How defensive is your riding?

[Nigeyy]

Funny, just talking about this very thing yesterday at work to a friend.....

I realized I've learnt (and am still learning) about riding a bicycle on road. As someone else says, it really depends on what you consider aggressive/defensive, etc. I gave 2 identical examples to my friend from my commute: each time I saw a vehicle approaching me on a road I wouldn't be comfortable with another vehicle behind me overtaking simultaneously -and each time I looked in my mirror to see a car coming up behind me. Each time I went into a very positive primary, effectively blocking the car behind me from overtaking. I am absolutely certain given the revving noise of the engine and seeing the car starting to stray over to the centre of the road that at least in one of those cases they would have tried to overtake. This could have possibly resulted in being hit or a very nasty close pass.

Last year I remember taking a strong primary going around a sharp s-bend -again, I have no doubt the car following closely behind would have overtaken me -ploughing straight into an oncoming car that *did* come around the corner -or smushing me against the side of a stone wall as they hastily swerved to avoid it. Either one wasn't a pleasant proposition, and use of a primary was an excellent tactic to avoid this situation. Still not quite sure if the car driver appreciated it or realized what I was doing though..... I fear not.

 

[summerdays]

Riding defensively cannot be reduced to a road positioning dichotomy (primary/secondary). For me, it's far more about hazard perception; alertness and vigilance; gleaning information from the traffic environment; processing and prioritising data; understanding where conflict arises and how best to mitigate the potential dangers; being adaptable etc.

There are numerous coping strategies, defensive tactics and techniques that we can employ: such as road positioning, signalling, visibility aids, changes of speed, frequent observation and so on. If you want to hone these skills consider training, reading up on cycle craft and garnering experience and insight on the road.

As people have discussed pinch-points, the width of the pinch point, rearward observation and knowing when to hold your ground (and when to defer) are critical. However, like most things in dynamic traffic situations, it's not an exact science:

View: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Z2gehhELFZc

Very good post

I think the ability to ride assertively is also dependent upon physical fitness.

I agree with that as well - I find it a lot harder to take a primary position on a steep hill due to how slowly I cycle up them (absolutely fine on the way down!). I have also found that when I've been ill/under the weather and riding slower that again it is harder to be assertive and so I'm aware that I have a slight tendency to go closer to the gutter than I think I should be.

 

[Nigeyy]

I think that's a great post Origamist. Sums things up nicely -you have to aware of your environment, your actions, others actions and options available to you -and from these work out what is deemed best and safest for you.

The fact is even given all of those, i. unexpected things will still happen, and ii. mistakes (by you and others) will be made. For me, it's all about riding as safely as I can and reducing the probability of being road kill. And it's all you can do: reduce your probabilities and find the best methodology to do so.

Riding defensively cannot be reduced to a road positioning dichotomy (primary/secondary). For me, it's far more about hazard perception; alertness and vigilance; gleaning information from the traffic environment; processing and prioritising data; understanding where conflict arises and how best to mitigate the potential dangers; being adaptable etc.

There are numerous coping strategies, defensive tactics and techniques that we can employ: such as road positioning, signalling, visibility aids, changes of speed, frequent observation and so on. If you want to hone these skills consider training, reading up on cycle craft and garnering experience and insight on the road.

As people have discussed pinch-points, the width of the pinch point, rearward observation and knowing when to hold your ground (and when to defer) are critical. However, like most things in dynamic traffic situations, it's not an exact science:

http://www.youtube.c...h?v=Z2gehhELFZc

 

[JamesAC]

I rarely get driver anger for taking primary, but then I'm doing quite a lot of signalling. For example, coming through a pinch point I'll signal and negotiate out to primary, and point out the pedestrian refuge as to why I'm out. After the refuge, I'll move left, give a thumbs up and wave them past. This sort of thing gets me loads of thank yous from drivers that are now happy to see what and why I did, and that I'm also making an effort to make their journey easier without compromising my own safety.

On those occasions where a bad/aggressive driver does get angry, they'd get angry anyway, and then you have to deal with their driving having had less of an effect on them, and with a much smaller safety margin because you're not in primary to give you enough space to the left, you haven't moved them out enough, and they will be going much faster.

+1

Communication is the name of the game.

I consider my driving to be "assertive" rather than "defensive".

When I first started commuting to work in east London, it took me a few weeks' of "communicating" with regular motorists on my regular route .. but it did work. It got to the point where I (almost) had no need to signal my intention to move into primary when approaching a pinch point - local motorists new what I would do , and why I would do it.

Of course, some times there'd be a "stranger" on the road, and that occasionally took my breath away!

 

[elan2011]

my number one rule in big capital letters, and underlined in red ink is, to treat every thing on the road as if they are trying to kill you, and give no other road user the benfit of doubt. THERE ARE ALL OUT TO GET YOU IF YOU LET THEM.

 

[BentMikey]

my number one rule in big capital letters, and underlined in red ink is, to treat every thing on the road as if they are trying to kill you, and give no other road user the benfit of doubt. THERE ARE ALL OUT TO GET YOU IF YOU LET THEM.

