Must get in front.....

[400bhp]

Unless I can see a serious delay ahead of me I would always join the queue for two reasons.

Firstly I feel it is the safer option and secondly demonstrates to the drivers cyclists can and do know how to behave and ride correctly. This second point is something I'm very keen on in order to try and counter the many POBs I see ignoring every road rule possible.

On the odd occasion I encounter a long queue to lights / junction I would filter to the front but this is very rare in my cycling.

My view would be the few seconds gained are no more valuable than those a driver gains by pushing past me in a dangerous or unsafe manner or road position.

Interesting - is it illegal to filter then?

 

[MisterStan]

As has been said before, i think you need to take it on a case by case basis and at all times make sure you keep your wits about you.

 

[Sheffield_Tiger]

[QUOTE 1775199, member: 45"]It very much depends on the road. For example, it's pointless if you're going to spend the next two miles playing overtake with the same cars, but if it's part of you making your way through congestion then it's worth it.[/quote]

That would work if drivers followed the same attitude when it came to overtaking cyclists on the approach to a junction or traffic queue

In that situation I feel why should I wait behind 4 cars that have just overtaken me, then for 4 more cars to nip past on the 200 yards to the next stationary queue, wait behind, then 4 more in the next 200 yards and so on. Often I find the overtaking same cars means that we all end up in exactly the same place as we started (in fact occasionally I will hang back and slot in front of the original following car just in the hope that it might register that roaring past and braking has done no-one except BP shareholders any favours), so what was the point of the car overtaking?

Same with drivers who grumble about filtering on the inside as "undertaking" yet see nothing hypocritical in splitting the lane themselves on the approach to a queue

 

[ufkacbln]

You're riding considerately, which is great.

From a safety point of view, the ASL seems to allow space for cyclists to take off at the front of a queue of traffic.

Filtering up the inside when there is a left turn ahead can be dangerous. So, holding back may be wiser than steaming to the front & holding cars up who may have difficulty in passing later on.

IMHO...

Local knowledge is helpful.

The above advice is sound, but I do this most days on my commute, but only because I know the light sequence.

If traffic is crossing from the right I have up to two minutes, and if from the left then I have at leasat a minute to filter and get into the ASL. Filtering is safe.

However if traffic is moving from the parallel side road then I have a very likely chance of the traffic moving when I am filtering so tuck into the traffic flow

 

[400bhp]

Approaching traffic lights when there is a queue - a trick is to look at the opposing light sequence (if possible), such that you can anticipate a change in the sequence of lights on your road.

 

[caimg]

Approaching traffic lights when there is a queue - a trick is to look at the opposing light sequence (if possible), such that you can anticipate a change in the sequence of lights on your road.

+1 - you have barely enough time to react if you're just relying on your set of lights, but usually you have about 5-10 seconds to react once you see opposing traffic lights hit amber.

Better still, look at the red/green man, these are always mega conservative for peds so the fade of a red man on the opposing traffic to your green light can be anywhere between about 10-20 seconds.

 

[benb]

Unless I can see a serious delay ahead of me I would always join the queue for two reasons.

Firstly I feel it is the safer option and secondly demonstrates to the drivers cyclists can and do know how to behave and ride correctly. This second point is something I'm very keen on in order to try and counter the many POBs I see ignoring every road rule possible.

On the odd occasion I encounter a long queue to lights / junction I would filter to the front but this is very rare in my cycling.

My view would be the few seconds gained are no more valuable than those a driver gains by pushing past me in a dangerous or unsafe manner or road position.

That's odd, as there is nothing misbehaving, bad riding, or incorrect about filtering - as long as it's done safely.

 

[benb]

If there are only 5 or less cars in front then I usually won't bother, except for a few sets of lights where I know the green phase is very short, when I will try and filter to the front so I'm not caught by 2 reds. Obviously only when it is safe and practical to do so.

 

[lejogger]

I think as per the general consensus, this is obviously something dealt with on a case by case basis.

It can also vary depending on the riding occassion. If I'm commuting, then more often than not I shall aim to get to the front when it's safe for me to do so. If I'm pootling home from the cafe after an 80 miler with the club, then I'll usually hover at the back.

I believe that filtering is assertive riding. It tells the traffic that you're going to take control of the speed away from the junction and you're going to manage how and when they overtake you. It gives you extra vital seconds to get clipped it, get going and get in an assertive position. Adversely, more often than not, when you're in the midst of a queue with bumpers on your rubber there's a greater pressure to manage this, especially when the car in front takes off slower than you would like and you lose momentum or if it takes off like a rocket leaving a gap that the car behind will want to fill.

It also depends on how well you know the junction. I pass through many sets of lights on my commute and I know the sequences of all of them. This means I know in advance of filtering whether I can make it to the front before the traffic is going to want to start moving, or whether it's going to be a risk and I should hang back. On an unfamiliar junction I would probably advise a more cautious approach.

And finally, it also depends on the lie of the land. If the queue from the lights is on an ascent then I will always try to get to the front. Usually here it will be flatter and therefore getting clipped in and away is much easier. Stopping halfway up a hill, especially with panniers and racing pedals risks a potentially slower and more wobbly start that places you in jeopardy.

