For sake of fairness

[brokenbetty]

Really? How do you know that it isn't your prejudice showing through? In the same way that car drivers only notice RLJs and not the cyclists who stop at lights. Maybe you only notice the 'aggressive' riiders wearing lycra & not the nice normal people who choose not to wear clothing designed for cycling in.

Sometime I keep running tallies on my commute for the exact purpose of testing my own assumptions. I'm interested in road user behaviour in general so I make an effort to observe it. And far from only noticing the people who fit my prejudices, I tend to notice the ones who don't more because it's so nice to see someone I assumed would behave badly behave well.

I have never said all lycra wearers are aggressive. I have said that given that lycra enables more aggressive cycling it isn't surprising that there is a correlation between lycra and aggression. I have also said that cycling in towns (assuming you are cycling with courtesy) rarely justifies road kit.

I think a lot of cyclists have got so used to being on the receiving end of unjustified criticism that they jump straight to dismiss all criticism.

 

[Arfcollins]

Arfcollins, on 29 April 2011 - 12:05:30, said:

You wear your jeans for a 10 mile steady journey, lets say 10mph for the sake of argument. (Please do correct me.) At what distance/speed can an unaggressive cyclist such as you or me wear lycra without being classified as aggressive? Would 20 miles be a lycra journey, or maybe 10 miles at 15mph? I'd appreciate your help here as I'm obviously not too good at choosing from the wardrobe in the mornings and I wouldn't want to give the wrong impression to other road-users.

You'd find that cart easier to manage if you put the horse in front

Eh?

 

[515mm]

Mate,

the most dangerous and agressive riding I've seen has come from blokes wearing jeans - the zenith being the bloke in his early twenties who overtook me four times in a hundred yards* (I was cycling to work) - into a properly stiff headwind - then decided to undertake a white van at a junction. Once the light turned green white van man - who was indicating left - moved off and duly turned left into the path of our hero in jeans.

Chap erupts in fury, banging on the side of the van, shouting and swearing for all he was worth. He threw his bike to the ground and ran round to the driver's door still screaming. Sensibly, WVM drove off.

On the street where I work I see two to three dozen pavement cyclists EVERY SINGLE DAY. Maybe, maybe, one per day is wearing lycra. In my experience, the ar$eholes on bikes are the ones in jeans.


*I think he couldn't grasp the concept of riding steadily into the wind. I kept to 15mph(it was very windy) but he decided to overtake me by standing up on his pedals and sprinting past, fair enough. When he ran out of puff after about four bike lengths, he pulled his bike in front of me and slowed down to about 10mph. So I rode past steadily at 15. Four times in 100 yards and he still hasn't learned. I gave him a wide berth after that.

 

[400bhp]

I have never said all lycra wearers are aggressive. I have said that given that lycra enables more aggressive cycling it isn't surprising that there is a correlation between lycra and aggression. I have also said that cycling in towns (assuming you are cycling with courtesy) rarely justifies road kit.

You said the following:

When I see a mamil in town I assume either he's all gear and no idea or intends to ride unsuitably aggressively.

 

[abo]

That's exactly what I said. People who wear lycra do so because it allows them to ride harder (ie faster or further) than they otherwise would be able to.

No thats entirely the reverse of what I was saying; I bet he can go just as fast in a pair of trousers and a jacket but when he gets to work he'll be all stinky. So IMHO he's wearing the lycra for comfort rather than to make him go faster (hope I'm not speaking for you here, Grumpycyclist...)

 

[ferret fur]

Sometime I keep running tallies on my commute for the exact purpose of testing my own assumptions

You don't think the fact that you are sufficiently bothered by people wearing cycling clothing when cycling to keep a running tally of it means that perhaps you are not a disinterested observer? Might this not perhaps influence your reckoning, after all you clearly have to have some sort of threshold for 'aggressive behaviour' to keep a score. Might not a teensy weensy bit of bias creep in there?

& if you are worried about clothing facilitating more efficient (faster) cycling, why not whinge about people on road bikes, or on high end hybrids while you are at it? Perhaps we could be bigoted about racebike rowdies or hybrid hooligans as opposed to Pashley pacifists. Clearly, its these sort of people who the problem on the roads today.

 

[JonnyBlade]

I'd like to thank the moron in the silver jeep type motor in Chichester last week for the abuse when I briefly moved 2 abreast. I was impressed that his daughter didn't flinch when he yelled through wound down window that we were effing cocks and should read the high way code. I asked him if he'd be prepared to take a wager on the content and he hurled more abuse. He raced off to my friend who was a way in front by this time to stop and abuse him too.
Laugh, I nearly wet my pants

 

[brokenbetty]

You don't think the fact that you are sufficiently bothered by people wearing cycling clothing when cycling to keep a running tally of it means that perhaps you are not a disinterested observer? Might this not perhaps influence your reckoning, after all you clearly have to have some sort of threshold for 'aggressive behaviour' to keep a score. Might not a teensy weensy bit of bias creep in there?

& if you are worried about clothing facilitating more efficient (faster) cycling, why not whinge about people on road bikes, or on high end hybrids while you are at it? Perhaps we could be bigoted about racebike rowdies or hybrid hooligans as opposed to Pashley pacifists. Clearly, its these sort of people who the problem on the roads today.

I don't tally cyclists in particular, I'm interested in road behaviour in general. I watch everyone. When you've been riding the same stretch of road twice a day for four years it's good to have a bit of an interest. Better than striving for another BP anyway.

And i've never said riding fast is a problem per se, just that it's usually inappropriate in town so I wonder why the need to dress for it in town.

You seem awfully bothered by the idea that roadies might include some of the most aggressive cyclists. Perhaps its easier to assume the public has a prejudice against Lycra than look in the mirror and ask whether your own behaviour might be misinterpreted.

 

[ferret fur]

..except I'm not a roadie

 

[ferret fur]

..except I'm not a roadie & as i said. I hardly ever wear lycra

 

[al78]

I'd like to thank the moron in the silver jeep type motor in Chichester last week for the abuse when I briefly moved 2 abreast. I was impressed that his daughter didn't flinch when he yelled through wound down window that we were effing cocks and should read the high way code. I asked him if he'd be prepared to take a wager on the content and he hurled more abuse. He raced off to my friend who was a way in front by this time to stop and abuse him too.
Laugh, I nearly wet my pants

It never ceases to amaze me that there are women out there that think prats like this are suitable candidates for starting a family with.

 

[brokenbetty]

..except I'm not a roadie

Then I'm completely mystified that you can't see where the lycra warrior stereotype came from. I can only assume either there's no roadies where you are, you live in the countryside, or you cycle with your eyes shut.

 

[brokenbetty]

In my experience, the ar$eholes on bikes are the ones in jeans.

Oh, I certainly agree there's some atrocious cycling perpetrated by people in ordinary clothes, though my experience is they are oblivious rather than aggressive (probably more likely to cause an accident though).

 

[BentMikey]

Oh, I certainly agree there's some atrocious cycling perpetrated by people in ordinary clothes, though my experience is they are oblivious rather than aggressive (probably more likely to cause an accident though).

LOL, obviously haven't ridden around too many courier wannabes then.

 

[brokenbetty]

LOL, obviously haven't ridden around too many courier wannabes then.

They're not ordinary clothes, they are just NFD

(normal for dalston )