New Brompton special Edition: Barbour Edition 2022

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MontyVeda

a short-tempered ill-controlled small-minded troll
I only meant the way you're both taking umbrage over what is basically a difference in opinions. Value is a judgement as personal as anything else. To argue the toss over it to try and change opinions is a pointless waste of time beyond stating your opinions. It's a little Internet warriorship in nature which is prattish irrelevance at best.

Please refrain from calling people prats. You could simply say it's an irrelevance, without putting 'prattish' in front of it.
 
First off my comments do not stop anyone choosing anything. I just said that in my opinion people shouldn't support the premium sales model for special paint jobs that more often than not add no extra costs. My opinion without compulsion. How can my comments stop anyone doing or choosing anything?

My point about frog bikes was the way they offered a special edition bike which basically involved a different colour paint job. They didn't increase the rrp because it didn't cost any more to make. Different market but still a premium quality product in the kid's bikes sector. No extra markup for colour that's not warranted. Why increase markup for colour option?

There's simply a difference of opinion here. For that people are being defensive and doing the classic Internet warrior technique of selective quoting and comment.

One last point. If I was to put your comments about this bike to colleagues at work they'd find it funny especially if i give them the typical special edition brompton rrp. If they have bikes it's what you'd probably call BSO and look down on. For them it's a tool to get to work. Perhaps they spent what they think is a lot for a bike, £160! It lasts them years and saves on time and cost of public transport. Simply put utilitarian transport. I suspect people defending this edition of a Brompton bike have a totally different view of cycling and bikes. One that puts more than basic use as the purchasing decision. Whether that's aesthetics, brand image, belonging to a kind of group passionate for their brand or any other premium reason. Whatever that reason you're paying a premium above the straight cost for it. That's a choice I can't or won't make because my Brompton is a necessary tool for one job only. Commute by train that needs a folding bike. Brompton works for that for me but I would rather have bought a dahon but they do not fit my size. The price and quality of a dahon is sufficient for my needs, size isn't.
 
Sorry, one last point. I've used my Brompton for little over one year now. It's paint started flaking off in several places, it chipped in others despite me taking my normal high level of care for my bikes. There's other issues too. Mudguards crack due to fold but Brompton never solved the issue. A simple and cheap aftermarket pressed steel bumper from a Dutch cycle component fabricator solved this known issue but Brompton has never even bothered with it. For them it would cost pennies per unit to produce a part that does this job but they don't.

IMHO the premium nature of Brompton bikes has less basis in bid engineering these days than the past. Continous improvement seems to be about cutting cost and increasing markup not correcting design or manufacturing issues. A premium bike should not have flaking paint so quickly. To bring in the analogy with the automotive sector, you'd not accept that with a new car. Indeed paint has guarantees lasting often many years.
 
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berlinonaut

Veteran
Location
Berlin Germany
Mudguards crack due to fold but Brompton never solved the issue.
I do ride Bromptons almost daily for close to 15 years now. Once a rear mudguard cracked. This was because I left the subway train in a hurry and bumped it onto the floor too massively in a stupod way when unfolding. Else I did not have any defect on my Bromptons apart from normal wear and maintenance parts. Maybe I am just lucky - but on the other hand that's what I hear from fellow Brompton riders, too. On the other hand there are always people that are able to destroy about anything. I do know some of those, too. But most of them know their "ability" and only few of them point at someone else routinely and claim he would be guilty.
A simple and cheap aftermarket pressed steel bumper from a Dutch cycle component fabricator solved this known issue but Brompton has never even bothered with it. For them it would cost pennies per unit to produce a part that does this job but they don't.
If it is pressed steel it is for one prone to denting, secondly prone to rust and thirdly it rises the weight. If it serves you well - fine. I am more than happy with the factory mudguards and would clearly prefer them over steel ones.

A premium bike should not have flaking paint so quickly. To bring in the analogy with the automotive sector, you'd not accept that with a new car. Indeed paint has guarantees lasting often many years.
If I remember correctly your frame was exchanged on warranty. Shamefully even twice. So while your experience should not have happened in the first place they finally sorted it out. When you talk about cars: All I hear from people having bought a new car is that many if not most of them end up having countless issues and countless visits in the workshop. Seems to me the opposite of paradise...

Clearly Brompton is not perfect and I personally dislike a lot of things they do. But on the other hand they do (and have done) a lot right - more than most other companies I'd say. There's probably a reason why they are the biggest bike producer in the UK and one of few remaining. I am always baffled by the sheer hate towards Brompton especially in this forum instead of being proud, happy or at least relaxed. Nobody is forced to buy one, so I simply don't get the issue.
 
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berlinonaut

Veteran
Location
Berlin Germany
No extra markup for colour that's not warranted. Why increase markup for colour option?
Well, you are simply not their customer and target group for the special editions. Neither am I. I liked many of the special editions from an optics point of view but do own way enough Bromptons. With this editon I clearly dislike the Porridge-color (but could possibly like the bag).

The idea behind the special editions is to gain attraction from people who are not into Bromptons yet. Through media coverage, through a "now or never", through a complete package including a bag, through a certain style different with each edition and through new customer groups getting in touch through the colaborations with other companies. And this strategy (and it is an official strategy, lined out by Will Butler Adams) targets more the foreign markets, especially Asia. With the target to rise the sales of the "ordinary" Bromptons via the special editions. Seems to work. And not too surprisingly the special editions sell like mad in Asia - for years and years already people from Asia try to grab their hands on the ones at European dealerships and import them as their in-country-supply.

