Is Garmin the only answer?

[derrick]

Pound for pound it's much better than owt Garmin sell, but in absolute terms my Garmin Touring makes it look a bit puny. You know, like the speccy kid who gets picked on by everyone, even by the other nerds.

Your Garmin seems to have a bigger ego than you.

 

[graham bowers]

I guess we all have our favourite route tool for creating routes. Mine is cycle.travel as it produces routes on nice quiet roads, and you can edit the route if you find something you don't like (rare), and you can output a paper copy for backup. cyclestreets is good too and you can choose between fastest, balanced or quietest options, however it doesn't seem possible to edit the routes produced. RWGPS is pretty good too although will route you down some busy roads, however you can edit around those.

I'd never thought of using google maps and checking today, I see it's not possible to directly output a gpx file, however there is a work around; you have to drop the route url into another 3rd party web page. I didn't find the google maps very visually appealing as they do not represent cycle tracks very well. I usually like to check the route on a PC as finding a route error when you are several days from home is,err, unappealing.

I'm a Garmin 810 user so I copy the gpx files with a usb cable from my PC to the onboard micro sd card. I've had a fair bit of bother with the Garmin, random freeze ups and switching off, but it's never left me totally up the creek. Problems seem to happen more often when using turn by turn navigation and recording at the same time. By the way, I do record heart rate data, don't know if that's important to you? Doubt my next unit will be a Garmin.

When touring, I create all of the routes in advance, so I am scripting up to a couple of weeks in advance. I would like to be able to be more flexible; by this I mean to create routes using my preferred routing website when on tour without use of a PC, so probably a mobile phone. Not sure if the current crop of devices allow that, it seems the Wahoo / RWGPS setup would be one way.

Anyway, I hope some of these ramblings help. I think it's most important to have your requirements fully understood at as detailed level as possible at the outset, and hopefully this and the other posts in this thread will give you food for thought.

 

[Heltor Chasca]

The war between Garmin and Wahoo is verging on tribalism.

Just read an article in the latest copy of Arrivée. (Audax mag) Great story on one rider’s AAA (altitude award) and nearly 30 point attempt. (Alan Steele)

Using his Garmin 1030, the device failed to record the altitude for first 4 days out of 9! Yet another story of a failed Garmin. I don't understand why Garmin haven’t got on top top of their issues. They must be losing loyalty hand over fist from disgruntled owners and bad press.

Anyway it ends well: LUCKILY he was also running a Wahoo Elemnt Bolt. Although this device records 5-7% less elevation than Garmin for some reason, he still managed to achieve most of his AAA points (25.25)

Awesome stuff.

 

[HobbesOnTour]

When touring, I create all of the routes in advance, so I am scripting up to a couple of weeks in advance. I would like to be able to be more flexible; by this I mean to create routes using my preferred routing website when on tour without use of a PC, so probably a mobile phone. Not sure if the current crop of devices allow that, it seems the Wahoo / RWGPS setup would be one way.

If you have an OnTheGo (OTG) enabled phone or tablet you have that option with your current Garmin.
Plot a route on whatever app/website you like on your phone or tablet (easier said than done!), save it as gpx/tcx and using a cable transfer from your phone to your gps device.
What this means is that by using OSMand (with maps already downloaded onto the phone/tablet) you can plot routes on the fly without needing an internet connection. Total independence!

The big advantage of a Wahoo is that you can do this via Bluetooth from the Wahoo phone app, but, you need an internet connection to process the new route in the app.
The disadvantage of Wahoo is that while you can transfer a file via cable from PC to unit, you cannot do it from phone/tablet to unit - or at least I haven't been able to do it.

Just remember, plotting routes on a phone or tablet can be a frustrating job!

 

[HobbesOnTour]

I guess we all have our favourite route tool for creating routes.

Just on that..... A lot of people get peed off with their gps units for not working properly when in fact, the problem is not the route following, more to do with the route creation.

I think it may be a hangover from car gps devices, where everything is done on one unit. Most GPS devices for cycling need to be paired with an effective route planning/design app or website.

 

[Sbudge]

If you have an OnTheGo (OTG) enabled phone or tablet you have that option with your current Garmin.
Plot a route on whatever app/website you like on your phone or tablet (easier said than done!), save it as gpx/tcx and using a cable transfer from your phone to your gps device.
What this means is that by using OSMand (with maps already downloaded onto the phone/tablet) you can plot routes on the fly without needing an internet connection. Total independence!

The big advantage of a Wahoo is that you can do this via Bluetooth from the Wahoo phone app, but, you need an internet connection to process the new route in the app.
The disadvantage of Wahoo is that while you can transfer a file via cable from PC to unit, you cannot do it from phone/tablet to unit - or at least I haven't been able to do it.

Just remember, plotting routes on a phone or tablet can be a frustrating job!

With a little lateral thinking you can get from RWGPS to a Garmin device without the need for any cables. (Garmin Connect allows for bluetooth upload of routes to the device from a phone and RWGPS can export to Garmin Connect easy enough.)

 

[fossala]

Seconded

I can't comment on Wahoos as I don't have one, but I've used AA powered Garmins (76s, 60CSx, Oregon) for many trouble-free years. I currently use an Oregon, which is a bit like a fancy version of the etrex. I do have an Edge Touring, and while it works OK, and it gives me turn-by-turn beeps, which the Oregon doesn't, I just don't like it as much as the Oregon.

For day to day riding you can't beat the features of the Elemnt, it's way ahead of my eTrex 30.
For touring I wouldn't want to be with anything other than my eTrex.
Right tool for the job.

