Lazy people
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Moodyman
Legendary Member
Of course there must be lazy people.
But there are also lazy people who brush all dole-beneficiaries as well...lazy. Some peoples' circumstances are beyond their control and they've no choice but to seek help from the state.
I'm really liking how Cafe has turned into the new CA&D 
.
The long term unemployed is made up of all sorts of people. At the moment things are very skewed as there are plenty of people who are not 'unemployable' as people put it but who are long term unemployed because of how extreme the slump is. There are people who are highly employable in normal circumstances simply unable to get a job. The long term unemployed is a bit misleading in the sense that the stats tells us that over say ten years people will drift in and out of employment - people who are long term unemployed will often have had jobs 2/3 years ago - very few are permanently unemployed as newspapers like to portray say 25 years.
I would say that the psychological effects of being on benefits start to kick in after about 3 months. If you have no support network and the unlucky enough circumstances you can sink very low.
I don't think it's useful to characterise the unemployed as lazy, I don't think as a group they are any more 'lazy' than the working population, it's just they are sat one side of the desk and someone else isn't. It could very easily be the other way round.
.The long term unemployed is made up of all sorts of people. At the moment things are very skewed as there are plenty of people who are not 'unemployable' as people put it but who are long term unemployed because of how extreme the slump is. There are people who are highly employable in normal circumstances simply unable to get a job. The long term unemployed is a bit misleading in the sense that the stats tells us that over say ten years people will drift in and out of employment - people who are long term unemployed will often have had jobs 2/3 years ago - very few are permanently unemployed as newspapers like to portray say 25 years.
I would say that the psychological effects of being on benefits start to kick in after about 3 months. If you have no support network and the unlucky enough circumstances you can sink very low.
I don't think it's useful to characterise the unemployed as lazy, I don't think as a group they are any more 'lazy' than the working population, it's just they are sat one side of the desk and someone else isn't. It could very easily be the other way round.
fossyant
Ride It Like You Stole It!
- Location
- South Manchester
There are also professional dole folk - whole families. My niece went out with a lad whose whole family were on the dole, and knew how to milk the system (including illness benefits). They had every mod. con.
My ex colleagues' in-laws were also professional benefits claimers - would make their 'ailments' appear worse when visited, or on assessments. They also had a number of static caravans that they rented out (these aren't cheap at £20k-£30k a pop). He absolutely hated them as he and his parents were hard grafters - his wife didn't think it a problem (which she wouldn't).
There are real genuine folk that struggle, and those that milk it - I hate those that milk it.
My mate can get hardly any benefits assistance (recently made redundant) and is struggling to pay the mortgage, and their marriage is rocky (stress etc). The bad thing is, if he left, his missus would be able to keep the house etc with the benefits (one young kid), but they are both trying to get through this patch.
My SIL's neighbour's house is council owned - the neighbour has moved over the road to live with her sister, and her son now rents the house off his mum - these folk need shopping.
It's shocking, those that need it, can't get it, but the 'professional' claimers manage fine.
My ex colleagues' in-laws were also professional benefits claimers - would make their 'ailments' appear worse when visited, or on assessments. They also had a number of static caravans that they rented out (these aren't cheap at £20k-£30k a pop). He absolutely hated them as he and his parents were hard grafters - his wife didn't think it a problem (which she wouldn't).
There are real genuine folk that struggle, and those that milk it - I hate those that milk it.
My mate can get hardly any benefits assistance (recently made redundant) and is struggling to pay the mortgage, and their marriage is rocky (stress etc). The bad thing is, if he left, his missus would be able to keep the house etc with the benefits (one young kid), but they are both trying to get through this patch.
My SIL's neighbour's house is council owned - the neighbour has moved over the road to live with her sister, and her son now rents the house off his mum - these folk need shopping.
It's shocking, those that need it, can't get it, but the 'professional' claimers manage fine.
Funnily enough, I think the same of someone with poor grammar and spelling skills. I wonder how people manage to get by in life when they can't structure a simple sentence correctly.
Dayvo
just passin' through
- Location
- 59° 50′ 5.55″ N, 10° 47′ 41.89″ E
twowheelsgood
Senior Member
- Location
- Zurich Switzerland
Problem is for many people there is no longer a discernible difference in quality of life when working or not working due to low wages and high living costs which are otherwise met by the state. This is particularly true if you have family and it means zero motivation to go out to work for effectively little or no reward.
Something in the high living cost/low wage/benefits trinity will have to give in the medium-term. The logical method would be house-price deflation to a sustainable multiple of earnings which would free-up earned money from rent or mortgage as "reward" over and above what benefits would otherwise absorb anyway. Unfortunately this would be political ruinous as there is too much vested interest.
The truth is the true benefit junkies are not the unemployed but are effectively landlords whose retirement schemes are subsidized through housing benefit (or the inflationary consequences of this from people who do pay from their wages) or employers who don't need to pay a living wage if this is topped-up through the state through housing benefit, tax credits and relief on council tax.
This is also why migrant workers are so "motivated"; it isn't miraculous or genetic, it's the fact minimum wage in the UK is 4-5 times somewhere Poland and that amount of earned money will equate to substantial reward at home instead of being lost entirely in living costs. These are big cultural questions we need to address because the consequences are long term and inter-generational. For example those saying "on yer bike" need to answer where would a similar British person go to get the same sort of deal as the Pole coming to the UK. Opportunities abroad tend to only exist for the highly skilled - it's not the level playing field the EU (for example) would imply.
I know I'm a bit right-wing on these forums but it's a bit more complicated than the lazy and their big tellies. One thing the current government has got right is instead of farting about with an insanely complex tax/benefit system a la Gordon Brown, the best method is to free as many people as possible from tax at the bottom end through raising thresholds - maximize reward for working.
Something in the high living cost/low wage/benefits trinity will have to give in the medium-term. The logical method would be house-price deflation to a sustainable multiple of earnings which would free-up earned money from rent or mortgage as "reward" over and above what benefits would otherwise absorb anyway. Unfortunately this would be political ruinous as there is too much vested interest.
The truth is the true benefit junkies are not the unemployed but are effectively landlords whose retirement schemes are subsidized through housing benefit (or the inflationary consequences of this from people who do pay from their wages) or employers who don't need to pay a living wage if this is topped-up through the state through housing benefit, tax credits and relief on council tax.
This is also why migrant workers are so "motivated"; it isn't miraculous or genetic, it's the fact minimum wage in the UK is 4-5 times somewhere Poland and that amount of earned money will equate to substantial reward at home instead of being lost entirely in living costs. These are big cultural questions we need to address because the consequences are long term and inter-generational. For example those saying "on yer bike" need to answer where would a similar British person go to get the same sort of deal as the Pole coming to the UK. Opportunities abroad tend to only exist for the highly skilled - it's not the level playing field the EU (for example) would imply.
I know I'm a bit right-wing on these forums but it's a bit more complicated than the lazy and their big tellies. One thing the current government has got right is instead of farting about with an insanely complex tax/benefit system a la Gordon Brown, the best method is to free as many people as possible from tax at the bottom end through raising thresholds - maximize reward for working.
