It's my understanding that the police have to provide the driver's name and address and insurance details if you have a legitimate reason, such as a damages claim, to require these details. It would also be useful to ask to review your statement with them, since you were shaken up at the time of the incident and may have more detail to provide. You could also use this process to quiz the police on what action they are taking based on the facts that they have.
Hit from behind by car - advice please!
- Thread starter Alaskan Rob
- Start date
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Alaskan Rob
New Member
Hi just thought I'd give an update, though first thanks to everyone for the warm welcome on here. I do love cycling and as well as commuting on my bike most days, I loved to go for a blast off road now and then. So I'm sure I'll stick around now I've found this place. The other unfortunate thing though is that it was a month old bike, a £1k Genesis Altitude 20, that I loved! In fact I was just coming back from the cycle shop with some new bits for it! (Something else I wanted to point out is the fact its a mountain bike, strong wheels, but back wheel still smashed up)
However, I have to be honest and say I'm very wary of getting back on a bike, its just the nature of this accident was totally out of my control and no warning, no chance even to mitigate it, and that has really spooked me, and I was a confident cyclist before. Any advice from anyone who has been mown down before on how to get back into it?
Below is a rambling post I put back on the original forum I posted on - I mentioned some bits to you guys in my post earlier today on here - the headlines are though that its proving difficult to get any info out of the Police, and I worry that they aren't investigating it properly.
Something I am really concerned about is I only remember managing to say two things to the Police about it at the time, one that he hit me (I think I added from behind as this is key), and two that I was going at about 15mph, as this most directly answered their questions, I couldn't describe it more exactly at the time - I could barely mumble. I therefore worry that they think I've just been knocked off to the side like how most cyclists are knocked off and I then wobbled over, at no more than 10-15 mph, I hadn't broken anything, so they just record it as a minor incident, the driver had seen me but just misjudged his passing manouver, etc. I'm worried about whether the Police at the scene took full statements from witnesses, or just assumed it was a minor accident and didn't bother.
The reality was far more severe i.e. being driven into at 30mph+ and so rapidly accelerated forward before impacting to a sudden stop on the tarmac at significantly more than 15mph. I really hope the Police at the scene noted the position of me, his car and and the damage to my back wheel and can add it all up, or they got a witness. I know it undoubtedly seems more serious to me but the force of being directly smashed into from behind was astonishing and far different to being clipped , and the proximity of my head to the kerb on landing has made me realise I was very almost became one of those signs appealing for info to a fatal collision. Being hit from behind also means that his driving was far more dangerous =. he wasn't looking/distracted, rather than he clipped me =. he simply made an error of judgement as he passed but had observed me. I know in the bigger scheme of things I've been very lucky and hopefully suffered no long-term damage, my point on severity is I think the manner and speed in which he hit me was far more than a usual vehicle / cycle side swipe clash, I just got very lucky with the landing.
Now linked to this, today I have been trying to find out more but yes it has been handed over to a central Police unit. Now when I collected the bike, I mentioned to the officer that I hadn't been able to give the officers at the scene my full version of events. He gave me a form (sounds like the one mentioned above) and so I filled that in. Now when I mentioned this to the lady at the central unit, she had a go at me saying I shouldn't have done this and there would now be two reports in the system (the other being from the officers attending who will send in their logs in next couple of weeks) this would mean they had twice the work to do and so on! But the officer told me to fill it in, and how else was I supposed to get my version of events across. (Apparently I won't be hearing from an officer at the scene as they are too busy to take my statement). They did say they had a witness report, but no more detail. Could tell me nothing about the status of the driver. I do worry there will be an admin cock-up, and it seems as I didn't die there aren't the resources for much of an investigation.
Just basically my concern is that the Police have made an incorrect assumption at the start of this and already passed it off as minor, whereas the reality is that there is a driver on the roads who smashes into people from behind as they are too busy doing other things to look at the road, I fear for who might be next. How do I now get the Police to know for sure what the nature of the collission was?
Thanks for the tip on the cycle chat forums, I have now spoken to a lawyer recommended on there who is going to act for me, but I really hope the Police come through as while that will obviously help my civil case, more than anything I want this idiot off the road for a long time.
Sorry again for the rambling message - painkillers making me a bit sleepy! It is actually rather good to talk about it though, and the advice from all you guys has been great.
