Bicycles, life cycle and beyond economic repair.

[Time Waster]

I just wondered if bikes have an anticipated life cycle? Modern alloy bikes that is.

The reason is my partner's mtb is in the bike mechanic's for fettling the gears and he's basically saying it's not worth fixing. It's a foreign brand bought in Eastern Europe and a simple sram geared 26" alloy hardball. Brakes on wrong side for UK spec. It's had 12 years of initially proper mountain biking but later on in those years it was a general do it all bike for commuting, touring and family leisure rides.

It seems it needs a new drive train, rear wheel due to worn brake surface (rim braked) and work on brakes. Not priced up as he said it was worth more than the bike and very rough guess from initial inspection was £250 or more.

Do bikes have a typical life span? You can get 2019 or never hybrids or hardball from specialised, trek and boardman for £250-400 depending on spec. Is it worth spending that for a 12 year old frame? Or would you still do it to keep a bike going? She finds it very comfortable. It's why she's been thinking but not buying a new tourer for 4 years or so.

Any views on whether to keep bikes on the road even if cost is significant?

 

[wafter]

Just like many other manufactured goods, it's a legit argument that items sourced "cheap" when new through exploitation of low-cost labour markets get written off when they require labour at domestic rates.

Add to this the price of parts is high currently, while MTBs will probably have a shorter life due to greater wear and potential for damage due to the way they're used. Also, ally has a finite fatigue life and will eventually crack and fail if used enough (I got maybe 4-5k miles out of my ally Giant OCR before it cracked at the seat tube - although this was probably exacerbated by their cack seatpost-insert design). For this reason (and its position at the lower end of the market) ally will probably devalue faster than more exotic materials, while it probably also has limited long-term appeal to many.

Sadly this is the consumptive world we live in and stuff is becoming increasingly disposible (by design and as a side-effect of financial factors). Of course it's not all about money though - if she likes it and it's served her well it would be a shame to bin it (plus it would be yet more waste and consumption) - why not have a crack at sorting it yourself with some used parts (maybe used wheel, new drivetrain components and brakes as nec.)...?

 

[AndyRM]

I'd say it depends how attached you are to it. There will be a lot of memories there I imagine, and I may be being stupidly sentimental, but it seems a shame to lose those.

The repair estimate seems quite high to me.

 

[presta]

I got maybe 4-5k miles out of my ally Giant OCR before it cracked at the seat tube

That's a third of the mileage I've had out of my Marathon HS368 tyres.

 

[Arrowfoot]

As per OP’s post, the repairs are quite extensive and likely not be cost effective. If repairs cost more than 1/3 the price of new one, best to move on.

Bikes like most things tend to last long if well maintained. However compared to steel, Ti and even carbon, alloy frames have a shorter use by date due to metal fatigue. Steel and Ti can last as it does not have “memory” and flexes so their frames last a long while.

 

[IanSmithCSE]

Good morning,

This sounds to me like your mechanic doesn't want to do the work or is protecting himself.

I can see why, as the bike is of relatively low value he may want to avoid the situation of a few things popping up costing him time and a few spares that were unexpected which could result in argument with you as the bill escalates from an optimistic £150 to the £250 that he has quoted.

In terms of lifespan 12 years for a drive train and rim worn out by braking is fine and if you could replace the parts yourself removing 2-3 hours or £80(£50)-£120(£150) of his labour then the whole situation looks different.

It would seem likely that despite being bought abroad it still came from the same factory in China/Cambodia etc. that it would have come from if it had been bought in the UK so spare parts shouldn't be an issue.

If you repair it yourself you can easily put on a Shimano part to replace an SRAM part or spend a little bit more (say Shimano Tourney/Claris) to replace the very basic chainset that it probably came with, things that a third party may be reluctant to do. I gave you a bike with SRAM and now it has Shimano, that's not acceptable.

I have found that nobody wants to quote on aluminium alloy frame life, but the same is also true of steel and CF, it is always it depends on use, steel does fail, https://www.cyclechat.net/threads/broken-steel-i-guess-i-was-lucky.273776/

Bye

Ian

 

[tyred]

I'd be inclined to repair in most situations.

If you can go down the DIY route you could do it much cheaper but even so, you probably won't buy much better for the 250 estimate and once those parts are replaced they won't be needed for many years.

Your partner finds it comfortable and that means more than anything else.

 

[Time Waster]

Must admit the bike mechanic is about being safe and cautious. He's not like another UK largest bike shop which seems to do exactly what you ask of it. Sort gearing out they'll adjust it but at most replace cables and perhaps chain. Then they'll tell you that you probably need xyz done. This guy tells you you need xyz and that's what I'll do costing this much.

Understandable as he works on recommendations and repeat custom but above all seems to be about doing things 100% right wrt advice and what needs fixing. No idea if he's really good but imho he's talking the talk.

The big issue is he's a bike mechanic and as often likes to play the man with the jargon card. Do not talk down to people, especially women. Above all do not say someone's very faithful bike is nothing special or not worth it in quite the terms he did. Everyone who has been into cycling with intent with a certain bike has emotional attachment that such dismissive attitude grates.

