Bit of a funny thing with HR/Fitness level

[Rob3rt]

The point is not so much the actual phenomena, but the magnitude. The magnitude of the OP's change in maximum heart rate seems highly unlikely (and if it was sudden, as the OP says it happened in the last few weeks only, or occurred when something else was changed, it is even less likely to be a byproduct of simply being fitter). You will find extremes in the literature if you look hard enough, but these are exactly that, extremes.

In my case, my maximum heart rate is within a few bpm now, as it was 2.5 years ago, yet I produce about 85-90W more for a 60 minute time period. This is a single subject study though i.e. practically worthless to anyone other than me.

 

[dorian]

ah... ok, i didn't read first post thoroughly and didn't notice that it was quite sudden change (?)

 

[Travs]

Indeed - please let's not turn the post into another row; I know it's a natural by-product of forums but does no good.

There's a few factors that I'm considering but essentially it doesn't feel as though I can output as much as I could. Did a wattbike session (bear with me) and including a stint until I started to feel a bit sick and felt like I really needed to "sit on the throne". HR was 181 - I would expect it to be 191 for me to feel like that. At least it did a few weeks back. If nothing else, I'm gonna take a few days off and see if I'm just a little run down.

Regarding power figures for WB versus Strava versus real life - I know its not ideal, but its the best I've got. The WB doesn't appear too inconsistent for my tastes but yes appreciate that the Strava ones are so open to variables that it makes it borderline useless. It at least gives me a target to train to e.g c.340W for 6 and half minutes is not easy but if I rep it, it will mean hill-climbs are that bit easier. You're right, nothing beats getting out on the bike and I do given the choice.

I know sportives aren't competitive but I want to get better and I like going on structured rides as much as my own. I've got a mate that I cycle with a fair bit and he's been doing it for longer and his better fitness pushes me. I like being paced higher than I might strictly do myself - and its good getting some chaingang time too.

 

[Joshua Plumtree]

Isn't this merely a sign of increased fitness. You're probably working at the same intensity levels as before but your cardio-vascular system is now able to deliver what you require slightly more efficiently.

Not sure if this means your MHR figure has changed or it's simply the case that it has become more difficult for you to work hard enough to hit that maximum.

 

[Rob3rt]

The only time I experience a seriously surpressed heart rate for a given power or RPE (outside of being unwell), is when I am approaching or have reached overload (this is desirable, you should periodically hit it). When I allow myself to recover, HR returns to normal and I see a small (relative to total power, but still significant in performance terms) step increase in power.

On a smaller scale, I notice it over a few days of hard training where there is a small and gradual decline as the fatigue accumulates. After a rest or easy day, everything is usually back to normal.

 

[Travs]

Well I had a good rest (and...erm...feed) over the weekend and went out yesterday morning. 47mile loop down on the South Coast including taking in Seven Sisters and Beachy Head - both just Cat4 on Strava; PBs on both. 2.5hrs, average speed of 18.4mph; not exceptional but a pretty damn good ride. So it seems my output is still ok and there doesn't appear to be any problems; its just my MHR on the ride was 179 whereas I would have expected it to be more like high 180s. Like I say the max I've seen is 192 and therefore have 196 as my recorded but at this rate I wouldn't have anywhere near the legs to get to that.

I guess it could be that my fitness has improved over and above my leg muscle performance and need to work on those to catch up - as Joshua Plumtree suggested. Or it could be that I'm over-worrying - I'm sure Citius would agree! I'll see how it goes but I guess panic-stations are over (although whatever next thread I stick in here - they all seem to be based on concerns!)

Cheers all - but if you think of anything, I'm always happy to listen and learn :-)

 

[djmc]

Often when one is getting fitter the heart rate will not go as high because one is fitter and for the same output one is producing aerobic effort rather than anaerobic. I think there are several questions one needs to ask oneself.
What is the aim to be achieved? Is it realistic? I may train like a lunatic but there would be little chance that it may be achieved. Am I capable of the tour de France - No. Would I be capable of doing Paris Brest Paris - No. Can I get round the local sportive without collapsing in a heap - perhaps.
Am I capable of improvement? When one starts an activity it is easy to improve because one starts from a low level. After a while one can no longer improve and indeed one starts to deteriorate. Age has a lot to answer for.
Do I have any other potentially incompatible aims. Are there any possible hindrances. Focusing uniquely on cycling or indeed any other activity whether physical or intellectual might not do very much for ones family or social life. Extreme efforts may not have a good effect on ones general health. I've been there and got the t-shirt.

 

[ayceejay]

Remember that none of this happens in a vacuum. Does a row with your SO have an effect on your heart, does your boss's attitude wind you up, are you worried about your fitness level. Or as a reversal of an old saw - does a watched pot always boil?

 

[Travs]

Thanks again chaps. DJMC - I understand and appreciate that as fitness improves, HR goes down for a given effort. But I can't get my HR up to where it was. Its like its dropped and I can't get it back up. I got to 185 on the Wattbike in the gym absolutely gunning it, to the point my legs are going numb from lactate, I was getting chest pains - I physically can't put in more effort to get my HR to where I could before. So in essence, I've improved a bit, my HR has come down, but it leaves me with 2 questions:
1) What has made it drop all of a sudden. As I said in my opening post, it happened over a short period of time
2) If its met with/caused/happened as a consequence of an increase in fitness, why can't I push even harder to perform even better?

Its just a bit frustrating, that's all. I've got a Dragon Devil in June so want to be able to perform at my best.

Ayceejay - there have been things on my mind; but I don't think there's anything consistent or telling. I'll see how things go over the next few weeks...