Let's talk team racing tactics

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Manonabike

Über Member
I'm starting this topic here as an informal chat for people experts in the subjects and the likes of me who just want to learn something about racing tactics.

I do enjoy watching racers on telly but I can never make any sense of the tactics the commentators refer to :ohmy:

It would be nice if people that understand the subject could explain what the main tactics are. My knowledge of bike racing is ZERO.....
 
Big subject but basically on a flat stage the teams without a sprinter will try to get one of their men in a breakaway group - hoping that the group will stay away from the peloton. The teams with sprinters will let the breakaway go but won't let the gap get too big - they will then start closing this gap with 15km to go with each team taking turns at the front. They usually catch them inside the last Km.

Then each sprinter will have a lead out team which try to put their man in the best position 100-200m from the line - then it's down to the sprinter.
 
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Manonabike

Manonabike

Über Member
Thanks for that but many time I see brake away groups with riders from different teams and working for each other..... what that does mean in practice?
 

alecstilleyedye

nothing in moderation
Moderator
they're working together to get away from the main pack, hoping to get to the end and win. sometimes a rider will act as a policeman, sitting at the back not doing any work as they have a team leader in the main pack, acting as a sort of insurance.

break-aways usually fracture in the last 10k when riders start looking around and jostling for position, at which point they're usually caught or a smaller group or single rider jumps clear.
 

gbb

Squire
Location
Peterborough
Thanks for that but many time I see brake away groups with riders from different teams and working for each other..... what that does mean in practice?

The peloton, by virtue of its size will gain ground fast because there's more riders to take their turn and pull the rest along. The breakaway group have maybe 4 or 6 riders, who if they dont help each other will get swamped sooner. In helping others, they help themselves. No point in a breakaway if you're not going to work with other riders, even if they're from another team. You'll often see how quickly a peloton will overhaul a breakaway, simply with strength in numbers.
 

gbb

Squire
Location
Peterborough
There's another thing i've noticed thats sadly missing from commentary. 2 or 3 years ago you'd have the commentator telling you the heart rates of riders who were in contention, and they'd occasionally tell you the heart rate and whether it was too high, and the rider was likely to blow out (and they were usually right).
Current speeds are not mentioned as much either...it used to make it much more interesting, i think they've lost something by ommiting it.
 
Thanks for that but many time I see brake away groups with riders from different teams and working for each other..... what that does mean in practice?


When you get a breakaway group there are a load of permutations.

If the group contains a reasonable sprinter then one of the group will try a lone breakaway from that group before it comes down to the sprint.

The breakaway group will all do their share of riding at the front - unless their is a dispicable non-British rider in the group who doesn't come through and loiters at the back preserving energy.
 
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Manonabike

Manonabike

Über Member
Thanks for that guys, I'm beginning to put a mental picture together...... I guess the fact I ride on my own makes it harder to understand things that perhaps club riders would experience every week.

Two points that I'd like to understand..... in a brakeaway group working together.... the guy in front is "doing the work", by that I understand that he is doing probably his fastest for 30 - 60 seconds BUT surely the guys behind are also working very hard to keep up with the pace ( how much easier is for the riders not in front) ..... not having the experience I find it hard to imagine the effort is much less. Maybe by relaxing a bit from the from position to the last in the group is enough to recover..... I think in this case I like to compare heart rates to understand what is happening to those riders.


The other point is: when I heard that a team brings a sprinter to the front.... how do the team mates help the sprinter? Surely the effort to get to the front is the same for all in the team.

I really would like to see in numbers how much effort takes to ride at the front of a peloton and how much at the back.... probably that would be easier to understand.


Should I assume most riders have very similar endurance?
 
Thanks for that guys, I'm beginning to put a mental picture together...... I guess the fact I ride on my own makes it harder to understand things that perhaps club riders would experience every week.

Two points that I'd like to understand..... in a brakeaway group working together.... the guy in front is "doing the work", by that I understand that he is doing probably his fastest for 30 - 60 seconds BUT surely the guys behind are also working very hard to keep up with the pace ( how much easier is for the riders not in front) ..... not having the experience I find it hard to imagine the effort is much less. Maybe by relaxing a bit from the from position to the last in the group is enough to recover..... I think in this case I like to compare heart rates to understand what is happening to those riders.


The other point is: when I heard that a team brings a sprinter to the front.... how do the team mates help the sprinter? Surely the effort to get to the front is the same for all in the team.

I really would like to see in numbers how much effort takes to ride at the front of a peloton and how much at the back.... probably that would be easier to understand.


Should I assume most riders have very similar endurance?

A team of 9 usually consists of a team leader, a sprinter as alluded to, and 6 to 7 domestiques. These domestiques, some very good riders, sacrifice their own efforts to help their star man (leader), either win the entire race or a stage, or a jersey. These goals determine everything.

To add to what has been said already, the peloton (the herd) is quicker because the majority of riders are slipstreaming. In a large group this effect also creates momentum. Think about a group of riders in a line - the front man (or woman!) takes the hardship because it is the front rider(s) that take the wind head on. More specifically, air is made of particles that are disrupted when a bicycle wants to cut through it at speed. This causes drag. So, irrespective of a strong wind that makes it even harder, the front rider(s) are making the most effort. This is why a breakaway work together - they take turns in front of the small pack whilst the others slipstream their effort.

So, when a team brings a rider to the front they are not only jostling for position they are also protecting that rider's energy by making sure that he doesn't expend unnecessary energy at the front of the team, before he wants to break. When he's ready to go for glory the domestiques might be up, but that is unimportant because they have already done their job like a midfielder in football who delivers the killer ball to the striker who finds home.

In terms of endurance it has to be asked, endurance for what? Most riders have a speciality but it is those with an all round ability who win events like the Tour De France. Take Cavendish as an example, brilliant sprinter that he is he won't ever win the Tour because his victories, stunning as they are, are won by the ferocity of a sprint and cleared by margins of sometimes less than a second. (When AccountantPete talks about the small breakaway groups during flat stages of significant riders from teams with no sprinters, they are trying to breakway from riders like Cavendish because they know if it comes to a finish line sprint they won't stand a chance).

Compare this with an exceptional mountain climber like Miguel Indurain during the 90s and Marco Pantani who could make exceptional (time) gains in the mountain stages, but lose very little on the flat stages too and you have a potential all-round winner of a tour, as opposed just a stage or a jersey.

There are also the individual time trials and the team time trials TTT (usually early on in a tour to make sure each team have not lost riders), where a team of nine riders work together much like a small pack but without the potential jostling for position. Here, it is the 5th rider whose time is taken as the basis for the overall time.
 

Globalti

Legendary Member
If you want to know more about the lore of bike racing get hold of a small book called The Escape Artist by the journalist Matt Seaton. It's an excellent read with a shocking twist at the end. You can read it in a couple of hours.
 
Another thing - if two riders are battling it out at the front and one experiences a mechanical problem (say his chain falls off) then the other rider will observe the unwritten etiquette and wait for him to catch up.
 
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