BTW my partner has been quite the adventurous cyclist over the years. Touring in parts of China not many westerners got to, Eastern European countries, south America, etc, etc, etc. Mostly done on local, cheap bikes most in the UK on bike forums dismiss. Then there's bang for your bucks was higher in Eastern Europe where it was bought. £400 in local currency was possibly worth a couple hundred pounds more in the UK. Certainly wasn't bargain basement spec back then.

She's not decided yet. I mean both head and heart sees both options as working. Mind you I think a day trip to Skipton and dave ferguson cycles was mentioned. They sell new and secondhand. A decent bike shop by reputation. Been around for a long time and isn't the glossy frontage of the likes of Chevin cycles. Long way but who knows.

Looking at secondhand right now there's a lot but jeez they're crap! Cheap hydraulic disc brakes because they're a selling point people think they need, obsessed with 1x or 2x. Where is the honest triple and very wide range gears like on her existing bike?

Rim brakes used to work and still do. My recumbent has them and it surprised me the stopping power. My road / gravel bike has avid cable actuated disc brakes, not very good imho. Even my ancient road bike had better brakes with the rim brakes it had until the wheel braking surface wore away and I realised I hadn't checked my pads for too long.

There's simply not the bike for her on the market, namely using your solid, old tech of good rim brakes, triple and 26 inch wheels. Why put a 16 inch or smaller frame in 29er wheels? Even 27.5 is too big imho. Size wheels to the frame size is better i reckon.

 

[wafter]

That's a third of the mileage I've had out of my Marathon HS368 tyres.

I bet the ride's just as harsh though

Yeah, it was pretty disappointing tbh - has put me right off both Giant and ally tbh; legitimately or otherwise..

 

[cougie uk]

I just wondered if bikes have an anticipated life cycle? Modern alloy bikes that is.

The reason is my partner's mtb is in the bike mechanic's for fettling the gears and he's basically saying it's not worth fixing. It's a foreign brand bought in Eastern Europe and a simple sram geared 26" alloy hardball. Brakes on wrong side for UK spec. It's had 12 years of initially proper mountain biking but later on in those years it was a general do it all bike for commuting, touring and family leisure rides.

It seems it needs a new drive train, rear wheel due to worn brake surface (rim braked) and work on brakes. Not priced up as he said it was worth more than the bike and very rough guess from initial inspection was £250 or more.

Do bikes have a typical life span? You can get 2019 or never hybrids or hardball from specialised, trek and boardman for £250-400 depending on spec. Is it worth spending that for a 12 year old frame? Or would you still do it to keep a bike going? She finds it very comfortable. It's why she's been thinking but not buying a new tourer for 4 years or so.

Any views on whether to keep bikes on the road even if cost is significant?

You could spend £300 or so and find the frame cracking before you've worn out the components you've put on.

Sounds like the bike has had a hard life anyway - but has it been maintained ? Why are the brakes still on the wrong way for the UK after years ? That could have been sorted in an afternoon.

 

[fossyant]

It's just wear and tear and he's saying it's going to cost to fix (big cost will be labour too). I'd fix it.

 

[bonzobanana]

Look for a cheap donor bike to move components from. I've bought cheap bikes in awkward sizes in the past just to get the parts I needed to restore a bike and then sold on the small frame on ebay. If you do your own bike repairs you can have a practical approach to sourcing cheap parts. As well as saving huge amounts of money it also feels good to keep a old bike on the road rather than buy new. Yes aluminium frames will fail eventually, they always get weaker with time and eventually something will fail through fatigue unless the frame is super over-built.

 

[GuyBoden]

I've bought plenty of used Alloy bikes, that have been over 10 years old and I've never seen any of this so called "Alloy Metal Fatigue".

I think this "Alloy Metal Fatigue is mainly occurring in other products that are under more tension and stress than a bike. Look at all the alloy chainsets on steel vintage bikes that are still working fine for over 40 years.

So, I'm yet to be convinced about "Alloy Metal Fatigue" and bikes.

 

[alex_cycles]

So, I'm yet to be convinced about "Alloy Metal Fatigue" and bikes.

Surely it depends on how much and how hard it's been used? I'm perfectly happy to buy 2nd hand alloy bikes which don't seem to have many signs of significant use, but I wouldn't bother with one that's obviously been used hard (unless it was at a giveaway price).

The OP's problem is a bit more difficult because of having to weigh up the sentimental value of the encumbent bike. If the frame seems alright, maybe it's worth putting the new parts on? They can always be transferred to the next frame. But you'll save a lot of money if you can learn how to do this instead of having to pay someone else to do it. (But it's not everyone's cup of tea.)

 

[Time Waster]

You could spend £300 or so and find the frame cracking before you've worn out the components you've put on.

Sounds like the bike has had a hard life anyway - but has it been maintained ? Why are the brakes still on the wrong way for the UK after years ? That could have been sorted in an afternoon.

She likes it like that.

It's coming back without work done. Looks like we need a 16 or so inch hardtail or a hybrid equivalent or just splash out on that flat bar genesis tour de fer on 3 years interest free credit from wheelbase.