Educate or prosecute?

[BentMikey]

I voted for educate, but I wonder whether both educate and prosecute might not be the right solution?

 

[MissTillyFlop]

middleagedcyclist says they were elderly.

It could be that prosecuting them ends their driving career. Whether that's a good or a bad thing who is to say. Something to consider.

If they are such a bad driver, then maybe ending their driving career is a boon rather than a burden.

 

[rollinstok]

I voted for prosecute
Every ( legal ) road user is aware of how dangerous their vehicles can be but many choose to take unnecessary risks. Teaching people things they already knew but ignored is hardly any punishment, just a soft option.

 

[Strick]

I voted for prosecute
Every ( legal ) road user is aware of how dangerous their vehicles can be but many choose to take unnecessary risks. Teaching people things they already knew but ignored is hardly any punishment, just a soft option.

Unfortunately, I think many are blissfully UNaware.


I didn't vote, as personally I think it should be both.

 

[Miquel In De Rain]

I put educate,but as the above post,I guess it depends on circumstances.

Plus I hadn't read anything but the first post on this thread before voting.

I had a conversation with a motorist friend recently and he couldn't understand why he got the two fingers from a cyclist when he passed too close.Can't say im surprised anymore of the stupidness of some people.

It was the same old crap red lights,blah blah blah,conveniently forgetting mobile phone use and all the other crap which comes from bad car driving.

 

[glasgowcyclist]

middleagedcyclist says they were elderly.

It could be that prosecuting them ends their driving career.

Tough.

That's why the totting up system exists, to allow licence holders a fair number of minor offences (or fewer serious offences) before they are deemed unfit to hold one for some determined period.

I have no sympathy for someone who finds himself in that position.


GC

 

[Flying Dodo]

I am still of the opinion that 'the elderly' should have to re-sit their test or complete a compuslory driving course at a certain age OR after driving for a certain amount of time. The majority are a nuisance on the road IMHO.

That's a bit ageist!

It would be far better if ALL drivers had to re-do a test, say every 5 years.

 

[marinyork]

Tough.

That's why the totting up system exists, to allow licence holders a fair number of minor offences (or fewer serious offences) before they are deemed unfit to hold one for some determined period.

I have no sympathy for someone who finds himself in that position.

GC

Yes, thank you for that incredibly uneducated contribution. Of course I was completely unaware of all of this.

 

[marinyork]

If they are such a bad driver, then maybe ending their driving career is a boon rather than a burden.

A single incident doesn't demonstrate whether they are a bad driver or not. They could be doing the same error on every single junction for all we know or it was an occasional lapse. In a sense gaz is right because the system cannot really take any of this stuff into account (although policemen or people related to the person might exercise their judgement - it just depends whether your trust them or not). People react in different ways. Some people listen, some people don't.

We've all been through this with elderly relatives and friends, surely there isn't a need for me to write more?

The latest incarnation of this in my family is my estranged granny who has more or less given up driving apart from occasionally to the local supermarket 2 times a week to a couple of times a fortnight. Instant panic sets in in relatives whenever she starts talking about driving outside the local area where shall we say without getting into incredibly nasty jokes that the driving culture is somewhere 'different'.

The best argument for prosecution is either gaz's or simply that in cycling terms it is so very, very rare.

Prosecution + education at least means it isn't an isolated thing. One theoretically reinforces the other for those that don't react to either.

 

[MissTillyFlop]

A single incident doesn't demonstrate whether they are a bad driver or not. They could be doing the same error on every single junction for all we know or it was an occasional lapse. In a sense gaz is right because the system cannot really take any of this stuff into account (although policemen or people related to the person might exercise their judgement - it just depends whether your trust them or not). People react in different ways. Some people listen, some people don't.

We've all been through this with elderly relatives and friends, surely there isn't a need for me to write more?

The latest incarnation of this in my family is my estranged granny who has more or less given up driving apart from occasionally to the local supermarket 2 times a week to a couple of times a week. Instant panic sets in in relatives whenever she starts talking about driving outside the local area where shall we say without getting into incredibly nasty jokes that the driving culture is somewhere 'different'.

The best argument for prosecution is either gaz's or simply that in cycling terms it is so very, very rare.

Prosecution + education at least means it isn't an isolated thing. One theoretically reinforces the other for those that don't react to either.

You don't just get banned for one single driving infraction though, let's be fair. The age of the driver is irrelevant. If they have broken the rules, they should be treated the same as everyone else as the consequences are still the same for the other parties involved.

And if anything, those who drive for a living should be treated more harshly when it comes to penalties as it's their job to know better.

 

[gambatte]

If the incident was of such a level that the driver can be prosecuted, then they should be.

Strictly speaking 30.1 in a 30 is a prosecutable offence. 10%+2 is a discretionary measure taken by enforcement authorities. I remember the top cop in North Wales saying "If you do 31 in a 30, we will be doing business" I think that was just before one of the daily rags got hold of a calibrated gun and clocked his driver and his daughter both speeding.
I think in some cases education can play a part.
I mean how many times in this thread have we heard "it worked for me", "I took something away".. "but"....... I don't think we can definitely say how it affected others, what we can say is we are proof it does have an effect.

 

[marinyork]

You don't just get banned for one single driving infraction though, let's be fair.

Who said I was talking about banning? I wasn't.

Often elderly people pack it in after/some time after an accident/points/some other incident. They haven't been banned and sometimes it is for minor things. The incident causes people/relatives to re-assess things and a decision is made. Surely I don't have to be writing out reams and reams about all this for people (although I probably do for glasgowcyclist).

 

[MissTillyFlop]

Who said I was talking about banning? I wasn't.

Often elderly people pack it in after/some time after an accident/points/some other incident. They haven't been banned and sometimes it is for minor things. The incident causes people/relatives to re-assess things and a decision is made. Surely I don't have to be writing out reams and reams about all this for people (although I probably do for glasgowcyclist).

But the consequences of their errors are the same whether they are 17 or 117 and so they should be treated the same as everyone else.

Let's not forget that quite a few elderly people will have never had to sit a driving test either, which is a little bit frightening.

 

[glasgowcyclist]

Yes, thank you for that incredibly uneducated contribution. Of course I was completely unaware of all of this.

You're most welcome.

I'm puzzled that you found it 'incredibly unedcuated' to point out a fact.
It wasn't written to tell you something you didn't already know but as a follow-on to support my comment that it's tough luck for the offender.

I'm sorry if you took it as something else.

GC

 

[Miquel In De Rain]

Prosecution is usually a fine and they are back on the road again?