Entering the box.

[summerdays]

but as has previously been discussed sometimes it's better to be two or three vehicles back in the queue, rather than moving into the ASL.

Agreed - that's why I started my sentance with IF. I'm more likely to use them if I know them, the timing of the lights, and know how the traffic tends to move at the junction.

 

[eldudino]

Agreed - that's why I started my sentance with IF. I'm more likely to use them if I know them, the timing of the lights, and know how the traffic tends to move at the junction.

In this instance, I'd just seen the lights change and I'm familiar with the timing so I knew I had plenty of time. The reason for getting in front is I know there's a pinch point, which is why I a) made myself visible and to a defensive line through the pinch-point to stop close overtakes. Stirling's not a big place and at 7.30am there's not a huge amount of traffic at all. The gain the bloke got from overtaking at that point was negligible as he could have overtaken safely 20 yards later.

Reading that back, that's not a dig at what you'd said there, I think you're 100% in what you've been saying, I'm just giving the reasons behind my actions!

 

[stowie]

I like feeder lanes, and feel there should be more of them - depending on the specific junction construction and traffic flows. Having a green box perched at the front of the queue of traffic that you can't get to doesn't do anyone any good. But yes you do ahve to be careful using them - as is the case when you are cycling anywhere.

I was particularly impressed to see the wheels of a bus in the box this morning - the back wheels that is. To be fair given the speed the queue had been moving the driver had probably legitimately entered while the light was green and then been caught on the red. But even so, there was a lot of bus sticking out into the road!

More good feeder lanes would be a good idea. But the feeder lanes often (I would go so far as to say mostly) put the cyclist in a bad position, especially if they want to use the outside lane.

I regularly use 3 ASLs close to my house. The first one has no feeder lane, just two solid lines, so presumably, by the letter of the law no-one should be in them. The second one has a long feeder lane, which is slightly let down by the fact the width is slightly less than my handlebars. The third has a feeder lane that is less than a foot long. So none, in my opinion, are particularly cycle friendly facilities.

I use ASLs when I am filtering. I will filter in traffic jams so that I get through the lights in one traffic light cycle. I don't use ASLs when the traffic is light - I will just wait in primary behind the last car in the queue. When filtering, I am frequently on the outside where I can be seen - doesn't make huge sense to sweep from the outside to the inside and back across the ASL to the outside again, if I am planning to turn right. Of course each junction is different, so left filtering makes a lot more sense at some than others.

 

[NickM]

The moton is 100% in the wrong. That we can find unintended legal technicalities why you may also, theoretically, be in the wrong is immaterial to the fact that he risked your life in an unrelated, later incident.

And really, no one will do you for entering a stop box from the right. That action had nothing to do with how that moton treated you, he'd have been just as big an @$$401€ however you'd entered the box. Don't take such pathetic, flimsy excuses for intimidatory driving seriously.

Quite so.

While we have to commute on roads designed by motorists, for motorists, we are perfectly entitled to do what is safest for us rather than follow the letter of the law. As long as nobody else is endangered by our actions, of course.

 

[Defy78]

In this situation (with only 2 cars infront and just before a pinch point) I would have taken up primary behind the cars and waited my turn. I don't see how there is any safety in cutting infront of cars, who will then try to overtake. Of course I am not condoning the motons close overtake but this would be avoided by you slotting in behind the cars.

I do filter (either left or right depending on the options at the time) but only if there is a decent distance / safety gain. To put yourself infront of 2 cars just before a pinch point is inviting a muppet to have a go...of course this is just my opinion

 

[jimboalee]

Advance Stop Lines.

Think about it. They provide a 'reservoir' for cyclists at the head of a junction controlled by traffic signals.
They are predominantly at busy junctions where there is a Right turn.

While the motor traffic is flowing, there is little chance of a cyclist to merge across the lane if he/she intends to take the Right turn.

When the traffic stops at a Red light, the cyclist can ride along the feeder lane into the ASL reservoir and then get themselves in a position to take the Right turn, signalling Right to show the motorists his/her intensions.