However, I have to be honest and say I'm very wary of getting back on a bike, its just the nature of this accident was totally out of my control and no warning, no chance even to mitigate it, and that has really spooked me, and I was a confident cyclist before. Any advice from anyone who has been mown down before on how to get back into it?
Below is a rambling post I put back on the original forum I posted on - I mentioned some bits to you guys in my post earlier today on here - the headlines are though that its proving difficult to get any info out of the Police, and I worry that they aren't investigating it properly.
Something I am really concerned about is I only remember managing to say two things to the Police about it at the time, one that he hit me (I think I added from behind as this is key), and two that I was going at about 15mph, as this most directly answered their questions, I couldn't describe it more exactly at the time - I could barely mumble. I therefore worry that they think I've just been knocked off to the side like how most cyclists are knocked off and I then wobbled over, at no more than 10-15 mph, I hadn't broken anything, so they just record it as a minor incident, the driver had seen me but just misjudged his passing manouver, etc. I'm worried about whether the Police at the scene took full statements from witnesses, or just assumed it was a minor accident and didn't bother.
The reality was far more severe i.e. being driven into at 30mph+ and so rapidly accelerated forward before impacting to a sudden stop on the tarmac at significantly more than 15mph. I really hope the Police at the scene noted the position of me, his car and and the damage to my back wheel and can add it all up, or they got a witness. I know it undoubtedly seems more serious to me but the force of being directly smashed into from behind was astonishing and far different to being clipped , and the proximity of my head to the kerb on landing has made me realise I was very almost became one of those signs appealing for info to a fatal collision. Being hit from behind also means that his driving was far more dangerous =. he wasn't looking/distracted, rather than he clipped me =. he simply made an error of judgement as he passed but had observed me. I know in the bigger scheme of things I've been very lucky and hopefully suffered no long-term damage, my point on severity is I think the manner and speed in which he hit me was far more than a usual vehicle / cycle side swipe clash, I just got very lucky with the landing.
Now linked to this, today I have been trying to find out more but yes it has been handed over to a central Police unit. Now when I collected the bike, I mentioned to the officer that I hadn't been able to give the officers at the scene my full version of events. He gave me a form (sounds like the one mentioned above) and so I filled that in. Now when I mentioned this to the lady at the central unit, she had a go at me saying I shouldn't have done this and there would now be two reports in the system (the other being from the officers attending who will send in their logs in next couple of weeks) this would mean they had twice the work to do and so on! But the officer told me to fill it in, and how else was I supposed to get my version of events across. (Apparently I won't be hearing from an officer at the scene as they are too busy to take my statement). They did say they had a witness report, but no more detail. Could tell me nothing about the status of the driver. I do worry there will be an admin cock-up, and it seems as I didn't die there aren't the resources for much of an investigation.
Just basically my concern is that the Police have made an incorrect assumption at the start of this and already passed it off as minor, whereas the reality is that there is a driver on the roads who smashes into people from behind as they are too busy doing other things to look at the road, I fear for who might be next. How do I now get the Police to know for sure what the nature of the collission was?
Thanks for the tip on the cycle chat forums, I have now spoken to a lawyer recommended on there who is going to act for me, but I really hope the Police come through as while that will obviously help my civil case, more than anything I want this idiot off the road for a long time.
Sorry again for the rambling message - painkillers making me a bit sleepy! It is actually rather good to talk about it though, and the advice from all you guys has been great.
the reluctant cyclist
Über Member
- Location
- Birmingham
Hi there - hope you are feeling better!
Just to say that I really sympathise - I was hit from behind once and it is a real shock when you don't see it coming!
Also, when I needed to make a claim against a driver for my injuries I tried to join CTC but the only basis they would let me join and then make a claim was to joint up for 5 years I think it was - this was pretty pricy and I didn't have the money to do it at the time (knowing I was going to be taking a lot of unpaid leave from work did not help).
In the end I contacted Russell Jones and Walker direct and they took me on even though I was not a member of the CTC. It depends on your claim really and how much there is in it. Mine will be well under £3/4K I would imagine and they were happy to take mine on so you might be in luck.
If you search online you will get a lawyer who specialises in cycling injuries - a very good idea because Solicitors don't know everything and it's good to get one that has an idea of the laws of the road!
