Frame sizes

[woodbutcher]

As a rule of thumb when seated your leg should be straight with the pedal in the six o clock position. Some years ago the university of Nottingham I think it was did some tests with pro riders to find the most efficient seat height for power delivery. They came up with 106% of inside leg measurement so the leg was slightly stretched.
The handlebar reach can be adjusted to your taste.

Thats interesting, is the 106% of inside leg length measured from the top of the seat to the top of the pedal when it is a 6 o'clock ? And so frame size is not as critical as l had assumed. The the other confusing (for me) idea which l have seen lots of times on U Tube tutorials is that if you drop a plumb line from your knee cap to the crank when it is at 9 o'clock the plumb line should just touch the end of the crank arm. What that proves lm not sure.
Then you have all that stuff about the fore and aft position of the seat and the angle of the seat in relationship to the ground. After all these years l didn't realise how difficult it was so difficult to ride a bicycle, I think l'll go and have a lie down !

 

[Ozzie770]

The old Chopper style bike comes to mind here.

Did have a few of them back in the late 70's

 

[Illaveago]

You can get one of those adjustable handle bar stems for fore and aft adjustment. Not sure if it would help or not.

 

[Ozzie770]

Thats interesting, is the 106% of inside leg length measured from the top of the seat to the top of the pedal when it is a 6 o'clock ? And so frame size is not as critical as l had assumed. The the other confusing (for me) idea which l have seen lots of times on U Tube tutorials is that if you drop a plumb line from your knee cap to the crank when it is at 9 o'clock the plumb line should just touch the end of the crank arm. What that proves lm not sure.
Then you have all that stuff about the fore and aft position of the seat and the angle of the seat in relationship to the ground. After all these years l didn't realise how difficult it was so difficult to ride a bicycle, I think l'll go and have a lie down !

I like to start the bike with my right leg on the pedal at the about the 2 O'clock position, but on the Esquire I find I have only about 2" from my knee hitting the handlebar... Think it might be that the frame is not very long from seat post to handlebars, or I just have a weird body size.

 

[simongt]

It used to be measured from from the top of the tube of the frame in which the seat post sits to the centre of the crank axle line. There will be a bit of variance due to angles and the way manufactures finish the tops of the frame.

Indeed, that was always the accepted way of measuring frame sizes; when top tubes were pretty much horizontal to the ground. However, with the introduction of sloping top tubes in the mountain bike era, it became a bit cavalier as the seat tube often now extends above the top tube. It does depend very much on the bike and its intended use; for example my street bike is a 17", my tourer is 21" and my audax is 23" and as I'm 1.78m height, they all fit me a treat.
BUT, as the important issue is toptube clearance or stepover height, we believe that the traditional method still applies and we stick to that.

 

[Ozzie770]

You can get one of those adjustable handle bar stems for fore and aft adjustment. Not sure if it would help or not.

Thing is I dont really want to modify the Esquire as its virtually in an original state... I'm thinking of perhaps looking for an 21" frame that is longer and make it up to my own requirements/taste, (though with period parts) then use the Esquire for the occassional ride just for nostalgia.

 

[Cycleops]

Thats interesting, is the 106% of inside leg length measured from the top of the seat to the top of the pedal when it is a 6 o'clock ? And so frame size is not as critical as l had assumed. The the other confusing (for me) idea which l have seen lots of times on U Tube tutorials is that if you drop a plumb line from your knee cap to the crank when it is at 9 o'clock the plumb line should just touch the end of the crank arm. What that proves lm not sure.
Then you have all that stuff about the fore and aft position of the seat and the angle of the seat in relationship to the ground. After all these years l didn't realise how difficult it was so difficult to ride a bicycle, I think l'll go and have a lie down !

I don’t believe frame size is so critical within reason. The Bianchi I posted a pic of recently was about 2” too small for me but it was manageable, but it did feel a bit cramped. I feel more comfortable with a bigger frame. The 106% was of inseam measurement, but that was for pro riders wanting ultimate power delivery, you might feel more comfortable with a somewhere around 100%.
Most prefer the seat more or less level. Fore/aft measurement might be more critical, you need to experiment to find the best position for you. I recently changed the long stem on my Specialized AWOL for a short higher one giving me a more upright position which I liked but the longer stem was still comfortable.