there are also some stonking high non-mobile rate numbers among the 070 codes too, which people mistake for mobiles and get a nasty surprise when it's not included in their bundled minutes. A few are legitimate things like on-call services (pagers and hunts and so on), but there are some which basically operate like lower-priced premium rate revenue services - a throwback to the days where you'd get a few pence a minute credit from some operators for accepting calls on an 0870 (national rate) number instead of an 01 or 084.

https://www.ofcom.org.uk/phones-tel...illing/how-much-does-a-phone-call-really-cost gives the maximums and minimums but it seems pretty difficult to see exactly how much any 070, 084 or 09 number will really cost to call. So ofcom are slightly more use than tits on a boar hog, but only slightly. :sad:
 

Brains

Legendary Member
Location
Greenwich
Some years ago I was living in a shared flat, we had a real problem with phone bills, so we installed a pub type phone where you paid with coins per call.
(As we held the key when the bill came in it used to make enough money to pay for a round for everyone once a quarter, but I digress).
I found out that there is zero cost if you call the premium numbers from a phone box.
I has new PC which took a lot of mucking about in those days to get up and running.
I spend something like three or four hours on the phone to the Philippine call centre over a couple of days getting every wrinkle ironed out.
Once it was all done I let them know they had done it all for free.
They were unimpressed :smile:

Some years later I had a similar situation with a Laptop, so down to the pub I went, and (by arrangement) spent a fun afternoon sorting out that one as well !
 

Ian016

Member
May I congratulate the OP on a great rant. I have just popped in to say that yesterday (26 July 2018) Ofcom published a consultation that is designed to help reign in this blatant scam.

ICSS are already subject to stringent regulation - but currently only when operating on 087 or 09 numbers. Those operating on 084 numbers are unregulated. It willl come as no surprise to learn that most ICSS operate on 084 numbers.

Ofcom proposes extending the CPRS (Controlled Premium Rate Services) regulations to cover all ICSS, irrespective of price point or prefix used.

The consultation can be found at
https://www.ofcom.org.uk/consultati...gory-2/review-premium-rate-services-condition

The consultation is open for another eight weeks.

Once Ofcom's measures are in place, additional work is expected from PSA (Phone-paid Services Authority) to further tighten the Special Conditions that apply to ICSS.


Another poster provided a useful warning about personal numbers starting 070 and the eye-watering call charges these can attract - and hence their usefulness to a wide variety of scammers and low-lifes. Their similarity with mobile numbers makes the situation even more awkward.

Ofcom has recently published a consultation proposing to place a cap on termination charges, setting them at the same level as for calls to mobile numbers. Such a cap will allow phone providers to include calls to 070 numbers within inclusive allowances or otherwise charge these calls at the same rate as calling a mobile number.

The consultation can be found at
https://www.ofcom.org.uk/consultations-and-statements/category-1/review-070-number-range

The consultation closed a few months ago and Ofcom's Final Statement is awaited in the next few months.


Calling directory enquiries (DQ) numbers starting 118 can be very expensive. When call charges for calls to 08, 09 and 118 numbers were reformed in July 2015, Ofcom wanted to place a cap on the charges for calling 118 numbers. The industry successfully argued against such a cap.

Since then, those call charges have soared. The most expensive DQ provider currently levies a Service Charge of £15.98 per call, plus £7.98 per minute after the first 60 seconds (plus your phone provider's Access Charge).

Ofcom has recently published a consultation proposing to cap the Service Charge at £3.10 per 90 seconds of a call thereby setting the rates back to 2015 levels. Ofcom has taken all of the arguments advanced by DQ providers in their responses to the earlier 2013 consultation and thrown them back in their faces.

The consultation can be found at
https://www.ofcom.org.uk/consultations-and-statements/category-1/directory-enquiries-118-review

The consultation opened six weeks ago and will be open for another four weeks.


Disclaimer. I am part of a campaign group that persuaded Ofcom to investigate these telecoms issues and take action to ensure fairness. We have further issues to raise.
 
Last edited:

Serge

Über Member
Location
Nuneaton
May I congratulate the OP on a great rant. I have just popped in to say that yesterday (26 July 2018) Ofcom published a consultation that is designed to help reign in this blatant scam.

ICSS are already subject to stringent regulation - but currently only when operating on 087 or 09 numbers. Those operating on 084 numbers are unregulated. It willl come as no surprise to learn that most ICSS operate on 084 numbers.

Ofcom proposes extending the CPRS (Controlled Premium Rate Services) regulations to cover all ICSS, irrespective of price point or prefix used.

The consultation can be found at
https://www.ofcom.org.uk/consultati...gory-2/review-premium-rate-services-condition

The consultation is open for another eight weeks.

Once Ofcom's measures are in place, additional work is expected from PSA (Phone-paid Services Authority) to further tighten the Special Conditions that apply to ICSS.


Another poster provided a useful warning about personal numbers starting 070 and the eye-watering call charges these can attract - and hence their usefulness to a wide variety of scammers and low-lifes. Their similarity with mobile numbers makes the situation even more awkward.

Ofcom has recently published a consultation proposing to place a cap on termination charges, setting them at the same level as for calls to mobile numbers. Such a cap will allow phone providers to include calls to 070 numbers within inclusive allowances or otherwise charge these calls at the same rate as calling a mobile number.

The consultation can be found at
https://www.ofcom.org.uk/consultations-and-statements/category-1/review-070-number-range

The consultation closed a few months ago and Ofcom's Final Statement is awaited in the next few months.


Calling directory enquiries (DQ) numbers starting 118 can be very expensive. When call charges for calls to 08, 09 and 118 numbers were reformed in July 2015, Ofcom wanted to place a cap on the charges for calling 118 numbers. The industry successfully argued against such a cap.

Since then, those call charges have soared. The most expensive DQ provider currently levies a Service Charge of £15.98 per call, plus £7.98 per minute after the first 60 seconds (plus your phone provider's Access Charge).

Ofcom has recently published a consultation proposing to cap the Service Charge at £3.10 per 90 seconds of a call thereby setting the rates back to 2015 levels. Ofcom has taken all of the arguments advanced by DQ providers in their responses to the earlier 2013 consultation and thrown them back in their faces.

The consultation can be found at
https://www.ofcom.org.uk/consultations-and-statements/category-1/directory-enquiries-118-review

The consultation opened six weeks ago and will be open for another four weeks.


Disclaimer. I am part of a campaign group that persuaded Ofcom to investigate these telecoms issues and take action to ensure fairness. We have further issues to raise.
Nice one, keep up the good work.
 
OP
OP
swee'pea99

swee'pea99

Squire
Yes - well done you & your group.

Gosh, only 18 months and they're already talking about doing something...
 

Ian016

Member
Ofcom consists of people. It has a finite budget, a finite number of staff and there is a finite number of working hours per week. There is an almost infinite number of issues to be fixed. This means they have to be prioritised in terms of risk posed, ease and cost of fixing, and likelihood of success.

Ofcom, like all other public services, moves only when there is clear evidence of harm and there is an obvious way to fix the issue for the result to be successful. This inevitably means that things happen slowly.

The "call connection service" scam was first identified in 2011 or earlier. To begin with, there were only a small number of incidents. The issue was raised with Ofcom in 2014 but there was still little evidence of harm.

The scam has ballooned in the last couple of years leading to overwhelming evidence that action should be taken. Resources were then allocated, evidence gathered (a massive process), solutions evaluated and a consultation published with the details.

In an ideal world, this would have been fixed a couple of years ago, but back then they were dealing with other much more important issues.
 
Last edited:
Top Bottom