Another thing I feel compelled to warn you about is that you don't get to make any claims for repairs to your bike etc etc until liability has been admitted - this can take up to 3 months. I put my claim in on June 26th and I am a thousand pounds down in unpaid wages and bike repairs etc etc and I have not been able to claim a penny yet because the insurance company is still deciding on liability.
I just feel like people should know these facts!!!!!!
I must say it is amazing that you didn't break anything - apart from your bike of course!
Just to say that I really sympathise - I was hit from behind once and it is a real shock when you don't see it coming!
Also, when I needed to make a claim against a driver for my injuries I tried to join CTC but the only basis they would let me join and then make a claim was to joint up for 5 years I think it was - this was pretty pricy and I didn't have the money to do it at the time (knowing I was going to be taking a lot of unpaid leave from work did not help).
In the end I contacted Russell Jones and Walker direct and they took me on even though I was not a member of the CTC. It depends on your claim really and how much there is in it. Mine will be well under £3/4K I would imagine and they were happy to take mine on so you might be in luck.
If you search online you will get a lawyer who specialises in cycling injuries - a very good idea because Solicitors don't know everything and it's good to get one that has an idea of the laws of the road!
Another thing I feel compelled to warn you about is that you don't get to make any claims for repairs to your bike etc etc until liability has been admitted - this can take up to 3 months. I put my claim in on June 26th and I am a thousand pounds down in unpaid wages and bike repairs etc etc and I have not been able to claim a penny yet because the insurance company is still deciding on liability.
I just feel like people should know these facts!!!!!!
I must say it is amazing that you didn't break anything - apart from your bike of course!
A-Rob,
Mmmmmmm. This is starting to sound familiar. I'd lay a small wager that you'll get a letter from plod saying that they are "not going to take any further action against the driver" and that you are "free to pursue civil damages" or somesuch.
Even if they make this decision, you are still entitled to be treated with some common courtesy and like others have said, they still have to provide the paperwork, whether they'll take it further or not.
Also agree with the advice about using a reputable, specialist solicitor.
If he's not insured, then a solicitor will be unlikely to take it on as a "no win-no fee" and you are basically stuffed.
Mmmmmmm. This is starting to sound familiar. I'd lay a small wager that you'll get a letter from plod saying that they are "not going to take any further action against the driver" and that you are "free to pursue civil damages" or somesuch.
Even if they make this decision, you are still entitled to be treated with some common courtesy and like others have said, they still have to provide the paperwork, whether they'll take it further or not.
Also agree with the advice about using a reputable, specialist solicitor.
Nope. See my previous post. If the police take no action and you have to pursue a civil claim, then the driver is not directly punished in any way, neither will he get any kind of criminal record. You are only claiming for actual damage caused to you and your bike, nothing more. His only indirect punishment is that his insurance premiums will most likely go up. Even this might not happen if he's got protected no claims, but I don't know that for a fact.
If he's not insured, then a solicitor will be unlikely to take it on as a "no win-no fee" and you are basically stuffed.
the reluctant cyclist
Über Member
- Location
- Birmingham
If the driver is uninsured you can still take up a claim with the the MIB I think. Can't remember if that is exactly what they are called but they are a body set up for exactly this situation - people hit by uninsured drivers. Not sure how much you would get re personal injury but you would defiantely be able to see if you could get your bike repairs paid.
That said - you need to make sure you "mitigate your loss" and don't go nuts - for instance take taxis to work and back when the bus would do! They don't like over the top claims!
That said - you need to make sure you "mitigate your loss" and don't go nuts - for instance take taxis to work and back when the bus would do! They don't like over the top claims!
If the guy is insured, any reputable firm will advise not getting back on the bike too soon as you can claim for some mental impairment/anguish, i.e.the accident has set you back and you don't want to get back on the bike. I have a colleague at work who is not on his bike and hasn't been for the last two months for this reason. He truthly doesn't want to recommence his commute.
Google Motor Insurers Bureau if uninsured - you can claim online I think; although I am doing so against an uninsured driver (stolen car) who wrote off my car.
Google Motor Insurers Bureau if uninsured - you can claim online I think; although I am doing so against an uninsured driver (stolen car) who wrote off my car.
