Emma Foa's death-verdict announced

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Abitrary

New Member
If in doubt about anything like that, or red light jumping, get immediately on the pavement where you're less likely to get sued
 

Johnny Thin

New Member
It's always skip lorries etc that do this sort of thing as they're basically just slamming around doing as much piece work as they can to earn their pay. The judge seemed to be saying "Well, it's very sad but the bloke's gotta earn his dosh, we can't let one silly cyclist cause too much disruption." I passed a very similar case in Oxford about 15 years ago where a young medical student had been wiped out by a skip lorry turning left. They let him off with similar nonchalant verdict, but reformed the junction so it couldn't happen again.
 
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User169

Guest
spindrift said:
She was killed instantly after being crushed between the cement mixer’s rear wheels and roadside railings.

Isn't it time that railings such as these were removed? They always used to worry me.
 

gambatte

Middle of the pack...
Location
S Yorks
Problem then is you get some tw*t in a Chelsea tractor parking 1/2 on the pavement and 1/2 on the road, right on the junction.
 
Elmer Fudd said:
I've always worked on the principle that if I can't see the drivers face in his nearside mirror, stop, because he can't see me.

I've noticed with taxi drivers is that I can see their face in the mirror but they almost seem to be ignoring their left side or right side mirror although half the time Im sure they know im there I wont take the risk and they probably know this.:biggrin:
 

BentMikey

Rider of Seolferwulf
Location
South London
It's a public highway mate, peds have just as much right to the road as we do.

Problem with those railings is that they only speed up motor vehicle traffic, but they don't make life better or safer for vulnerable road users like cyclists and pedestrians. They're bad all round, and should be torn out.
 

RANDOM

New Member
Cab said:
I'm not sure thats true of a big cement mixer. Are you?

I drive cargos the driver of the cement truck would probaly have to jump into the passenger seat and since he should be wearing a seat belt it would be difficult to see his blind spot.It is a shame what happend but its true what has been said stay out of the blind spots both may be at fault and yes he should not have even bothered with looking at his paper work.
 

RANDOM

New Member
Not wanting to side with anyone, but how does the fact that this driver has got to live with the knowledge that he killed someone fit into the equation?
I'm sure the driver of the cement mixer will fell guilty for the rest of his life for all we know he might never get behind the wheel again
 

RANDOM

New Member
spindrift said:
"Blind spot" seems to be a get-out-of-jail-free card for killer drivers.
Its not a get out of jail free card at all,blind spot are a realality they do exsited it seems to me anything bigger and heavier than a bike you seem to dislike you don't seem to realise cyclist can be at fault aswell.
 
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spindrift

New Member
The judge seemed to be saying "Well, it's very sad but the bloke's gotta earn his dosh, we can't let one silly cyclist cause too much disruption."

Indeed.


Lorry drivers kill cyclists and get away with it, in part due to the lazy incompetence Corporation of London. No culpability on the part of the cyclist either.
The majority of cycle fatalities in London involve left turning vehicles and the majority also involve lorries:
in central London the majority of cyclist fatalities caused by left-turning lorries while in the rest of London this collision type is 'only' about a quarter of cyclist fatalities.

In 2000 a cement lorry on London Wall overtook a 20 year female, Ms Barlow, cycling westwards then turned left immediately afterwards, crushing her to death.


After the driver claimed in court not to have seen her and was only fined £250, the girl's mother decided to take action into her own hands after finding out how many similar so-called accidents there had been.
She bought shares in the cement company, heckled the directors at their AGM and forced them to fit extra safety mirrors to their lorries.

