How would you improve central London Cycling?

[mjr]

awesome - thanks. why do these things often not show up on maps? Even sustrans shows nothing around Paddington. Will have to just explore a bit I think. CS3 will take me to Hyde park which is a start.

They show up on maps I use. I checked these on https://cycle.travel/map which builds on www.osm.org/?layers=C because my memory isn't perfect.

Sustrans mapping is awful. I believe it was part of the basis for http://www.klwnbug.co.uk/2018/07/05/kings-lynns-imaginary-cycling-network/ which I discussed in another post.

 

[Lonestar]

The apps seem crap.I looked up a route once and it advised me to take Leytonstone High Road...which I dislike immensely...when for a fact there are backstreets that take me to the same location.Waterloo is a bit gutty but I take backstreets till mainly and a bit of main road at Blacjkfriars to get me onto Southwark Bridge.

Also I discovered Quietway 14 on Sunday which is better than going via Elephant and Castle.

 

[PhilDawson8270]

Well, let's do nothi g then and allow the pollution.l and carnage to continue un abated. It's the easy way out I guess.

That's the spirit!

On a more serious note, I just wish that other areas of the country were brought to somewhere even close to the level of cycling infrastructure that is available in London.

Here in Norfolk, they built a new northern dual carriageway to bypass all the country lanes. Which is great, apart from they have a good 30 to 40ft either side of the carriageways before the hedges. They put some astroturf kind of thing down. They missed a huge opportunity to have a totally segregated cycle lane with no footpaths nearby that would give safe cycling access to nearly everywhere in the city from surrounding villages.

Instead, cyclists are stuck with unlit single carriageway NSL roads, or an unlit dual carriageway which sees a cyclist incident every month almost.

Government needs to look to do more with cycling infrastructure outside of the capital before continuing to bury money into London.

 

[DCBassman]

Maybe it would be best if everyone agreed what good cycling infrastructure actually is, then set some proper standards. Because there doesn't seem to be that agreement or those standards, anywhere in UK.

 

[crazyjoe101]

I'd teach everyone how to operate their vehicle or 2 feet as applicable.

 

[Heltor Chasca]

Having just been through Den Haag, Utrecht and Rotterdam by bike I can’t even imagine where we would start. Stuff gets delivered, the shops and eateries are stocked and heaving with custom. There are sockwits here in the NL on bikes, mopeds and in cars. Nothing is perfect.

I commuted in London for 5 years by bike before it was a thing so I don’t have the knowledge of these new London systems but they sound worlds away from the ideal.

 

[mjr]

Maybe it would be best if everyone agreed what good cycling infrastructure actually is, then set some proper standards. Because there doesn't seem to be that agreement or those standards, anywhere in UK.

How about https://cycletraffic-elearning.com/ (aka IAN 195/16)?

We've more standards than we can shake several sticks at. What's really needed is to pick one and force all road-builders to stick to it. Not even Highways England seems to stick to their own standard yet. To be frank, I'd accept consistency over perfection as a start. It sucks that I know several places where I can ride to a borough (in London) or county (elsewhere) boundary and see cycling provision change between extremes.

 

[mjr]

Here in Norfolk, they built a new northern dual carriageway to bypass all the country lanes. Which is great, apart from they have a good 30 to 40ft either side of the carriageways before the hedges. They put some astroturf kind of thing down. They missed a huge opportunity to have a totally segregated cycle lane with no footpaths nearby that would give safe cycling access to nearly everywhere in the city from surrounding villages.

You're being far too kind to Norfolk County Council. Saying they missed a huge opportunity ignores that it was pointed out that they could build cycleways along and across it because there was space and it would require very little extra money (less than the budget overrun which I think was over £60m) and it was requested several times, but as I understand it, NCC accepted in their response to the planning inspector that the road as designed would harm cycling and then built it anyway, to an edition of the Design Manual already superceded by the time they built it. Several cyclists have been knocked down trying to cycle across the roundabouts.

Despite that, Norwich has just been given yet another grant to build more pedalways in places where the neighbouring villages can now reach less easily. Meanwhile, the rest of Norfolk gets SFA yet again (like most non-city areas).

