How to navigate this right turn?

[united4ever]

Not the most crazy junction I know but for me it is the hairiest part of my commute.

I have to make a right turn at the next lights up from the one posted in the link (200 metres further on).

As I approach the lights in the below link they are often on red or traffic pretty slow/static anyway so I like to use this opportunity to get in the correct lane for my eventual right turn. Would you agree that getting in that cycle space (but to the right hand side) in front of the car sitting in the overtaking lane is the right way to do this?

https://www.google.co.in/maps/@53.3...VMBREs2Yff7VHQu6xA!2e0!7i13312!8i6656!6m1!1e1

When I started out I used to just filter down the left hand cycle lane (which I have since learnt is the most dangerous way) then dismount and cross at the ped crossing.

Eventually I get onto the canal towpath which is great but this short stretch is a bit hairy I must say.

 

[ianrauk]

Would you agree that getting in that cycle space (but to the right hand side) in front of the car sitting in the overtaking lane is the right way to do this?

Yes. Absolutely. Take the lane and give drivers behind clear indication that you are turning right.

 

[numbnuts]

By the law you should not enter yellow boxes, so you could move up to the box, but not in it however you will be a long way back from the said turning and on a busy day you could be there forever..............

 

[summerdays]

If the lights were on red as I approached I'd be in the middle of the left lane until I was near the tail of the queue of cars waiting to turn right then change and possibly queue in line if I was likely to make it through in the next sequence. Otherwise I might filter forward.... Depends on the relative speed of traffic in both lanes. One I do regularly I do the opposite and move into the right hand lane even before it exists... As cars tend to accelorate when they see the free lane hoping to make it through, but they are normally green!

Edit just twigged it's a straight on and right lane! Given that I would be more tempted to filter forwards.

 

[jefmcg]

Yes. Absolutely. Take the lane and give drivers behind clear indication that you are turning right.

+1 And while you are waiting to turn, keep your arm out and make lots of eye contact with the cars coming towards you. I find this encourages them to pause to let you through. Be cautious in the turn and watch out that both lanes have stopped, and there is no cyclist filtering in the far lane.

 

[summerdays]

By the law you should not enter yellow boxes, so you could move up to the box, but not in it however you will be a long way back from the said turning and on a busy day you could be there forever..............

You can enter it if turning right and you are prevented from leaving by on coming traffic, but not if there was traffic backed up in the side road.... It's about whether your exit is free isn't it?

 

[united4ever]

Thanks. How would you give clear indication that you are turning right at the next junction (not the one that i am at)? Of course when i get closer to the turning junction i will signal.

 

[numbnuts]

You can enter it if turning right and you are prevented from leaving by on coming traffic, but not if there was traffic backed up in the side road.... It's about whether your exit is free isn't it?

You must not enter the yellow box junction unless you can clear it without stopping.
http://www.rulesoftheroad.ie/rules-for-driving/junctions-roundabouts/yellow-box-junctions.html

 

[jefmcg]

You must not enter the yellow box junction unless you can clear it without stopping.
http://www.rulesoftheroad.ie/rules-for-driving/junctions-roundabouts/yellow-box-junctions.html

The OP is in Manchester, UK, so UK laws apply. From the HC

Rule 174
Box junctions. These have criss-cross yellow lines painted on the road (see ‘Road markings’). You MUST NOT enter the box until your exit road or lane is clear. However, you may enter the box and wait when you want to turn right, and are only stopped from doing so by oncoming traffic, or by other vehicles waiting to turn right. At signalled roundabouts you MUST NOT enter the box unless you can cross over it completely without stopping.

(actually, that's much what the Irish site says too, if you click the link)

 

[mjr]

Altrincham isn't in Ireland, is it? http://highwaycode.info/rule/174 "you may enter the box and wait when you want to turn right, and are only stopped from doing so by oncoming traffic, or by other vehicles waiting to turn right"

Edit: waves at @jefmcg

 

[winjim]

You must not enter the yellow box junction unless you can clear it without stopping.
http://www.rulesoftheroad.ie/rules-for-driving/junctions-roundabouts/yellow-box-junctions.html

An exception is when you want to turn right.

That's a foreign website anyway isn't it?

Edit: Waves at @mjray

 

[jefmcg]

Edit: waves at @jefmcg

we both blow raspberries towards @winjim

 

[winjim]

To answer the op:

This is similar to part of my commute where I take the right hand lane prior to a right turn, although I have no yellow boxes to contend with. My strategy is similar to those posted upthread.

Firstly, I would ignore the left hand cycle filter lane into the ASZ. I know it's the legal way to get there but if the traffic starts moving you'll be stranded on the left and have to cross two lanes of traffic to turn right.

If I was able to safely get there before the lights changed, I would filter down the centre into the ASZ and put myself in primary ahead of the traffic in the right hand lane. That way the yellow box becomes irrelevant as there shouldn't be anybody in it.

If I couldn't safely filter to the ASZ, my strategy would depend on knowledge of the road conditions. If I knew there was likely to be a lot of traffic turning right at the yellow box, I would filter forwards as much as is safe, then put myself in primary position in the left hand lane, and change lanes just after the yellow box, while traffic in the right hand lane is held back by the right turners.

If I knew that right turning at the yellow box was rare, I would put myself in primary in the right hand lane and just go with the traffic. If held back at the yellow box by a right turner there is always the option of nipping round them on the left if it's safe, or just waiting.

Then it's 200m of primary all the way until the actual right turn. Keep looking behind you so the traffic behind knows you know what you're doing, at this point the combination of your road positioning and observation is effectively your signal. Then it's a good, early, clear arm signal, stand your ground until it's clear to turn and off you go.

 

[Markymark]

You must not enter the yellow box junction unless you can clear it without stopping.
http://www.rulesoftheroad.ie/rules-for-driving/junctions-roundabouts/yellow-box-junctions.html

Not true: HC states:

Rule 174
Box junctions. These have criss-cross yellow lines painted on the road (see ‘Road markings’). You MUST NOT enter the box until your exit road or lane is clear. However, you may enter the box and wait when you want to turn right, and are only stopped from doing so by oncoming traffic, or by other vehicles waiting to turn right. At signalled roundabouts you MUST NOT enter the box unless you can cross over it completely without stopping.

 

[united4ever]

Thanks winjim, that makes sense and is what I have started to do. No complaints so far but I can almost feel the disapointment when I plonk myself right in front of that car in the right hand lane waiting at the lights (they are probably hoping to put their foot down at the green light). I do not hang about and generally keep up with the traffic in the left hand lane though. But yes, those are the rules and accepted theory is that this is the safest way so I shall continue with it.