Unfortunately before the mirrors were fitted the same lorry (but a different driver) killed a 19 year old cyclist while turning left into Primrose Street from Bishopsgate in 2001.

http://www.citycyclists.org.uk/
It's no accident!
1/4 of London cycle deaths in City
In 2004 a quarter of London's cyclist fatalities took place in the City, despite the Square Mile making up just a thousandth of the total area of Greater London. While the rest of London sees improvements in safety due to new 20mph zones and cycle facilities, the Corporation has refused to spend money granted to it by Transport for London.

http://www.londonmessengers.org/HGV-Campaign
HGV Campaign
To date, 7 London bicycle messengers have been killed while working, all by HGV's.
While the LBMA has already devoted considerable efforts to raising awareness of these dangers, having twice painted the roads with the names of the fallen and also having publicised their cases in the programme distributed free at 2003 ECMC, these preventable tragedies continue, most recently with the death of Sebastian Lukomski (10/8/1976 - 23/2/2004).

All the Thames bridges have a very poor safety record for cyclists even by the City's standards, which has the worst Killed or Seriously Injured ('KSI') rate for cyclists of any local authority in the country.
There was nothing the cyclists could have done. Lorries overtake, swing left, crush girls to death and the drivers get away scot free.

There is an appalling postscript to Ms Barlow's death:
Correction from Cynthia Barlow, the mother in question:
"Incidentally, I read further down your website and the mention of my daughter is not strictly correct – reality is rather worse than that I’m afraid.
The driver of the lorry in my daughter’s case was acquitted, not fined, so nothing happened to him at all.

The same lorry, with a different driver, was in the following year involved in another incident in which the cyclist, Sue Coll, was not in fact killed but suffered catastrophic injuries.
The same driver as was involved in this second case was also involved in a third case in which another cyclist received disabling injuries.
The prosecution of the driver in the second case involving Sue Coll was an exact repetition of my case – same barrister, same expert witness, same tactics, same everything, and same outcome, the driver was again acquitted.
So I have carried on campaigning, not just with RMC, but also on the subject of failings in the criminal justice system."
I spoke to Sue Coll after her trial and was absolutely sickened by the similarities, same lies, same strategy of arrogant defence barrister attacking and humiliating the main prosecution witness (a van driver), etc.
The driver’s defence even cited one of the initiatives that had come about as a result of my involvement with RMC as evidence that he was a conscientious driver, knowing that the truth would not come out because the prosecution had already agreed not to mention either the previous incident involving the same lorry, or the other previous incident involving the same driver, so as not to prejudice the driver’s chance of a fair trial.

A fair trial for the victim would be nice.
On the final day of the trial, it was obvious that the driver was going to be acquitted so Sue’s family came to court to support her.
When the driver arrived, the police ushered him into a private back room “so that he wouldn’t be upset at seeing her family”.

Really.
 

RANDOM

New Member
Maybe it is just easier to blame the driver for every accident,but surely cyclist must be aware of the blind spots in any vehicle and no mention at all if the vehicle have indicated left.The roads are getting busier and more dangerous Not all accidents are the fault of the drivers cyclist must share some of the blame.
 

col

Legendary Member
I think its a little unfair if drivers were blamed all the time,i wouldnt go down the left side of any large vehicle,especailly if nearing a junction or roundabout,not even in a car.
 

RANDOM

New Member
col said:
I think its a little unfair if drivers were blamed all the time,i wouldnt go down the left side of any large vehicle,especailly if nearing a junction or roundabout,not even in a car.

I do agree with you it is unfair,in the highway code it say's
ROAD JUNCTIONS
57.ON THE LEFT.When approaching a junction on the left,
watch out for vehicles turning in front of you,out of or into the
side road.Do not ride on the inside of the vehicles signalling or
slowing down to turn left.

58. Pay particular attention to long vehicles which need a lot of
room to manoeuvre at corners.The may have to move over to
the right before turning left.Wait until they have completed
the manoeuvre because the rear wheels come very close to the
kerb while turning.Do not be tempted to ride in the space
between them and the kerb.

Some cyclist can also become careless when on the road as well.
 

Buffalo Bill

New Member
Location
East London
RANDOM said:
Its not a get out of jail free card at all,blind spot are a realality they do exsited it seems to me anything bigger and heavier than a bike you seem to dislike you don't seem to realise cyclist can be at fault aswell.


Emma Foa was not in a blind spot.

See here.
 
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