IMHO, the ASL reservoir is NOT for cyclists who intend to continue Forward or turn Left unless there is a 'Left ONLY' lane for traffic.

 

[summerdays]

They are also useful for cyclists either turning left or going straight on.

Turning left - allows you to take the turn without a car overtaking you at the same time
Straight on - the advantage for me is that I'm out of the way of cars turning left and also get across the junction before any cars from the opposite direction start trying to turn right.

 

[BentMikey]

In this situation (with only 2 cars infront and just before a pinch point) I would have taken up primary behind the cars and waited my turn. I don't see how there is any safety in cutting infront of cars, who will then try to overtake. Of course I am not condoning the motons close overtake but this would be avoided by you slotting in behind the cars.

I do filter (either left or right depending on the options at the time) but only if there is a decent distance / safety gain.

That's another good approach IMO, and one I often use myself. Mind you in London it's often better to go to the front since the queue will start again just the other side of the juction.

To put yourself infront of 2 cars just before a pinch point is inviting a muppet to have a go...of course this is just my opinion

Careful - this is not the cyclist's fault. It's the moton's fault, and this is really a little bit of victim blaming, which is never right.

 

[eldudino]

To put yourself infront of 2 cars just before a pinch point is inviting a muppet to have a go...of course this is just my opinion

The reason I don't hang back at this junction and get in front of the traffic is to avoid the moton behind me in the queue seeing the moton in front of me zipping off up the road and trying to squeeze by. At other ASLs I do maintain position in the queue but in this instance I think it's safer to be highly visible and as wide as possible through the pinch point.

 

[Rhythm Thief]

I wouldn't change this at all. Said moton was completely in the wrong. Your minor technical infraction would almost certainly never be challenged, and is no excuse anyway.

Yep, spot on.

 

[Defy78]

Careful - this is not the cyclist's fault. It's the moton's fault, and this is really a little bit of victim blaming, which is never right.

As I said earlier in the post I do not condone the motons actions, nor am I saying it's the OP's fault. We all come across the must overtake muppets who have to get past no matter how stupid a place, all I'm saying is that I personally avoid being in this situation as much as possible, sometimes by hanging back where others might filter (can't avoid all motons though, I know). Meant as freindly advice (food for thought if you will) not as a criticism or balming the cyclist - as already stated it's not the cyclists fault the moton was a muppet!

 

[eldudino]

Meant as freindly advice (food for thought if you will) not as a criticism or balming the cyclist - as already stated it's not the cyclists fault the moton was a muppet!

I know what you mean, no offence taken. There are junctions where I do and don't use the ASL, this is one where I feel using it has more benefits than hanging back.

 

[Defy78]

The reason I don't hang back at this junction and get in front of the traffic is to avoid the moton behind me in the queue seeing the moton in front of me zipping off up the road and trying to squeeze by. At other ASLs I do maintain position in the queue but in this instance I think it's safer to be highly visible and as wide as possible through the pinch point.

Fair enough, we've all got to do what we think is best for us at the time, just giving my 2p worth. Motons are gonna be there either way and some (hopefully the minority) will be muppets either way - just gotta get on with it

 

[gaz]

I wouldn't change this at all. Said moton was completely in the wrong. Your minor technical infraction would almost certainly never be challenged, and is no excuse anyway.

+2

 

[Cab]

IMHO, the ASL reservoir is NOT for cyclists who intend to continue Forward or turn Left unless there is a 'Left ONLY' lane for traffic.

You'll find no support for that opinion in law, in any cycle training, or anywhere else, I should think. Unless you go and ask on a moton forum.

You could get to the front and take secondary position if you plan to go straight on or turn left, I suppose. But in busy traffic you've generally got no business being in a secondary position anyway.

ASLs are, when well sited and used properly, quite unashamedly of benefit to cyclists and not of benefit to motorists. And they are the only example of road facilities that work that way. If the moton behind you doesn't like that you're using the road how you're meant to, how you're legally entitled to, and how any competent cycling instructor should recommend, then hard cheese. It isn't an excuse for endangering the cyclist in front, it isn't a coherent reason for doing so.