Twenty Inch
Guru
- Location
- Behind a desk
If he's not insured, you can claim through the MIB. It takes a lot longer and you'll need a solicitor who understands the ins and outs. I used a solicitor who specialised in personal injury (but not cycling, it seems). I wasn't terribly pleased with their performance but when they got someone in to help the solicitor, things got going. I eventually received GBP5k three years after the collision, when I was hit by an uninsured driver with no licence, no witnesses, who absconded before his trial (for driving without a licence, not for driving into me). So MIB can stump up, but it takes longer.
My guff from the CTC suggested that claims against uninsured drivers through the MIB are not impossible, but can get very awkward and time consuming, which may be why solicitors are reluctant to take them on.
There's no evidence yet that the driver here is uninsured. The cops should have checked this and if he's not insured he will almost certainly be looking at some form of prosecution. That's one of the more galling things about these type of incidents - the driver will get fined for no licence, no insurance or will even get a ban for drink-driving, but the fact that he's ploughed into you is incidental.
I'm also sorry for the negative tone of my past two posts. I've had a bit of a day, and plod's attitude to cycling incidents tends to get me all of a strop anyway. So I'll end with something positive.....
The best thing I did as soon as I'd recovered sufficiently from my accident was to pick a nice day, get a pass from the wife and head to the hills on my vanity-bike and thank my stars that my legs, arms, spine and brain were all still working well enough to enjoy riding again.
There's no evidence yet that the driver here is uninsured. The cops should have checked this and if he's not insured he will almost certainly be looking at some form of prosecution. That's one of the more galling things about these type of incidents - the driver will get fined for no licence, no insurance or will even get a ban for drink-driving, but the fact that he's ploughed into you is incidental.
I'm also sorry for the negative tone of my past two posts. I've had a bit of a day, and plod's attitude to cycling incidents tends to get me all of a strop anyway. So I'll end with something positive.....
The best thing I did as soon as I'd recovered sufficiently from my accident was to pick a nice day, get a pass from the wife and head to the hills on my vanity-bike and thank my stars that my legs, arms, spine and brain were all still working well enough to enjoy riding again.
ComedyPilot
Secret Lemonade Drinker
- Location
- The Kingdom of Yorkshire
Even if the police do not pursue the case (the CPS decide if there is a good chance of a prosecution being won in court, if not it's NFA), still get all the information down on paper, doctor's reports, photos of damage, injuries, witness details - also demand through 'Freedom of information Act' the police report/log for the incident - if 4 Police officers were there, there must be a police log/job number attahced to the incident, try at the local station. Better still, get in touch with a traffic cop and get their advice - go to the front desk of your local police station and DEMAND (nicely) that one contacts you, or pops round for a cup of tea (it's amazing what a cup of tea will get out of a Police Officer). Pass it all on to a No-Win no fee solicitor. The most the Police can do is pass the case to the CPS who decide if there is to be a charge to be made, and then the punishment is down to the Mags court. If it went that far you would fill out a compensation form, but there is no guarantee of getting anything. That's on the police/punishment side, if you went down the civil route, the more evidence you can gather the better.
Alaskan Rob
New Member
Hi, thanks for the follow ups everyone, a few responses:
My search of his reg number online suggested he is not insured. The Police did tell me that 80% of the cars involved in RTA's in south london are not insured, which is a deeply disturbing statistic. Which kind of makes me think as it is so high, many of these probably don't have a license and have never been trained or passed a test.
But I have gone with Bikeline, they are happy to pursue it whether they find he in uninsured ot not, but through the MIB if he isn't, they said not a problem. I must say my initial interaction with them has been excellent. 20 mins on the initial call giving my details with a lovely lady, and then about 50 mins with the Solicitor who explained the process, and certainly seemed to know his bikes - he said 95% of their work is cycle related. I just hope either CCTV or a witness can be found as it would be such an open and shut case.