Government should do more with cycling infrastructure into and outside of the cities before continuing to bury money into Norwich.

 

[srw]

So how would you improve cycling in central London?

I'd start by going from just about no cyclists on the road to having thousands. It might take 20 years or so, but it'll help a lot. Drivers will get used to having bikes around. Then I'd introduce a congestion charge on most road vehicles, pricing through traffic off the roads. I'd probably start up a few bike hire schemes - perhaps one official one which is dirt cheap but needs docking stations. It might even become a tourist attraction and see visitors to the capital use them either to get around or to have a play around the parks. Then I'd build a couple of through routes which are obvious, well signposted and don't have too many traffic lights or hills in them. I wouldn't worry too much about fulfilling some notional perfect segregation schema - life's too short for that, and it discourages treating bikes as traffic. Instead I'd just focus on providing pretty decent routes, and accept that they don't always go where people want to ride so they'll just use the roads. I'd also do some work on integrating cycling into other modes of transport. I'd probably make sure that it was easy to find a cab big enough to take a bike and that all the mainline stations had loads of double-decker bike parks. And since it's not really practical to let full-sized bikes onto overcrowded commuter trains I'd hope that an entrepreneurial folding bike company decided to make London its home.

I can't think where I got that inspiration from. Perhaps others can help remind me?

 

[Mrklaw]

How about https://cycletraffic-elearning.com/ (aka IAN 195/16)?

We've more standards than we can shake several sticks at. What's really needed is to pick one and force all road-builders to stick to it. Not even Highways England seems to stick to their own standard yet. To be frank, I'd accept consistency over perfection as a start. It sucks that I know several places where I can ride to a borough (in London) or county (elsewhere) boundary and see cycling provision change between extremes.

That’s great. Even something simple like
- 20mph road : riding alongside vehicles
- 30mph road : painted dedicated cycle lane
- 40mph road : physically segregated cycle lane

In particular too many roads have cycle lanes painted on for a few yards then they abruptly stop, or are covered by roadworks/delivery vehicles etc.

 

[Tin Pot]

I've been experimenting with Boris bikes to get from Paddington to Tottenham Court Road and realising how bad cycling infrastructure is in central London. My previous job was by tower bridge and that had decent segregated lanes almost all the way to Waterloo.

So how would you improve cycling in central London? Thinking within the ring formed by the main line stations - Paddington to Liverpool Street East-West, and kings cross to Waterloo/Victoria North-south

My first thought is - there are so many little roads, not much space for segregation but I think it’d be fairly straightforward to make some cycle only - so no cars at all. There are still more than enough roads around for traffic

I think you could make at least one solid east west route, and then have a few N/S links to it

Secondly the stations are really badly set up for cyclists. Waterloo has no real safe routes until you’re clear of the station - same with Paddington. They are updating Paddington at the moment for cross rail - they should include connection to cycle routes

Erm. Paddington to Tott Ct Rd is a piece of piss. You can even dip into Hyde park if you want.

It sounds like you don’t like sharing roads with cars?

 

[srw]

Erm. Paddington to Tott Ct Rd is a piece of piss. You can even dip into Hyde park if you want.

It sounds like you don’t like sharing roads with cars?

Quite. Just pootle through the back streets of Marylebone. There's hardly any traffic there anyway.

 

[Mrklaw]

Went to Brighton for the day today. Driving along the Lewes road (A270?) they had lovely cycle lanes. Separate painted lines alongside the bus lanes, so well separated from other vehicles, and at bus stops the cycle lane went around the back of the bus stop so that buses didn’t cross or block the cycle lane - brilliant!

 

[vickster]

Went to Brighton for the day today. Driving along the Lewes road (A270?) they had lovely cycle lanes. Separate painted lines alongside the bus lanes, so well separated from other vehicles, and at bus stops the cycle lane went around the back of the bus stop so that buses didn’t cross or block the cycle lane - brilliant!

Why were you driving and not cycling?

 

[Mrklaw]

Why were you driving and not cycling?

Its a long way from windsor to cycle also I don’t actually have a bike yet (looking at getting a Brompton for the commute)