Learning a noisy musical instruments

[simongt]

Definitely plus one for the (much maligned) recorder.

The GLW plays recorder and can't cope with a whistle; not enough holes.
I play whistle; badly, and can't cope with a recorder; too many holes - !

 

[Yellow Fang]

Gotta question. Sometimes I hear the term 'grade 8' at the piano/violin/French horn. What's grade 8? Is it 'A' level standard? I want my son to get one. He can learn a fun instrument like the guitar or banjo if he wants, but I want him to learn something serious too.

 

[briantrumpet]

Gotta question. Sometimes I hear the term 'grade 8' at the piano/violin/French horn. What's grade 8? Is it 'A' level standard? I want my son to get one. He can learn a fun instrument like the guitar or banjo if he wants, but I want him to learn something serious too.

G8 is deemed equivalent of an A-level by the UK qualifications body. It's a lot of hard work, and not everyone gets there, even with a lot of effort & time... a mixture of aptitude and single-mindedness, usually. Utter waste of time if the pupil ends up hating music because they weren't allowed just to enjoy themselves. I had one pupil who having got his G8 in the next lesson said blandly "Good, I can give up the horn now".

 

[Drago]

Utter waste of time if the pupil ends up hating music because they weren't allowed just to enjoy themselves.

That's why I chose something random for my next degree. I had considered music, but being a multi-instrumentallist I was keen to not risk ending up hating the subject through being forced down avenues that might not have interested me.

 

[presta]

How about learning in the library, they don't seem to say sush any more like they used to when I was a kid.

 

[DRM]

He can learn a fun instrument like the guitar or banjo if he wants, but I want him to learn something serious too.

Why is guitar not serious, I think it's one of the hardest instruments to master, & is used in a hell of a lot of musical genres. not just chugging power chords in a metal band

 

[Drago]

He needs to be a multi-instrumentalist then. Business on the harpsichord, party on the cello.

Bass and mandolin are my main instruments and I practice daily, but I also play guitar, mandola, octave mandolin, Irish bouzouki and balalaika.

I can play double bass but don't own one, and can just about make a noise with a violin, but again don't own one.

Im thinking of getting my hands on a cittern and having a crack at it.

 

[briantrumpet]

That's why I chose something random for my next degree. I had considered music, but being a multi-instrumentallist I was keen to not risk ending up hating the subject through being forced down avenues that might not have interested me.

I'm lucky that I thoroughly enjoyed both of my music degrees, for different reasons, but avoided working in music for fifteen years for a similar reason... I didn't want to end up not enjoying the thing that mattered most to me (and is a central part of who I am) because I had to do stuff I didn't enjoy, just to pay the mortgage.

 

[Drago]

I've been lucky. Was force taught piano as a kid which meant I learned to read and picked up some theory, and the rest I'm self taught. I've fiddled round the fringes of the music industry with gigging and depping and the odd session for projects like music for adverts, etc, but it's always been something I've done because I love doing it.

Now I'm retired and a little bored I decided to do another degree and seriously considered doing music, but ended up fearful it might backfire as aforementioned. So international relations it is, and my musical life remains separate.

In this day and age there are so many online tools and information that learning an instrument has never been more achievable. Learn one and then those with related techniques and tunings start to make sense and before you know it you'd got a bit of an I+1 problem!

 

[briantrumpet]

He needs to be a multi-instrumentalist then. Business on the harpsichord, party on the cello.

Bass and mandolin are my main instruments and I practice daily, but I also play guitar, mandola, octave mandolin, Irish bouzouki and balalaika.

I can play double bass but don't own one, and can just about make a noise with a violin, but again don't own one.

Im thinking of getting my hands on a cittern and having a crack at it.

Get yourself a chitarone !! But be careful how you walk through doors with it.

 

[Drago]

That has a wonderful tone.

I have oft thought of the lute as well, but with 19 different commonly used tunings that's a rabbit hole from which I might never re emerge.

 

[briantrumpet]

That has a wonderful tone.

I have oft thought of the lute as well, but with 19 different commonly used tunings that's a rabbit hole from which I might never re emerge.

Slightly OT, but if you like Bach and lutes, and you don't know these recordings, take a day off and immerse yourself.

 

[icowden]

Gotta question. Sometimes I hear the term 'grade 8' at the piano/violin/French horn. What's grade 8? Is it 'A' level standard? I want my son to get one. He can learn a fun instrument like the guitar or banjo if he wants, but I want him to learn something serious too.

Slightly different take, but firstly Grade 8 is an indication that you have achieved a very high ability on an instrument. Like Brian and Drago, I was somewhat forced through grades as a kid, but that's because <scene goes film noir> <puts on fedora> <takes out a smoke and reclines chair>.

