Cyclists on BBC R5live

[thomas]

LOL at the fat guy fussing about cyclists not signalling....how often have I, in a car, bicycle or motorbike, had to stop at a roundabout for someone going straight over, who is actually turning left without signalling.

ANNND...the other day I noticed a cyclist, who I could tell obviously wanted to turn right, but wasn't that confident. It is a busy junction and the guy didn't have the best road position, and wasn't signalling...but kept looking over his shoulder but everyone just kept overtaking him. In the end he stopped and waited until until everyone had gone. Complete lack of understanding or patience from every single driver there.

 

[snorri]

CTC gives naff all support to local groups, its right to ride volunteer network has been badly run and

I have to agree GregC, but it also disappoints me that there seems to be little enthusiasm among the membership to become involved in campaigning issues.

 

[GrumpyGregry]

I have to agree GregC, but it also disappoints me that there seems to be little enthusiasm among the membership to become involved in campaigning issues.

Ok. more than half the active members of our local cycling forum are also CTC members. So are more than half the inactive members. Which says to me if the appropriate vehicle for campaigning is put on the road then local CTC members will ride it.

As for engagement with HQ structures. I volunteered. THREE times. I filled in a form. I sent chasing emails. I contacted my CTC councillor, my favourite CTC ex-councillor pleaded on my behalf. The people at HQ kept changing/leaving. The response was we're a bit busy at the moment, we've a backlog of applications, In then end because of this and the way the charity status debate stuff is being managed I decided to take my membership fee and my volunteering/campaigning time elsewhere.

My experience is by no means unique.

 

[GrumpyGregry]

1. Cycling is a great bringer of joy. Those that don't cycle, like Mr. Rayner, are missing out.
2. We get around town faster and in better shape than car drivers.
3. We're prettier than car drivers
4. We're more intelligent than car drivers
5. We're more sexually active than car drivers
6. We're fitter than car drivers
7. We make far less of a mess of the planet than car drivers
8. (it has to be said) Mr. Rayner is not long for this world unless he gets a hold of that body soon.
9. Repeat item 1
10. If a motorist kills or maims us or puts us in hospital, their relatives can take some consolation that the driver would have got a stiffer sentence if they had burgled our house and stolen our bike(s).

ftfy ;-)

 

[downfader]

Done it.

I mean intelligent and polite

Actually I'll add a little more. First I'll apologise for the fatist remarks. I have a fair ol gut meself so I should know better.

Secondly I have seen the CTC campaigning. Roger Geffin and one or two other national figures have been on the TV several times in the last year. I have read their statements several times in the press (mostly The Guardian, Times, or Telegraph, but also the Mirror and Mail).

I dont know whats been going on at their HQ but I know they have had issues with the big change and the votes. My membership lapsed so never voted, I have since renewed.

I also think (and have said as much to other CTC members) that we cant keep relying on others to fight our battles when we can all do little bits like send letters and emails (press, media and authorities), we can also do our bit by setting a visual example. If someone looks like a newbie and looks like they need help we can do that, with the caveat that they pass on the good karma to others.

Dellzeqq, as ever you show some class

 

[ferret fur]

If it's any consolation: I went to school with Adam Rayner & TBH he was a bit of a sad case. Very needy & attention seeking, not terribly popular & not a good advertisment for having an agony aunt as a mother. In almost any other school I suspect he would have been a major target for bullies.
The point is, people get put up in front of a TV camera & this immediately seems to give them some sort of status. If you met him in real life you probably wouldn't give a toss what he thought or said, so why care just because he has appeared on the beeb?

 

[turnout]

If it's any consolation: I went to school with Adam Rayner & TBH he was a bit of a sad case. Very needy & attention seeking, not terribly popular & not a good advertisment for having an agony aunt as a mother. In almost any other school I suspect he would have been a major target for bullies.
The point is, people get put up in front of a TV camera & this immediately seems to give them some sort of status. If you met him in real life you probably wouldn't give a toss what he thought or said, so why care just because he has appeared on the beeb?

It's a rent-a-quote gobshite programme for cabbies to phone in on.

It's like "Counterpoint" in the film Airplane where the chap says of the stricken passengers:

"They bought the tickets, they knew the risks, I say: Let them crash"

 

[downfader]

If it's any consolation: I went to school with Adam Rayner & TBH he was a bit of a sad case. Very needy & attention seeking, not terribly popular & not a good advertisment for having an agony aunt as a mother. In almost any other school I suspect he would have been a major target for bullies.
The point is, people get put up in front of a TV camera & this immediately seems to give them some sort of status. If you met him in real life you probably wouldn't give a toss what he thought or said, so why care just because he has appeared on the beeb?

His Brother turned out alright and knows about food (in a good way ironically, as he's a food critic). And we should care because he reinforces a mentality and enourages others to wrongly feel they have been a victim of circumstance or the authorities. How often have you read the words "if a driver hits one of you he or she will end up in prison!" either in the papers or the internet on non-cycling forums..?

He comes across as jealous that someone else doesnt have to pay what he pays, and is completely ignorant as to why he is forced to pay. If the DFT wont educate people more keenly what hope does british cycling have?

