How are used Brompton prices..?

[chriswoody]

Obviously there are alternatives in the sense that there are other folding bikes. Depending from your use case they may be an alternative or not and you may have to live with some disadvantages or may get some advantages from them.
But it is silly to claim there would be alternatives if you did not have the chance to really compare those to a Brompton in daily use over a longer period of time. If you did not do that claiming the "alternative" is just plain phantasy as you don't really know what you are talking about and obviously everyone suffers from ownership-bias, Brompton owners as well as owners of other bikes.
I do own a lot of different folding bikes and to me there is no real alternative to the Brompton - but obviously there are use cases where a Brompton is not best suited for or where other bikes are better. The surprise is how well a Brompton fits to a lot of usage scenarios to a very good or at least acceptable amount whereas most other folders do have their issues here: They are in most cases not as universal or not as good fitting as a Brompton. A lot of this has to do with the fold and the small size of the package.
If you barely fold and don't have to rely on taking the bike with you where ever you go and on a small fold there are indeed alternatives. But you cannot imagine the advantages and change in practicabilty through the small package of a folded Brompton if you only talk about it in theory w/o having experienced it.

Like me, you live in Germany and know that train stations, apartment buildings etc all contain a lot of stairs. So I totally agree with you that having a bike that folds small and is easy to move around/carry in the state is a huge boon. There is no argument that a Brompton excels in that situation, however, I'm in the fortunate situation that I can easily carry my Tern up and down the stairs in the train station and the bike also easily fits in my Golf for when I need to, so for me, fold size is not an issue.

Aside from fold size, which I agree on, your post makes no other concrete argument why I should spend three times as much as my bike cost, so that I can then claim that I know what I'm talking about when I state my €400 Tern is equal to a Brompton in many other areas and is actually a very viable alternative.

 

[berlinonaut]

the bike also easily fits in my Golf for when I need to, so for me, fold size is not an issue.

Which would quickly change if you had i.e. a Smart instead of a Golf or if you had to transport considerable amounts of luggage along with the bike.
It would also change if you'd use the bike as a constant companion: My Brompton never gets locked up outside, I take it with me, be it in bars, in restaurants, in supermarkets, in offices - eases up life and no risk of theft. It you take the bike with you on public transport like the ICE-trains you'll quickly learn about the effects of folded size. If you fold 10 times a day you'll quickly learn about how importand the folding process as such is.
The fold simply changes the way you are able to use the bike drastically and as a consequence in most cases also way you really use it and, again as a consequence, also the way you behave and how your life works. You cannot imagine that - the only way is to experience it. But you can believe me: It is a drastic difference between the Brompton and basically any other folding bike.

Aside from fold size, which I agree on, your post makes no other concrete argument why I should spend three times as much as my bike cost, so that I can then claim that I know what I'm talking about when I state my €400 Tern is equal to a Brompton in many other areas and is actually a very viable alternative.

First: there is no "you should" - it is totally your decision. All I say is: Both are folders, still they are not the same thing. And claiming they would be just shows a massive blind spot due to a lack of experience and as a consequence a misjudgment.
Regarding the price: Yes, there are cheaper bikes than a Brompton but a fixation on the price leads to very poor results. The question ist the value it delivers and the real cost. A Brompton is a pretty robust bike, it is totally normal to get 20 or more years of use from it (and after that you can still sell it for considerable amounts of money). Over that period in the end the initial price does not matter too much - it comes down to like 6€/month for a well equipped Brompton, including maintenance. If you call that expensive: So be it. I'd call that cheap, especially for the value delivered and it even pays for itself quickly through cost for taxis and public transport that it saves. Here in Berlin it is the equivalent of 2 one way subway-tickets per month.

 

[berlinonaut]

Bromptons seem very expensive compared to very similar alternatives.

No, because for one there are no "very similar" alternatives, second there's always the qeustion of value you get delivered in exchange for the price (and that is in my opinion drastically higher with the Brompton than with other folders) and third they hold their value well. Typically you can sell a used Brompton roughly for about what you paid new for it years ago. Sometimes for a little less, sometimes even for a little more.

So if you only look at the price in the window and ignore everything else you may come to a statement like your's. But only then.