Back in the old days there was only one firm in town... the Associated Board of the Royal School of Music. They owned the town. If you wanted grades, you went through them. They were the only game to play for over 30 years. Now once we hit the millenium people started talking... The kids didn't want to learn to play Beethoven and Bach. They wanted a taste of that new fangled rock and roll. A new firm moved in - Trinity Guildhall. They started offering the kids stuff that they actually liked playing. Sure enough more firms moved in, Rock School until there were 4 or 5 cartels all vying for the same customers...

So suddenly you don't have to learn to play a Sonata or Prelude and Fugue if you want to get a Grade 8 that's worth something. You like Jazz? There's a jazz syllabus. Pop -one for that too. Rock - no problem. ABRSM knew they were in trouble so they also started pushing the good stuff - Jazz, Rock, Pop - still a little more staid but they had to compete...

Now - one difference still makes the old firm stand out. You *have* to do Grade 5 Theory of Music to be allowed to progress past Grade 5 in any instrument. If you can't read and analyse the music, they say - you can never be the best.

As for instrument, to a degree - let the kid decide. That said, for my money, Piano is the best foundation instrument there is. I may be a little biased - I started learning the piano when I was 5 years old. I was lucky - my great Uncle had one and I loved making noise on it, so my Grandma used her headteacher's salary to buy our family a piano. I was double lucky that my first teacher wasn't obsessed with grades - she wanted kids to love the instrument first and foremost, and that's what you need in a teacher. A teacher that the kid clicks with. If he comes home after 5 or 6 lessons saying "I don't like that teacher" - you got the wrong teacher. Find another.

So there I was playing piano aged 8 or 9, when I asked if I could play the Trumpet. I got trumpet lessons, again - had a great teacher who used pop and rock in his teaching. Worked up to Grade 4. A bit older again I got lucky and got an assisted place to a private school where if you wanted to lean Cello, you just borrowed a Cello. Learned Cello to grade 3 or so. I also started singing lessons. At this point my parents budget was strained so something had to go and I chucked in the Cello. Kept playing trumpet but didn't really get much better and chucked in those lessons as well. My teacher may have had a cool sports car (triumph TR7) but he wasn't the greatest teacher and my embouchure was terrible through lazy playing. I had moved piano teacher when I started that school but got a mad Czech woman who taught Victorian style and clipped your fingernails. It was her or me - luckily my parents were happy for me to change teacher again and a hit was not required...

Long story short, I failed Grade 8 piano thanks to Bach - couldn't sight read it well enough and I sure as hell wasn't learning it, but I had my Grade 6 as well as Grade 8 singing, Grade 4 trumpet, Grade 3 Cello and Grade 5 Theory - that got me a University Place to study music when I messed up my A-levels. It's not my main grift but I still play and make money from playing. I still sing and make money from that. I can probably still play the trumpet if I try. I taught myself some guitar and I can get a tune out of a violin if you asked me.

So start with the music and the teacher. Make sure the love is there and nurture it - one day you'll have a musician and maybe a kid with a pension top up plan... <scene fades to black>

 

[Yellow Fang]

Yes, the piano. It can he used in classical, jazz, pop. Presumably if you know the piano you can play other keyboard instruments. It is not always the most portable instrument, but there are portable variants around. I notice most pianos around now are digital, so tuning should not be a problem.
My mother's favourite instrument is the cello, but she is like Hyacinth Bucket. I have no big beef against the cello myself, but it is limited to classical.
I still think the trombone has a lot going for it. If you are the pianist in an orchestra you probably have to be the best musician there, but a trombonist is usually part of a brass section.
I would like my son to learn an instrument to a high standard, but I don't want to force him to do something he hates. If he does not want to do music than maybe I can encourage him to draw or paint. In depth knowledge of an instrument would be the arts section of his education ticked off.

 

[Profpointy]

Easy peasy - trombone and trumpet have a special gizmo called Silent Brass made by Yamaha... it's the canine's cojones. It's a mute that kills the sound escaping pretty much stone dead, but you can hear yourself sounding vaguely normal via a box of tricks. You can even take a feed out and record, but the people in the next room won't have any idea you're playing.

Sorry, it's me in the video, but... I have the thinnest walls, and the grumpiest neighbour with the most sensitive hearing, and she doesn't even know when I'm doing this...

I had a go on the Yamaha "silent brass" but in the end preferred the conventional practice mute by "Best Brass". That said I only bought it because I was then in a flat and the lady upstairs had a small baby who'd play up if woken. I never used it since we moved to a house, nor did I have one as a kid. I'd not worry too much if playing at normal civilised times of day to be honest.

I play (or used to play) French horn but confess progress has been decidedly lacking the last few years. Need to start playing again, not least to justify my upgrading to a pro grade horn a few years ago