 

[ComedyPilot]

STOP! STOP RIGHT NOW!

click this link

http://www.metacafe....r_on_the_shore/

2 minutes and fifty seconds later.....

1. Cycling is a great bringer of joy. Those that don't cycle, like Mr. Rayner, are missing out.
2. We get around town faster and in better shape than car drivers.
3. We're prettier than car drivers
4. We're more intelligent than car drivers
5. We're more sexually active than car drivers
6. We're fitter than car drivers
7. We make far less of a mess of the planet than car drivers
8. (it has to be said) Mr. Rayner is not long for this world unless he gets a hold of that body soon.
9. Repeat item 1

and if you feel that strongly about motorists, get a muvi camera and send the videos of errant drivers to the police. They'll get the hang of it eventually.

2 minutes and fifty seconds later.......I am smiling and totally de-stressed....Thanks Acker/Dell

 

[downfader]

2 minutes and fifty seconds later.......I am smiling and totally de-stressed....Thanks Acker/Dell

I like a bit of Brian Eno's Apollo sound track for relaxing. Philip Glass too.

 

[ferret fur]

And we should care because he reinforces a mentality and enourages others to wrongly feel they have been a victim of circumstance or the authorities

Probably didn't make my point well enough:

What I meant was: Why just because someone is on TV should thier opinion carry any weight? I accept it usually does, I'm just saying that giving people that sort of platform guarantees them a status they probably wouldn't have in real life.

 

[campbellab]

A very interesting couple of links. A few thoughts:
- "heated debate" - really? I thought it was quite disappointingly calm.

Aye wasn't really heated at all.

- The fat comments - these aren't helpful. The guy's fat. He probably doesn't get a lot of exercise. He may benefit from going on a bike. But, with respect, the comments are unhelpful and we can do much better.

I was thinking the same.

- Accountability. I do see his argument here. As cyclists, we are not required to have insurance, and so (and I don't understand the technicalities) if I'm on the road and I scratch someone's car or someone on a bike collides with me, then there should be some mechanism for dealing with this (small claims?). Many of you on here have insurance, and that's probably a good idea, but I would be concerned if some cyclist without insurance collided with me and refused to pay - I wouldn't really know how this is dealt with?

u

Exactly the same way a pedestrian bumping into a car and scratching is dealt with. They are liable in civil law if they are negligent so you can go through small claims. That is if you know who did it.

The reason car needs 3rd party insurance is mostly because if you put someone in a wheelchair unable to work for the rest of their life, you need to have insurance backing so that they can receive a payment to allow them to live. That and its quite likely that you will cause £1000s of material damage for small mistakes when driving.

The cost of making cycle insurance mandatory is ridiculous when the most common damage we are going to cause (as our fault) is a few scratches and maybe a wing mirror at most. Yes we have the potential to cause life threatening accidents by our actions, but so is a pedestrian stepping out and making a car swerve. If everyone was cycling, the amount of damage and injuries insurance claims would be tiny compared to current driving insurance claims.

- Tarring all cyclists with the same brush - I think this was a cheap shot by the guy, as well as him accusing the guy of laughing about cyclists not following the highway code. He could be being deliberately misleading, or he could have a genuine misunderstanding of current cycling techniques. I think the lady defended this pretty well, but could perhaps have been stronger in saying how cyclists (like us) who try to follow all the rules are appauled and irritated by those that don't probably as much as drivers are.

He said cyclists don't indicate properly, neither do most drivers, what a stupid argument.

They always seem to forget during this argument that being a cyclist doesn't stop you being a driver. I wonder what proportion of 'cyclists' are drivers too.

 

[goo_mason]

Didn't he come out with the ridiculous statement about "In my 30 years of driving, I have never EVER seen a single cyclist indicating properly"?

Bill and Sian just sat and didn't challenge him on it. We need a cycling Paxman-type that can grill these ignorant 'motoring experts' and counter their drivel.

 

[downfader]

I remember someone once telling me that its approximately 85% of on-road cyclists that own and drive a car. Theres also an estimated 4 or 5 million adult UK cyclists. Though I dont know where these figures come from, I have quoted them myself with that understanding.

I'd love to know if anyone has any official figures? I am more than curious myself.

 

[Chutzpah]

I heard the Five Live interview on my way to work in the car with the wife. I was yelling at the radio so should have probably pulled over

Two things that I don't thing have been mentioned yet:

1) I'm sure that one of the things he said was there should be more cycle training for kids. But he obviously hasn't seen the correlation between kids being taught how to cycle and kids not cycling (often because parents think it's too dangerous).

Cycle training is great, but by itself won't encourage people to cycle.

What's more, when people pick up bad habits (which even with cycle training they might, just like drivers that have passed their test pick up bad habits) such as jumping red lights, why does no-one ever seem to ask why?

Don't get me wrong, I hate red light jumpers, and I'm sick of people using it in any debate to do with cycling (as they always seem to do). But why do they do it? If it's because they fear for their safety when the lights turn green, isn't that another issue to tackle?

2) Unless I was going barmy, the female Five Live presenter said "why don't cyclists have to follow the Highway Code? Surely if they were regulated by the Highway Code standards would improve?"

Did I dream that? Because I'm sure my jaw had fallen fully open by that point...