 

[ohnovino]

It gives you extra vital seconds to get clipped it, get going and get in an assertive position. Adversely, more often than not, when you're in the midst of a queue with bumpers on your rubber there's a greater pressure to manage this, especially when the car in front takes off slower than you would like and you lose momentum or if it takes off like a rocket leaving a gap that the car behind will want to fill.

For me it's the other way around. If I'm at the front of a queue, I'm wary that the car behind can see the open road ahead and will think I'm "holding them up". If I'm in the middle of a moving queue, then the car behind can see that even if they pass me they won't get far, so they're more willing to hold back.

 

[Sheffield_Tiger]

That's odd, as there is nothing misbehaving, bad riding, or incorrect about filtering - as long as it's done safely.

Some think differently. Like a know-it-all at work who was insisting that I ought to add to the congestion on the route we both share in the morning by being in the car because cyclists are dangerous. To illustrate this he explained how on one particular road he overtook a cyclist then pulled right over to the kerb to stop her going down the inside as he wanted to turn left (but couldn't as he was in a queue), that the "silly woman" had then "pushed in" around his outside and down the inside of the car in front which had then turned left and knocked her off.

Firsly he's a blatherskite so I doubt the second part had happened - if it did then it would have been partly the car's fault for turning across a cycle lane without looking. As for the first part, yes, he's the sort of know-all road-vigilante who would indulge in such cockwomblery, and just started loudly repeating "No Undertaking" over me when i pointed out that (a) he had obstructed a cycle lane and (b) he had overtaken on the approach to a junction when intending to turn left.

But no, he was right of course. His driving is impeccable. That's why his daughter's car has a dent in the wing from when he borrowed it, and his own car had a replacement bumper when he reversed into a steel cage (but that was someone else's fault for putting it in the way and NOT his own fault for failing to look)

 

[MisterStan]

Some think differently. Like a know-it-all at work who was insisting that I ought to add to the congestion on the route we both share in the morning by being in the car because cyclists are dangerous. To illustrate this he explained how on one particular road he overtook a cyclist then pulled right over to the kerb to stop her going down the inside as he wanted to turn left (but couldn't as he was in a queue), that the "silly woman" had then "pushed in" around his outside and down the inside of the car in front which had then turned left and knocked her off.

Firsly he's a blatherskite so I doubt the second part had happened - if it did then it would have been partly the car's fault for turning across a cycle lane without looking. As for the first part, yes, he's the sort of know-all road-vigilante who would indulge in such cockwomblery, and just started loudly repeating "No Undertaking" over me when i pointed out that (a) he had obstructed a cycle lane and (b) he had overtaken on the approach to a junction when intending to turn left.

But no, he was right of course. His driving is impeccable. That's why his daughter's car has a dent in the wing from when he borrowed it, and his own car had a replacement bumper when he reversed into a steel cage (but that was someone else's fault for putting it in the way and NOT his own fault for failing to look)

Sounds to me like you get on really well with this guy....

 

[PaulSB]

That's odd, as there is nothing misbehaving, bad riding, or incorrect about filtering - as long as it's done safely.

I didn't suggest filtering was any of those things. What I said was a part of my reason for staying in the queue, I rarely see anything more than 4-5 cars, is to demonstrate CYCLISTS do behave well on the road. Which is not to suggest anyone who filters is behaving badly but I can understand why motorists feel unhappy about it.

Before it is mentioned if there is a cycle lane with an ASL I use this as it is clearly the local authority's intention to improve safety at the particular junction where it's provided.

second point is something I'm very keen on in order to try and counter the many POBs I see ignoring every road rule possible.
.

I would estimate at least 25% of POBs I see are riding badly. Dark clothing, pavement riding, no lights, no signals, lack of observation etc. etc. Sadly cyclists get lumped in with these riders, who reinforce the general view drivers have of us, and so I feel i have a duty to other cyclists to behave as correctly as possible and to make that behaviour highly visible.

For example I will always signal, loud and clear, when in traffic or with a car behind me. Often I get a positive reaction from driver who will get a thumbs up, head nod, smile or whatever is appropriate.

I just feel it helps us all.

 

[PaulSB]

Interesting - is it illegal to filter then?

Please see above post. In my opinion there would be a difference between correctly and illegal. I'm sure there will be a counter argument but I feel safer and believe it to be correct behaviour to simply wait in the queue.

When queuing I very much assert my position on the road by placing myself centrally behind the car in front. I hold this position until I'm happy with my speed and balance and then move inside to allow traffic to pass me.

I'm sure people will tell me I'm wrong but this is what makes me feel safe. I do not see a benefit, to me, in filtering. I can gain a few seconds but also gain a number of vehicles behind me. Having filtered I would feel it wrong to put myself in an assertive road position while moving off, in the queue I believe I have every right to do so.

For me I see filtering in much the same light as the driver who pushes pass me to gain the extra ten feet in the queue. For what? Nothing gained really.

As I said previously I would regard the provision of a cycle lane and ASL as an invitation by the highway authority to filter in the interest if safety at the junction in question. I presume this to be one major reason for the provision of an ASL.

 

[Crackedheadset]

Thanks for the replies, some people have raised some good points. I was thinking more along the lines of if I able to get through the set of lights on green in the first phase then I won't filter. As I don't see the point.

I'd still filter though if there was a line of traffic.