 

[matticus]

No, because for one there are no "very similar" alternatives, second there's always the qeustion of value you get delivered in exchange for the price (and that is in my opinion drastically higher with the Brompton than with other folders) and third they hold their value well. Typically you can sell a used Brompton roughly for about what you paid new for it years ago. Sometimes for a little less, sometimes even for a little more.

So if you only look at the price in the window and ignore everything else you may come to a statement like your's. But only then.

Drat. I was hoping to get the full page rant from you! Only a partial trolling success for Matticus this time 👿

 

[berlinonaut]

The Birdy always seemed to be the most natural competition due to broadly equivalent pricing. Many reviews I've read online say it rides better than the Brompton - but it was one of the ones I never got around to testing.

Before getting a Brompton by accident I was interested in a Birdy. From a technical perspective it is easy: If the ride quality is more important than the fold -> go for the Birdy. If the fold is as important (or more important) as the ride quality -> go for the Brompton.
Personally I'd say in the Brompton is the more universal bike - you can do everything with it you can do with the Birdy (but miss out on comfort on cobbly roads and end up earlier off road), but in exchange you get better luggage capacity, an easier fold w/o dirty fingers and a way more compact package that opens up usage and storage scenarios that are not possible with the birdy.
Pricewise the birdy is way more expensive when you buy it and it get's horrendous when you come to maintenance cost, service and spare parts (if you stick to the maintenance plan). Quality is somewhat questionable in some areas, also the Birdy, though formally on it's third iteration, lacks continuous development and improvement - R+M have hopped on the eBike- and cargobike-train and the Birdy seems just to be leftover for historical reasons, not as a core product. Also the service behaviour of R+M is not their strong side, to say it politely.

Overall this has led to me having lost interest in the Birdy. While on paper it was attractive to me (in opposite to the Brompton) looking at the whole picture roles changed: The Brompton is pretty attractive now (not saying that it could not be improved) while the Birdy has basically ruled itself out of the competition.

 

[berlinonaut]

LWaB (in the other place - does he post on here?) definitely takes his on planes - in laundry bags! I watched him+1 re-assemble theirs at Hamburg airport. They were so practiced, it took them less time than I took re-attaching my rear derailleur. Certainly not a 2-minute job though.

Would rather agree with @rogerzilla here. I am an owner of separable Moultons as well and never seperate them. While splitting them in half is quick and easy you then end up with two bulky and useless halfs that rather keep you helpless than help with anything. Sticking them into their bags is possible (I do own the proper bags as well) but in most cases needs dismantling further and still you end up with two massively bulky pieces of luggage where sharp things stick out. Getting the thing halfway compact needs further disassembly. For getting to a remote location this may or may not be acceptable, for day to day use it is totally useless. And as Moultons are expensive bikes and it is neither a good idea to leave them locked outside nor possible to take them inside with you my Moultons get only very little use.

 

[a.twiddler]

Well, as Berlinonaut says, other folders may be good in other environments, and my experience is not vast but comparing my experiences of an original Bickerton (lightweight aluminium, very good fold, but didn't inspire confidence in riding due to all the creaking and squeaking and frame flex though the actual ride was comfortable), an aluminium Dahon Vitesse D7 which felt much better put together, well finished, but a rather jarring ride.

I would'nt have thought the ride was too bad if I hadn't already got a relatively inexpensive aluminium Viking Safari which rode much better but didn't fold quite as well as the Dahon. I sold the Dahon, kept the Viking and was happy with it for several years as I didn't need something that folded any smaller. Once I bought the Brompton it ticked so many boxes. It's not just the incredibly small and quick fold, it's the general rideability. The Viking just beat it on ride quality but many larger wheeled bikes probably would too, particularly on difficult surfaces. Nevertheless, it was the Brompton that got used when I needed a folding or small wheeled bike, even for longer rides where a train might be involved, and the Viking became redundant.