On not breaking anything or being more seriously injured / paralysed / dead - I'm beginning to see this as the silver lining, it could easily have been so different. Its funny but recently I have been worrying about a couple of issues that life has thrown my way, but being able to walk now - no matter how painfully! - has made me very greatful for what I do have. At the moment of impact from the car I think I can remember flashing through my head was "AAAGH!, I've been hit, please I don't want to die!" I can remember no more than that (so not the moment of impact with the road) until coming around a few seconds later lying on the road. My impact injuries suggest i landed on my front, but I came around to conscinous on my back. My mitts are wrecked (I very almost hadn't worn them, so glad I did or my hands would be shredded) so think I may have got my hands down first (they were totally numb for 20 or so mins afterwards then pins needles that gradually eased hours later), and while I'm certainly not Arnie, I do go to the gym a bit and have a bit of muscle and think this may have helped protect bones. Most luckily my head/neck/back did not hit the kerb. Though its my head and neck that are starting to hurt more than my obvious impact areas as these would have been thrown backwards when he went into me I guess. But a miraculous outcome really.
Bollo, no don't worry about the tone of your posts, I value your honesty as someone else who has been through this grim experience, it has made me more aware of the need to push the Police on this. I had naively assumed that they would take care of it all. And thanks for the tip on getting back on my bike, it seems a far way off for me now though, will probably start off road.
It is just simply shocking though that you can be driven into like this and it is possible that no action is taken against the driver. I know the authorities have other things to do, like prosecuting people for overfilling their wheely bins. If ever I as a car driver were to hit someone in this way I would be mortified firstly of the damage I has done to another human being, but secondly that I would certainly face a jail sentence. But it seems possible that the Police's starting point is that its OK to directly drive a 2 tonne car into someone at high speed, with few or no further questions asked.
Probably pointless, but I'm going to write to Boris Johnson - I sometime see him on his bike when I'm commuting coming the other way - with my experience, and let him know how things seem to be stacked against cyclists after accidents. May as well send it to David Cameron as well then.
My search of his reg number online suggested he is not insured. The Police did tell me that 80% of the cars involved in RTA's in south london are not insured, which is a deeply disturbing statistic. Which kind of makes me think as it is so high, many of these probably don't have a license and have never been trained or passed a test.
But I have gone with Bikeline, they are happy to pursue it whether they find he in uninsured ot not, but through the MIB if he isn't, they said not a problem. I must say my initial interaction with them has been excellent. 20 mins on the initial call giving my details with a lovely lady, and then about 50 mins with the Solicitor who explained the process, and certainly seemed to know his bikes - he said 95% of their work is cycle related. I just hope either CCTV or a witness can be found as it would be such an open and shut case.
On not breaking anything or being more seriously injured / paralysed / dead - I'm beginning to see this as the silver lining, it could easily have been so different. Its funny but recently I have been worrying about a couple of issues that life has thrown my way, but being able to walk now - no matter how painfully! - has made me very greatful for what I do have. At the moment of impact from the car I think I can remember flashing through my head was "AAAGH!, I've been hit, please I don't want to die!" I can remember no more than that (so not the moment of impact with the road) until coming around a few seconds later lying on the road. My impact injuries suggest i landed on my front, but I came around to conscinous on my back. My mitts are wrecked (I very almost hadn't worn them, so glad I did or my hands would be shredded) so think I may have got my hands down first (they were totally numb for 20 or so mins afterwards then pins needles that gradually eased hours later), and while I'm certainly not Arnie, I do go to the gym a bit and have a bit of muscle and think this may have helped protect bones. Most luckily my head/neck/back did not hit the kerb. Though its my head and neck that are starting to hurt more than my obvious impact areas as these would have been thrown backwards when he went into me I guess. But a miraculous outcome really.
Bollo, no don't worry about the tone of your posts, I value your honesty as someone else who has been through this grim experience, it has made me more aware of the need to push the Police on this. I had naively assumed that they would take care of it all. And thanks for the tip on getting back on my bike, it seems a far way off for me now though, will probably start off road.
It is just simply shocking though that you can be driven into like this and it is possible that no action is taken against the driver. I know the authorities have other things to do, like prosecuting people for overfilling their wheely bins. If ever I as a car driver were to hit someone in this way I would be mortified firstly of the damage I has done to another human being, but secondly that I would certainly face a jail sentence. But it seems possible that the Police's starting point is that its OK to directly drive a 2 tonne car into someone at high speed, with few or no further questions asked.
Probably pointless, but I'm going to write to Boris Johnson - I sometime see him on his bike when I'm commuting coming the other way - with my experience, and let him know how things seem to be stacked against cyclists after accidents. May as well send it to David Cameron as well then.
