Must get in front.....

[gaz]

Please see above post. In my opinion there would be a difference between correctly and illegal. I'm sure there will be a counter argument but I feel safer and believe it to be correct behaviour to simply wait in the queue.

When queuing I very much assert my position on the road by placing myself centrally behind the car in front. I hold this position until I'm happy with my speed and balance and then move inside to allow traffic to pass me.

I'm sure people will tell me I'm wrong but this is what makes me feel safe. I do not see a benefit, to me, in filtering. I can gain a few seconds but also gain a number of vehicles behind me. Having filtered I would feel it wrong to put myself in an assertive road position while moving off, in the queue I believe I have every right to do so.

For me I see filtering in much the same light as the driver who pushes pass me to gain the extra ten feet in the queue. For what? Nothing gained really.

As I said previously I would regard the provision of a cycle lane and ASL as an invitation by the highway authority to filter in the interest if safety at the junction in question. I presume this to be one major reason for the provision of an ASL.

That isn't really applicable in a city enviroment, where lights can have +30 vehicles behind them with some of them having to wait several light phases to get through.
You would be a fool to not filter in that situation.

As for your point about ASL's. Using the ASL is not always the safest thing to do, and neither is being at the front. Sometimes it is best to ignore what the highway authorities want you to do

 

[fimm]

I believe it is possible to fail a motorbike test by not filtering when the instructor deems you could have done so safely.
I'm aware that a bicycle is not a motorbike, but I find this interesting none the less.

 

[GrasB]

I typically filter far enough forward to be sure I get through the lights & then find the first available slot I can comfortably place my bike in the middle of. There's not much point in getting right to the front as I'll just get snarled up with all the lemming cyclists & somehow have to get into the flow of traffic to overtake them. Best to hang back get in & stay in the flow of traffic to exploit the slipstream & my leg power.

 

[PaulSB]

That isn't really applicable in a city enviroment, where lights can have +30 vehicles behind them with some of them having to wait several light phases to get through.
You would be a fool to not filter in that situation.

As I said earlier I rarely encounter more than 4/5 vehicles at a junction. It's one of the joys of living in Lancashire.

As for your point about ASL's. Using the ASL is not always the safest thing to do, and neither is being at the front. Sometimes it is best to ignore what the highway authorities want you to do

Again as said earlier I see no point in filtering to be at the front as this simply puts more vehicles behind me. Moving off from a junction is quite a vulnerable position so I'm generally happy to queue.

As for the ASL that could be true and while I don't encounter any dangerous ones I can imagine situations they might create.

 

[BentMikey]

I like to imagine that your riding would adapt to be much like ours if you moved to London, and that our riding would adapt to be similar to yours if we moved to Lancashire!

 

[PaulSB]

Probably would. TBH I feel sorry for people who have to cycle in London, it seems pretty joyless to me. I've said before I'm sure London cyclists have to deal with situations I never experience. I suppose that's because I'm used to our wide open spaces and very few issues with other road users.

Had to ride in central Manchester last week and watched cyclists doing stuff I wouldn't dream of!

As another example I encountered my first WVM two weeks ago, been riding seriously for 19 years now!!! Other than that I can recall three serious incidents in that time.

 

[Red Light]

+1 - you have barely enough time to react if you're just relying on your set of lights, but usually you have about 5-10 seconds to react once you see opposing traffic lights hit amber.

Better still, look at the red/green man, these are always mega conservative for peds so the fade of a red man on the opposing traffic to your green light can be anywhere between about 10-20 seconds.

I never see that as a problem. I filter on the right and if the lights change and the traffic starts moving, cars are generally so slow getting started that a gap always opens up that I can slot into. There are some lights with some long queues on my commute so if I didn't filter it would take me 20+ minutes longer.

But you could ask the same question of the drivers. On a long stretch of road before each of the two sets of lights concerned they overtake me only to stop in the queue where I filter past them. You could say it would cost them nothing to follow behind me all the way but they don't and won't, sometimes doing a close pass to get past me. I see no problem therefore in overtaking them and in a way its satisfying to demonstrate to them that a bike is actually a faster way to commute than driving.

 

[400bhp]

in a way its satisfying to demonstrate to them that a bike is actually a faster way to commute than driving.

In your mind's eye yes - most of them don't really get it

 

[itchyrider]

Hey, Im a very confident rider on a bike, & Driving, but when im behind the wheel i cant stand when cyclists sit in traffic, Your holding up cars that want to get the green, so you might as well stick to the left & get to the front & stick to the appropriate lane you need cos thats what drivers expect & its easier to deal with from the drivers point of view....?
& being a cyclist your are the most vunerable one in the road dont hold cars up its too dangerous..
What ever vehicle your using they all have different road languages, try not to mix it....

 

[BentMikey]

That's not a very tolerant post, surely?

 

[400bhp]

Care to put that in English please itchyman?

 

[PaulSB]

[QUOTE 1782984, member: 45"]On a good evening I'll filter past a good hundred or so cars on my 4-mile commute. That's a huge benefit.[/quote]
I'm surprised by the number of commuters who seem unable to read English. I said:

"I see no benefit, to me, in filtering."

Selective quoting as part of the discussion doesn't add to the debate. There may be a huge benefit in filtering to you, there is none for me which is the comment i made and explained why. I feel it puts me in a more vulnerable position than queuing.

I do appreciate southern commuters have more to deal with than I do. It doesn't necessarily make the views absolute though.

 

[400bhp]

I'm surprised by the number of commuters who seem unable to read English. I said:


Selective quoting as part of the discussion doesn't add to the debate. There may be a huge benefit in filtering to you, there is none for me which is the comment i made and explained why. I feel it puts me in a more vulnerable position than queuing.

I do appreciate southern commuters have more to deal with than I do. It doesn't necessarily make the views absolute though.

How are you adding to the debate by describing something that is specific to you?

 

[summerdays]

I agree with those that say it is on a case by case basis.

My main set of lights to join an A road is over a minute wait - I need to be within about 8 to 10 cars of the front but as the road isn't that wide I prefer to get all the way to the ASL (plus I can see the next junction which changes before mine giving me about 20 seconds notice that the lights will change). The other advantage of being at the front is that I get to the next junction (the one I could see - so very close), and get in the ASL. I definitely prefer to be in that one as the queuing traffic from this set go back to the other set of lights and cars try to squeeze in as they often block the main road whereas if I'm in the ASL then I'm not taking up their queuing space.

A different set I will always filter forwards ... not necessarily to the front, but within the first 5 cars else I don't make it before it changes back to red again. It is all about knowing the lights and how the traffic normally reacts at a particular junction. And yet coming back the opposite way through that set where the timings are different I usually wait in line.

 

[ManiaMuse]

When you cycle the same route enough times you get to know the traffic lights very well, where traffic is likely to be queuing, how many cars get through on each set of greens and whether the ASL is a 'safe' one or not. From that you can judge how much time you have, how far you should filter and which side is safest to do so (usually the right).

There is no point in a busy city in being completely passive unless you are happy with adding a considerable amount of time to your journey by sitting in traffic. Quite often I filter only to the 2nd car in the queue which I find helps me assert my road position quicker when the lights go green and I think annoys motorists slightly less.

What irks me are the cyclists who filter on the left of stationary traffic when there is clearly not enough space, sometimes past buses and HGVs and when they have to put one foot down and squeeze past in a really dangerous position. I don't see the point, most of the time it is easier to filter on the right side anyway and the majority seem to be slower cyclists who get swallowed up by traffic and faster cyclists straight after the junction.