My feeling is that most folding bikes are an awkward shaped package when folded, which the Brompton is not. So if you don't need such a small fold then a much less expensive option might serve you just as well, or go for much less portable folders with larger wheels though this might defeat the object of having a folder if you want to take it on trains etc. For me, though I might not need such a small fold on every trip, I find it very liberating. I wouldn't be able to get my LWB recumbent on a train, it can be a lottery getting a standard bike on a train, depending on the service and time of day, but the Brompton can get on as luggage without the faff of pre booking, and still gives a decent ride experience at either end of the trip.

 

[ExBrit]

Bromptons seem very expensive compared to very similar alternatives.

You are absolutely correct.
It all depends on your priorities. That's why we get to have these fascinating discussions. The fold is my highest priority so Bromptons are the best solution for me. No other reputable manufacturer makes a bike that folds as small as a Brompton. I have enough money that the high price doesn't bother me. If the fold wasn't so important to me I would have bought a different bike like a Birdy, Tern, or Zizzo. They are all excellent bikes and have their own advantages over the Brompton. I would never think less of a person for buying one of them.

 

[tinywheels]

there a bit like a go pro,other cameras are available. But,there's a reason why people buy them.

 

[Kell]

My three previous folders were all 26" bikes.

I snapped two Dahon frames. (No one told me that Dahons have a 90kg weight limit (for rider and luggage) which I was very effed off about as my £900 bike became worthless after little more than a year's use. And Evans were no help at all. But I digress.

Several times, I had to miss out on a particular train as there wasn't room for the bike. Realistically, while they get around the rules of no bikes on rush-hour trains, it's not really fair to other passengers and it wasn't the most effective mode of transport for me. Especially as at that time, my daughter was quite young and I needed to get back by a certain time to pick her up from childminders or nursery.

My train company started making threats that only triple-folding bikes would be allowed*, so when my second Dahon snapped, I bit the bullet and bought a Brompton. At that time, the Brompton was just £180 more than the Dahon.

*I'm guessing they couldn't implement this as the triple fold rule would have made several other small-wheeled bikes would have been outlawed too.

 

[rogerzilla]

I’m not technically adept when it comes to wheels, and I’ve never tinkered but find it fascinating and have watched several YouTube videos of various people wheel building. The only thing I’ve done is to pluck the spokes on the wheel I swapped out when fitting a new Brompton dynamo wheel.
Did you strip the wheels down to the components or loosen the spokes and start from scratch?

I stripped them down to components. They hadn't even been tight enough to set the bends for heads in/heads out; normally, if re-using spokes, you have to separate them into two half sets so they go back on the same side of the flange.

 

[yoho oy]

Whatever you do, don't get seduced by Brompton clone. See this chap here - his clone ended up costing him as a real one

View: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=_CFhOzGkLlk
Watch his other videos on adventures with a clone. Brompton used to offer interest free financing up to 2 years trough Klarna (at least in UK). It seems that this option is gone now from website... . Perhaps some other bike dealers still do that. Although the key would be "interest free", as you might end up paying even more for already expensive bike. Decathlon folders are another option. But first go to Decathlon store if you have one nearby and "play" with a model on display. As for money I think that perhaps Decathlon is an ok value, but the bike is way heavier and does not fold so portable as a Brompton.

 

[TrishE]

Which would quickly change if you had i.e. a Smart instead of a Golf or if you had to transport

I have a Carrera folding bike that fits easily in the boot of my Smart with space to spare

 

[rogerzilla]

Whatever you do, don't get seduced by Brompton clone. See this chap here - his clone ended up costing him as a real one

View: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=_CFhOzGkLlk
Watch his other videos on adventures with a clone. Brompton used to offer interest free financing up to 2 years trough Klarna (at least in UK). It seems that this option is gone now from website... . Perhaps some other bike dealers still do that. Although the key would be "interest free", as you might end up paying even more for already expensive bike. Decathlon folders are another option. But first go to Decathlon store if you have one nearby and "play" with a model on display. As for money I think that perhaps Decathlon is an ok value, but the bike is way heavier and does not fold so portable as a Brompton.

I bought a new Litepro crankset once. It was so laughably out of true and eccentric that I couldn't use it. I sold it on eBay with a brutally honest listing, basically saying the above. I got about a fiver.

 

[tinywheels]

perhaps the original poster or any other potential buyers may consider this badboy.At a smidgen over 500 dollars it appears to be a bargain