Alaskan Rob
New Member
Hi all,
Just to resurrect my thread from 15 months ago! A recap: I was knocked off as I cycled along a straight road in a straight line in excellent summer daylight by a car driving straight into me from behind (i.e. his bumper hit my backwheel as I cycled along at about 15mph and he hit me at about 30mph)
I went through Alyson France solicitors (thanks to the recommendation on here; they have been very good), but the process has been slow as the other side have not admitted liability. However, about 2 months ago they offered 50/50 which I rejected. They have now just offered 80/20 in my favour. Now as I don’t believe I was in anyway responsible for this, my road position was good and smooth and steady, I had bright clothing on, I don’t see how this can possibly be 20% my fault!
However, if it goes to Court and the judge finds that I am more than 20% responsible then I have to pay the legal fees of both myself and the defendant from the time of the offer til when it goes to court. Therefore any compensation I get could be exceeded by the costs I have to pay! i.e. I could actually end up £000s out of pocket! This seems absurd as the driver faces no similar threat as his insurance covers his legal costs regardless!
My solicitor is confident that we will win the case and beat the 80/20 offer, but before rejecting the 80/20 offer I’m after some advice:
Any advice would be much appreciated, sorry for the long post!
Thanks,
Rob
Just to resurrect my thread from 15 months ago! A recap: I was knocked off as I cycled along a straight road in a straight line in excellent summer daylight by a car driving straight into me from behind (i.e. his bumper hit my backwheel as I cycled along at about 15mph and he hit me at about 30mph)
I went through Alyson France solicitors (thanks to the recommendation on here; they have been very good), but the process has been slow as the other side have not admitted liability. However, about 2 months ago they offered 50/50 which I rejected. They have now just offered 80/20 in my favour. Now as I don’t believe I was in anyway responsible for this, my road position was good and smooth and steady, I had bright clothing on, I don’t see how this can possibly be 20% my fault!
However, if it goes to Court and the judge finds that I am more than 20% responsible then I have to pay the legal fees of both myself and the defendant from the time of the offer til when it goes to court. Therefore any compensation I get could be exceeded by the costs I have to pay! i.e. I could actually end up £000s out of pocket! This seems absurd as the driver faces no similar threat as his insurance covers his legal costs regardless!
My solicitor is confident that we will win the case and beat the 80/20 offer, but before rejecting the 80/20 offer I’m after some advice:
- I was not wearing a helmet. Fortunately I suffered no head injuries (other than headaches) as my head did not touch the ground (I had a back pack on which I think helped a lot). However, could the judge rule this to be contributory negligence?
- Could I be held in any other way negligent?
- How thorough / long are the cases like this heard for? If the judge spends just 20 mins reading the statements and then my opponent is cross examined for just 10 mins that will be enough I think to sink him as he has contradicted himself so much - in what he has put in his bizarre Court statement versus what he put in his Police statement at the time – that my solicitor actually wrote back to my opponents solicitors reminding them of the consequences of perjury and that “I am sure you will agree the defendants statements will make for very interesting cross examination”. However, if the judge spends 2 mins, thinks no witnesses, lets go 50/50 I am screwed.
- Has anyone been in a similar position where the opponents have denied liability, then offered 50/50, then 80/20, etc – do you think they will give in before it goes to court (no date yet) and admit 100% liability?
- Do courts usually go 50/50, 75/25, 100/0, etc or do you get like 88/12?
- What other questions should I be asking my solicitor?
Any advice would be much appreciated, sorry for the long post!
Thanks,
Rob
Funny how I was last post on this before the bump.
Honestly, your solicitor should be in a better position than anyone on here to give you advice.
It all comes down to the truth vs recompense argument again. No way were you to blame in any way, but you could pay a high price for trying to prove it. If you want or need the money, I'd bite the bullet and take the 80/20.
Whatever you decide, good luck with it.
Honestly, your solicitor should be in a better position than anyone on here to give you advice.
It all comes down to the truth vs recompense argument again. No way were you to blame in any way, but you could pay a high price for trying to prove it. If you want or need the money, I'd bite the bullet and take the 80/20.
Whatever you decide, good luck with it.