 

[graham bowers]

If you have an OnTheGo (OTG) enabled phone or tablet you have that option with your current Garmin.
Plot a route on whatever app/website you like on your phone or tablet (easier said than done!), save it as gpx/tcx and using a cable transfer from your phone to your gps device.
What this means is that by using OSMand (with maps already downloaded onto the phone/tablet) you can plot routes on the fly without needing an internet connection. Total independence!

The big advantage of a Wahoo is that you can do this via Bluetooth from the Wahoo phone app, but, you need an internet connection to process the new route in the app.
The disadvantage of Wahoo is that while you can transfer a file via cable from PC to unit, you cannot do it from phone/tablet to unit - or at least I haven't been able to do it.

Just remember, plotting routes on a phone or tablet can be a frustrating job!

Thanks, I'd been told of OTG before by, I believe, @tallliman. Trouble is, my reading indicated Apple phones do not support OTG. I do have an ancient Android tablet, however, and it seems that supports OTG, so I'll have to give it a go.

 

[tom73]

I’ve said it so many times too: As soon as I touch ‘W’ on my iPad, predictive text auto-scribes ‘Wahoo Elemnt’

You have that problem too thought it was just mine. Nice to know it's a known effect of Wahoo owners.

 

[HobbesOnTour]

With a little lateral thinking you can get from RWGPS to a Garmin device without the need for any cables. (Garmin Connect allows for bluetooth upload of routes to the device from a phone and RWGPS can export to Garmin Connect easy enough.)

That's true, but can you plan a route on the RideWithGPS app? It's been a while, but I don't think you can.

With the appropriate cable, a route planner that works offline (Osmand) he can create routes while on the road, totally offline and send them to his device.

As I understand it, this process will also work for Garmin units that do not have Bluetooth.

 

[graham bowers]

With a little lateral thinking you can get from RWGPS to a Garmin device without the need for any cables. (Garmin Connect allows for bluetooth upload of routes to the device from a phone and RWGPS can export to Garmin Connect easy enough.)

Hey, thanks, that worked. Well, in the usual Garmin "sometimes" manner, but it did work once (after many tries) so I have something to build on.
I created a route in cycle.travel on my iPhone, then from cycle.travel I sent it to Garmin Connect Mobile on the iPhone, then from there, to my paired 810.

 

[graham bowers]

Just on that..... A lot of people get peed off with their gps units for not working properly when in fact, the problem is not the route following, more to do with the route creation.

I think it may be a hangover from car gps devices, where everything is done on one unit. Most GPS devices for cycling need to be paired with an effective route planning/design app or website.

Quite agree. I'd go so far as to say the factors also include the maps. In fact the whole list of things that can cause problems is likely to be:
GPS unit
Firmware version
micro SD card
maps
Routing file. There seem to be several "versions" of .gpx files, with different html tags (my terminology may be off there).

I did go through a world of hurt with my 810 and was oh-so-close to tickling it with a full swing blow from a cleaving axe. I gave it a final warning, then loaded the latest firmware, latest OSM maps and stuck with cycle.travel and it is now rare to have problems.

 

[PaulSB]

If you have an OnTheGo (OTG) enabled phone or tablet you have that option with your current Garmin.
Plot a route on whatever app/website you like on your phone or tablet (easier said than done!), save it as gpx/tcx and using a cable transfer from your phone to your gps device.
What this means is that by using OSMand (with maps already downloaded onto the phone/tablet) you can plot routes on the fly without needing an internet connection. Total independence!

The big advantage of a Wahoo is that you can do this via Bluetooth from the Wahoo phone app, but, you need an internet connection to process the new route in the app.
The disadvantage of Wahoo is that while you can transfer a file via cable from PC to unit, you cannot do it from phone/tablet to unit - or at least I haven't been able to do it.

Just remember, plotting routes on a phone or tablet can be a frustrating job!

I may have completely misunderstood you but one of the great advantages of Wahoo is one doesn't need a cable connection for file transfer between devices.

Routes which have been created in RWGPS, Strava and other supported mapping sites will appear in the Wahoo app. It's then just a case of syncing the phone and the unit for all routes to be on the Wahoo.

 

[Broadside]

I would like to be able to be more flexible; by this I mean to create routes using my preferred routing website when on tour without use of a PC, so probably a mobile phone

This is improbably easy with a Wahoo Elemnt. You can route plan with something like Strava or Ride With GPS and it appears on the Wahoo device by Bluetooth or WiFi.

The simplest route planner app for use while standing on the side of the road is Easy Route, I picked this up from DCRainmaker. Then you sync it straight across to the Wahoo Companion app and voila it’s on the device so you can ride immmediately.

So far I haven’t found reason to plug in the cable on the Wahoo Elemnt apart from to charge it. Everything is done by Bluetooth to your phone so you have ultimate flexibility while away from home.

Btw, I was previously a Garmin Edge 800 user, I had trouble free use for 5 years but the Wahoo Elemnt gives another level of flexibility, it’s brilliant.

 

[HobbesOnTour]

I may have completely misunderstood you but one of the great advantages of Wahoo is one doesn't need a cable connection for file transfer between devices.

Routes which have been created in RWGPS, Strava and other supported mapping sites will appear in the Wahoo app. It's then just a case of syncing the phone and the unit for all routes to be on the Wahoo.

No, you haven't misunderstood.
What I was referring to was the ability to do it all offline.

Currently, with Wahoo, you can create the route offline but to import it into the app you do need an internet connection, either data or wifi.
The advantage of using a cable to transfer the file to the unit is that no internet connection is required as the app is bypassed.

Of course, if you have an internet connection, you can use the "Take me to" functionality of the app, no need to go an external planner.

It is about the only advantage the Garmin has over the Wahoo units, in my (admittedly Garmin unfriendly opinion).
And it really only applies to those touring in places where internet connectivity is an issue.