Mountain Biking - 2 Minute Dissertation Survey

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Jody

Stubborn git
Done
 

Cubist

Still wavin'
Location
Ovver 'thill
hmmm I don't know if a device that adjust the travel on your front folks would make a difference.
any idea if it would?
Travel adjust forks are nothing new. It gives the option to run a slack head angle for descending, and then reduce travel (steepening the head angle) for climbing. Many long travel bikes don't climb we'll due to the fact the front end tries to lift as you climb, so dropping the fork makes it far more user friendly on the ups. Magura Thor for example are 140 or 100 mm travel, with the Flight Control lever on the bars, allowing on the fly adjustment. Fox Talas and Rockshox U turn have wind in adjusters on top of the fork leg to change travel.
 

Cubist

Still wavin'
Location
Ovver 'thill
Learn something new each day @Cubist
I think my brain shocks are supposed to do something clever to making climbing better.. Care to explain how this system works, or if it does not.
As far as I know the brain works like an external compression damper. It is situated near to the wheel rather than being part of the shock and is basically a hydraulic valve that closes and limits pedal induced bob or wallow when the rider is pedalling, and opens up to absorb big hits on rougher surfaces to increase the traction control of active rear suspension. The blurb tells us that the rebound from a large input through rough ground opens up the valve and allows the shock to operate to its full extent, then closes on smoother ground or when the rider is pedalling hard. It's very much a feature of XC bikes.

Other manufacturers have similar capability through settings and tune options, but Spesh claim their brain does the work for a rider without having to stop or alter settings. In essence this is my understanding of different compression damping settings, and my own experience is of Fox rear shocks and Rockshox and X Fusion forks.

The Fox RP 2 on my Canyon frame is a large volume air shock, with pro pedal. That pro pedal switches to limit high speed compression damping (think of riding over a series of little bumps) so it takes more bump input to make the suspension go into its stroke, which makes the bike more efficient when pedalling. Switching pro pedal off means the bike can use all of its suspension stroke quicker, so the bike is more compliant , with better traction where needed on bigger and more low speed hits. The downside of this is that the air volume means the shock is more linear, in other words the shock travels through all of its stroke quickly and easily, bottoming out if not setup correctly to the rider's weight and usage. They have air sleeves to limit the volume of air in the can for heavier riders on bigger hits. Setup properly for big hits like drops and jumps, the settings should aim for a sweetspot where the suspension travels all the way down, getting progressively stiffer as it does so, and reaching that point of full compression without bottoming. This gives the so-called "bottomless travel " effect.

The much better Fox RP 23 Kashima shock on my Ibis has a lower volume, better valved system, with a slightly different propepdal setting. The compression damping is similar, but I can adjust the amount of slow rate damping for bigger hit riding with a switch, not buggering about with volume reducers. In any case,pedalling efficiency on the Mojo HD is taken care of by the DW linkage, which itself removes a lot of pedal induced bob by the way the rear swing arm linkage is configured, so do not suffer the bob and wallow as much to start with.

Fork setup varies hugely between models and rider requirements. I have most experience of Reba and Revelation forks where spring progression is determined by the difference in air pressure in the positive and negative chambers, with adjustments to the rebound damping and compression damping made via changing settings in the motion control damper in the right fork leg. Again, this can make the fork responsive on small bumps, with the fork becoming active at different stages to make it taut and responsive on chattery stuff, without becoming willowy, or it can be set up to stay firm but go into its travel more progressively for bigger terrain. The adjustment options are many, and some avid fiddlers and fetters may never reach the sweetspot! I like my Reba on the Soul to be nice and plush, with a progressive squish, but not to dive under braking, or squat as soon as the bike points downhill, thus steepening the head angle.
 

Jody

Stubborn git
@Cubist Any useful info on setting air shocks up? I have a RP2 on the rear and Float forks (100mm) on the front. Both have been set up as per guidelines for sag and the damping seems ok. Its great but still think its way too soft if I were to get airborn or give it a bit of hammer downhill. I have not bottomed them out yet but can't be far off looking at the rubber o rings. This is on canal paths and steady riding.
 

Cubist

Still wavin'
Location
Ovver 'thill
@Cubist Any useful info on setting air shocks up? I have a RP2 on the rear and Float forks (100mm) on the front. Both have been set up as per guidelines for sag and the damping seems ok. Its great but still think its way too soft if I were to get airborn or give it a bit of hammer downhill. I have not bottomed them out yet but can't be far off looking at the rubber o rings. This is on canal paths and steady riding.
Hi Jody.

Sorry I missed your request for info.

Manufacturer's recommendations for air pressures are always a bit hit and miss, and the ideal settings are always a matter of trial and error.

Set sag using the O rings. I like a plush fork, so set up for 25-30% sag, but always in the attack position (standing up in full gear) . Rear shock sag is best set with the propedal open and sitting on the bike in full kit.
If you are using full travel in a towpath, it's likely that your setup is too soft. however, remember the bit about progressive bottomless shock travel. It takes a helluva whack to use the rest of the travel near the bottom of the shock stroke.

Go and find a kerb or step to drop off. Get a feel for how the front end compresses and then rebounds first, by riding off it. The fork should return quickly and smoothly to full length without bouncing. If it bounces, you need to increase or slow down rebound damping. If the fork bottoms out, you need to add air about 10psi at a time until it only uses about two thirds.

Similarly with the rear shock, open propedal and ride off the step as fast as you dare, concentrating on whether the bike bounces, squats or simply and smoothly returns to normal. Add air and turn the damping dial on the propedal lever to adjust.

Once you feel it is set up properly, go and ride some more adventurous trails, and try and include some ruts, bumps and drops. You'll soon discover if you're bottoming out either end, and whether you're getting bucked off or wallowing on the bumpy stuff.
 
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