Jonathon Tiernan Locke blood passport iffy? (ToB title for Haas?)

[Noodley]

Sounds to me as if Brailsford is trying too hard to get his message over to Walsh and may have sacrificed JTL.

 

[dellzeqq]

True but as the speculative article says, if he tells white lies and then the true story comes out, it looks pretty bad for the Walsh/Sky/Brailsford embedding.
Plausible at least, I'd say!

I'd say it was Cycling Weakly's editor being an arse.

 

[deptfordmarmoset]

I'd say it was Cycling Weakly's editor being an arse.

The article frames it in a way that suggests how rumour enterprise works without saying it was the product itself (because rumour enterprise doesn't actually need one).

Meanwhile, the timing of the leak and that fact that McQuaid's son is JTL's agent still intrigues me.

 

[Pedrosanchezo]

Interesting article that.

Is it possible that Walsh has contacts who informed him there was a rider (rider 634BX) with a bio passport problem. They won't have revealed names but maybe he decided that it was too close a coincidence when JTL pulled out of the Worlds. Walsh then has a hunch and puts pressure on Brailsford to let the cat out the bag.

If DB covers it up he could then become part of the story and suspicions would be cast on Sky, should JTL be found guilty.

Unless Walsh knows more than has been reported, then his breaking of the story was premature and unethical. JTL deserves the anonymity the situation, at this point, requires.

 

[psmiffy]

The UCI then informs the rider - and only the rider - that he has 30 days to gather data and explain himself.
Read more at http://www.cyclingweekly.co.uk/news...emained-confidential.html#Vy0Jv8Gvm1fqBjIL.99

Just out of a matter of interest how do you gather "data" - particularly from a period where it sounds like the official record is somewhat sketchy - and explain it.

 

[rich p]

This is a reasonable explanation of how the BP works from inrng
http://inrng.com/2013/10/uci-bio-passport-tiernan-locke/

 

[rich p]

I'd say it was Cycling Weakly's editor being an arse.

He is an arse - that's beyond debate but the story was leaked by someone.
The data gatherers and analysts do their work without knowing the athlete's identity. The story must have been leaked by someone from the UCI, WADA,SKY,JTL or maybe some other acronym I've forgotten!

 

[psmiffy]

This is a reasonable explanation of how the BP works from inrng
http://inrng.com/2013/10/uci-bio-passport-tiernan-locke/

So basically -he says she says - having been flagged and the experts deciding to raise the question - on the balance of probabilities he will get a ban - not necessarily because he is guilty but because his BP is unexplained.

 

[rich p]

So basically -he says she says - having been flagged and the experts deciding to raise the question - on the balance of probabilities he will get a ban - not necessarily because he is guilty but because his BP is unexplained.

I don't read it like that!
If the anomalies are large enough for 3 experts to agree independently that a doping violation is likely then the athlete is asked to provide another explanation. If he can't then he is liable to be banned. The BP is to catch athletes clever enough to avoid getting a positive test by micro-manipulation. IMHO, that's a good thing as long as you accept that the process is rigorous and reliable.

 

[User169]

This is a reasonable explanation of how the BP works from inrng
http://inrng.com/2013/10/uci-bio-passport-tiernan-locke/

Interesting comment re the Colombia es Pasion team. Like Endura, they're outside the BP, but they paid for it to be done anyway. Quintana and Henao could show a good lot of data to European teams interested in taking them on.

 

[User169]

So basically -he says she says - having been flagged and the experts deciding to raise the question - on the balance of probabilities he will get a ban - not necessarily because he is guilty but because his BP is unexplained.

No. He says we don't know how likely it is that a "prosecution" will follow since we don't know how many riders get flagged and whay happens when they do.

 

[psmiffy]

I don't read it like that!
If the anomalies are large enough for 3 experts to agree independently that a doping violation is likely then the athlete is asked to provide another explanation. If he can't then he is liable to be banned. The BP is to catch athletes clever enough to avoid getting a positive test by micro-manipulation. IMHO, that's a good thing as long as you accept that the process is rigorous and reliable.

I actually think we are in agreement - the unusual thing here is tho he has not gone from ordinary to superhuman - but from good to an also ran (Im assuming that is the gist of the anomaly) - the cause of the fall could be attributed to illness - or the illness could be attributed to the problem - still leaves an element of doubt - does he get the benefit of it - and should he get a ban and on his return to racing his form returns presumably with a return to the blood values he had when he was going well does he get flagged again.

 

[Strathlubnaig]

- and should he get a ban and on his return to racing his form returns presumably with a return to the blood values he had when he was going well does he get flagged again.

A ban for taking what, exactly ?

 

[psmiffy]

A ban for taking what, exactly ?

That was the question that was on my mind - I seem to remember not so long ago that two or three riders were "suspended" because of BP anomalies

 

[amaferanga]

I actually think we are in agreement - the unusual thing here is tho he has not gone from ordinary to superhuman - but from good to an also ran (Im assuming that is the gist of the anomaly) - the cause of the fall could be attributed to illness - or the illness could be attributed to the problem - still leaves an element of doubt - does he get the benefit of it - and should he get a ban and on his return to racing his form returns presumably with a return to the blood values he had when he was going well does he get flagged again.

I don't think the gist of the anomaly is as simple as a dip in form. There's clearly something very suspicious with his blood values - if that is down to illness then it should be possible for JTL to demonstrate that in his reply. If he tries to use illness as an explanation and the doping experts aren't convinced then he will likely get a ban because they would deem that it's highly improbable that the anomalies aren't doping related.

Why should he get the benefit of the doubt when 3 experts in the field of doping agree that the only explanation for his blood values is that he's been doping? Would you say the same of it was Vinokourov or Contador? Amongst others Pellizotti served a 2 year ban for suspicious blood values without actually testing positive.

This may all come to nothing and it could all be down to his illness, but if he gets a ban then I certainly won't have any sympathy for him.