People say that a lot, but I'm not sure it's a very good way to think. I don't believe drivers are out to get us at all. Mostly they are just very good and nice, and a few are just a little too impatient, or don't realise what matters to cyclists. I think you'd be better off planning ahead and anticipating what drivers are likely to want to do in 5 or 10 seconds time. Usually it's stuff they think will make their journey easier.

 

[pshore]

Aye, all good info here . There is always something new to learn.


I've read Motorcycle Roadcraft too and there was very good info in there that applies equally to a city cycle commute.

First thing was attitude. If bad things happen to you on the road and you blame others all the time then you have a bad attitude. To be a better driver/rider/cyclist you should be able to spot most dangers before they happen.

For hazard perception, essentially it says to scan the scene in front of you rather than focus ahead. And, if there is not time to scan all hazards you are going too fast. I regularly see cyclists barrelling into a complex situation and getting angry when something goes wrong.

 

[Bigsharn]

Bigsharn,
I stand in awe of your riding primary on D.C.s where the speed limit is 40-50. My experience is that many will be doing 50-60 and so close behind the car in front that if car 1 pulls out to pass you without an indicator car 2 will be confronted with your back in the middle of his lane, right in front of him at 60. If there happens to be somebody alongside him in the outside lane at the same time, all he can do is slam on and hope for the best. The speed difference is the deciding factor for me. I will take primary on the approach to a roundabout on a D.C. to avoid a left hook as they will have slowed to a more more manageable speed 30 or less.
You are in the right, but I don't have you courage.

Personally, I have the view that if they're going over the speed limit, they're in the wrong regardless. This is the particular dual carriageway I do it on in York:

Needless to say I'm on the road anyway by then (sod crossing the pavement to cycle on a cycle lane rats wouldn't live in) so it's just a natural occurance.

...I did forget to mention that I take primary when turning as well so people can't do anything stupid like overtake

 

[funnymummy]

I've spent 7 years towing my 2 youngest children, first in a trailer & then last 2 years with my middle son on his Mission Piggyback- Both are wider then my bike, so I have no choice but to ride wide or i'd by dragging the left wheel through drains & gutter rubbish.... So i've got used to being in a certain posistion on the road, and apart from the odd muppet have never had many problems with other traffic.... It's now my 'default' setting, I did try to make a concious effort to ride in closer when on my own - but discovered that most cars will try to skim by me leaving less then enough room for a cats whisker. So I am more then happy to carry on riding 3 feet from the kerb, The driver behind may not like it, they may rev their engine at me, occasionaly beep their horn, but they will slow down & they will cross the white lines to pass me... Once it's clear enough for them to pass

 

[Roadrunner78]

I've spent 7 years towing my 2 youngest children, first in a trailer & then last 2 years with my middle son on his Mission Piggyback- Both are wider then my bike, so I have no choice but to ride wide or i'd by dragging the left wheel through drains & gutter rubbish.... So i've got used to being in a certain posistion on the road, and apart from the odd muppet have never had many problems with other traffic.... It's now my 'default' setting, I did try to make a concious effort to ride in closer when on my own - but discovered that most cars will try to skim by me leaving less then enough room for a cats whisker. So I am more then happy to carry on riding 3 feet from the kerb, The driver behind may not like it, they may rev their engine at me, occasionaly beep their horn, but they will slow down & they will cross the white lines to pass me... Once it's clear enough for them to pass

Great post. Many great posts. True to my usual cycle chat experience i have learned a lot.

To pick up on some previous points i'll first say im in a small town with no cycle lanes at all. My main route has many pedestrian refuge's. Most of the drivers are nice but boy racers and the odd German vehicle driving muppet spoil it.

I find out of town cycling is better?? I am surprised by this as the 60mph to my speed should be more of a problem than 30/40mph to my speed. I agree with the post that said 3 feet out then car 2 passing to find me there would be a problem. This happens in town as well as they drive following a bumper, sometimes not thinking.

Mr oragamist i tip my hat to an excellent post, and to the other city cyclists posts. Experience is key thus thank you for taking the time to post.

 

[gbb]

Great post. Many great posts. True to my usual cycle chat experience i have learned a lot.

To pick up on some previous points i'll first say im in a small town with no cycle lanes at all. My main route has many pedestrian refuge's. Most of the drivers are nice but boy racers and the odd German vehicle driving muppet spoil it.

I find out of town cycling is better?? I am surprised by this as the 60mph to my speed should be more of a problem than 30/40mph to my speed. I agree with the post that said 3 feet out then car 2 passing to find me there would be a problem. This happens in town as well as they drive following a bumper, sometimes not thinking.

Mr oragamist i tip my hat to an excellent post, and to the other city cyclists posts. Experience is key thus thank you for taking the time to post.

Ironically, although countryside cycling is better, partially because there are fewer cars to contend with, i did read once that you are statistically MORE likely to be involved in an accident in the countryside because drivers are concentrating less than in towns, for the same reason you enjoy cycling there...there's fewer cars to worry about.
.

I find it hard to believe myself, but do remember reading that some years ago.