Clocks get changed this weekend.

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Like the rotation of the earth and the changing of the seasons, this is just going round on circles now.
Just having a break from the garden, so a quick reply. It seems to me Adrian that you are the one going round in circles by asking the same question and either not understanding or not reading the reply's (are you a teacher or maybe an MP?) To make it simple Yes I understand why DSH were brought in. No I do not understand the need for it today when we are working and living in a totally different environment to what we were in the 1940's Oh and by the way yes I remember when there was double DSH and the arguments then when it was stopped.
 

Paulus

Started young, and still going.
Location
Barnet,
That would be because no one has answered the question. If you don't want to move the clocks, which do you want, the dark winter mornings or the earlier summer sunsets?
You have now asked a different question. The first one has been answered, several times but you don't seem to like the answers. Now you ask, would we like earlier sunsets ,or, dark winter mornings? If the clocks stayed the same it would become the norm and no one would be bothered. For me it would be dark winter mornings, Keep BST and re-name it British Standard Time.
 
That was my question but, since none of the replies explained how it had now become less relevant, I expanded on it to see if I could understand why people don't like something so obviously useful.
Explain in plain English why you think it is obviously useful to keep a habit that does not meet the criteria that it was set up for.
 

deptfordmarmoset

Full time tea drinker
Location
Armonmy Way
Bung the clocks half hour between the two and keep it there all year round ?
Aha, a compromise.:smile: @User is right about making the case for change. But I'm in the camp that doesn't actually want a change. I don't want a change of clock time, that is. But, apart from agriculture and schools (from the point of view of safety) how many people are doing time- or daylight-sensitive work? I suspect that the daylight-sensitive work is far less important with improvements in lighting. Besides, the agricultural side is already pretty much in tune with the seasons, with their variable sunrises and sunsets, not the time on the clock. They already make the adjustments with little reference to the clock. And, again, better lights extend their working window.

Time-sensitive work is nearly always a matter of coordination with others or, in the retail sector, when there's a large enough mass of people prepared to part with their money. So, for the retail sector, open when people are about. People who need to coordinate with people in other completely different time zones already work non-standard hours. The hours they work are already adjusted to those distant time zoners.

The only way to get rid of dark winter mornings is to get up later or move south. The only way to get longer summer evenings is to do get up early and do everything earlier.

The problem of schools is primarily safety. Road safety. Tired people rushing home in the dark after long days aren't as likely to spot children as people not tired and hungry and rushing home would be. But that's another tyranny. I suspect many cyclists and A&E departments will be aware of the drop in driving standards in the late afternoon. Adjust the school hours to the best time for the children's wellbeing and safety.

Who really needs a clock change? It's a kind of flexibility but it's completely regimented and compulsory when it doesn't need to be. The real flexibility will get built in without the clock changing biennial ritual.
 

Bromptonaut

Rohan Man
Location
Bugbrooke UK
At cost of sounding like Paxman interviewing Michael Howard Adrian is asking the right question. It's simply about making best use of available daylight. We may live in a 24/7 society in that you can buy stuff round the clock and the telly doesn't shut down at midnight. Most of us still work at bidding of an employer who, albeit more flexibly than 30yrs ago, expects us to be there for eight hours in time between 06:00 and 18:00.

Daylight Saving Time is not some British eccentricity. Most of the rest of the world does it, at least away from the area bounded by the tropics.

More relevant question is whether UK should be odd boys out with Ireland and Portugal on GMT/GMT+1 or whether we should be in step with mainland Europe on GMT+1/GMT+2.
 
Daylight Saving Time is not some British eccentricity. Most of the rest of the world does it, at least away from the area bounded by the tropics.
More relevant question is whether UK should be odd boys out with Ireland and Portugal on GMT/GMT+1 or whether we should be in step with mainland Europe on GMT+1/GMT+2.
Yes I agree with what you are saying but still find it strange to change the clocks twice a year . While many employers expect people to work between 06:00 and 18:00, there is a sizable % that expect there workforce to work shifts round the clock, in fact they could not function with out a 24 hour shift system. So 18:00 to 06:00 is as normal for some as 06:00 to 18:00 is to others. So to the three/four shift pattern worker it doesn't make hoot whether it is daylight at 04:00 to 23:00 or 09:00 to 16:00 He/she is still going to see the same amount of daylight/darkness. As for the time that we set our clocks at, I have no problems with using CET, in fact it may be an advantage for a lot of business
 
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DaveReading

Don't suffer fools gladly (must try harder!)
Location
Reading, obvs
More relevant question is whether UK should be odd boys out with Ireland and Portugal on GMT/GMT+1 or whether we should be in step with mainland Europe on GMT+1/GMT+2.

That's a no-brainer. It won't have escaped your notice that the UK, Ireland and the UK are all on the western edge of Europe, so we get the sun that much later.

Moving to Central European Time would have the same effect in winter as the year-round BST trial in the late 60s did - I remember well watching the sun rise from my classroom window as late as a quarter to 10 in early January.
 

Bromptonaut

Rohan Man
Location
Bugbrooke UK
Moving to Central European Time would have the same effect in winter as the year-round BST trial in the late 60s did - I remember well watching the sun rise from my classroom window as late as a quarter to 10 in early January.

Same experience as you during the British Standard Time experiment. School playground in the dark was a hateful place.
 

MikeG

Guru
Location
Suffolk
.....On permanent BST, in winter dawn is very late in the north of our country. .......

Another reason to quietly hope that the Scots vote for independance in a few months time. Then we won't have their farmers telling us we can't put our clocks forward.
 
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