So I'm afraid: your opinion simply does not matter here. And even less, as you do assume and claim wrong things about the pricing, the idea and the target group of the special editions. Which then leads to strange statements as a consequemce. If you don't even know the target of something, how would you be able to judge on the outcome?

A last thing: This thread started with a simple information about a new special edition model from Brompton. Plain, simple. How come, that immediately people write their usual tirades of hate against the company in the thread that do have absolutely nothing to do with the topic? Seems to be a pretty emotional affair for some...
 
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EltonFrog

Legendary Member
Since the post has gone off topic, I’d like to add a personal observation. I have had my C line 7 weeks, I’ve done nothing to it, I bought a stock bike, on CTW scheme. I got a £1300.00 ( ish ) bike for £840 once I’ve finished paying for it. I love it, I haven’t ridden any of my other 6 bikes at all. It’s fun, versatile and comfortable. The dealer dealt with two small issues quickly. It is, in my opinion, the almost perfect mode of transport. I’ve taken it on the train, in the car and the work's bus, I’ve done a small tour on it and nipped down to the shops. I wish I bought one years ago.
 
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a.twiddler

Veteran
I agree with @EltonFrog . I bought my Brompton for what I know now was a good price by the standards of Brompton sellers. I couldn't buy a similar one now less than a year later for that price. Disregarding the rarefied atmosphere of Brompton pricing, after fixing a few issues caused by the unkindesses it suffered under its previous owner, using parts which were cheap and easily available for a rather specialised 10 year old bike, it has done what it was designed for and more.

It seems quite tough, though it is no lightweight, and though I was originally a Brompton sceptic I am coming to appreciate it more and more. After my last trip which involved it being folded in a car and three trains as well as some towpath bashing which turned into an unanticipated off road excursion, before returning to tarmac for a longish main road journey home, I am suitably impressed.

Although I am definitely not the target market for any special editions, it has become very useful to me.
 

EltonFrog

Legendary Member
"....Although I am definitely not the target market for any special editions, it has become very useful to me.

I am also not the target market for SEs, but the one in the OP is rather smart.

As an aside The Fragrant MrsP was very anti them, but bought one at the same time as me ( we wanted them for a specific purpose coming up in December) , she too has not ridden her other bikes and has become a fan.

They are expensive, but no other bikes in our research comes close to the versatility of the B.
 

T4tomo

Legendary Member
The Brompton value comes into is own vs competitors in its fold, if you are commuting on a busy train, as it is a lot easier to fit into small gaps etc than a Dahon etc. and happily fit under your desk at work

It also soon pays itself back on saved tube fares if you are London based. That was my rational from dropped best part of £1k on a SL3 in 2005. It doesn't get much use now as no longer work in London, but I don't regret buying it, as still gets used to collect a car left overnight at a pub etc. They are more expensive now, but as are all brands.

Towards then end of my commuting days I switched to a 2 bike solution (cycle train -cycle) as offices gained secure basement parking, but before that the Brommie was the only way. The 2 bikes cost me less than £300 for the pair, a 531 steel Pug tourer for the hilly home end and cheap single speed in London, so a much cheaper solution.
 

Kell

Veteran
As with all things, value is entirely in the eye/wallet of the user.

I've had three full size folding bikes prior to the Brompton. Two Dahons - both snapped frames. And one Rabbit.de bike which was essentially a clone of the Dahon with the frame hinge. That one went under a car.

While I preferred riding the Dahons, as they smoothed out the bumps, in practice for a multi-modal commute they were harder to use daily. They didn't fold up as small, so often I'd get to my train and not be able to get on. Whereas I've not had the same problem with the Brompton.

And in terms of price, my Dahon was £900 in 2009, while the Brompton was £1080 in 2015/6. The Brompton is way better engineered. And I'm not particularly a fanboy. It's a long way from being perfect, but it's the least compromised bike for me.

All that said, unless a special edition offers something genuinely different, I'm not sure it's worth an additional price tag. Especially if it's just paint.
 

shingwell

Senior Member
I like the look of that big bag although I guess it will be horribly expensive.

I notice there is a little tartan bag too which is at the front in most of the unfolded photos but has become a saddle bag in the folded photos. What a faff!
 
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berlinonaut

Veteran
Location
Berlin Germany
All that said, unless a special edition offers something genuinely different, I'm not sure it's worth an additional price tag. Especially if it's just paint.
As said before countless times: The price difference of a special edition does come exclusively through different parts or bits included with the special edition. The different color is for free. At least it used to be like that until now.

As the comprehensive pages about the 2022 Barbour are now live we do have the pricing.
The bike costs GBP1895 (whereas a normal M6L/C-Line explore mid costs GBP 1350 according to Brompton). Differences to the standard bike are:
• brass bell (instead of standard mini bell) -> GBP 20?
• Aluminium Pump (instead of Plastic) -> GBP 20?
• Schwalbe Almotion tanwall tires (instead of M Racer) -> GBP 60?
• Brooks Cambium in different color than standard (instead of Brompton Saddle= -> GBP 100?
• telescopic seat post (instead of standard long post) -> GBP 50?
• Barbour Weekender bag and saddle pouch -> GBP 240

This would sum up to guessed about roughly GBP 490 in extras. The price difference against the standard bike in real money is GBP555. So either I am missing something or miscalculated the extras or the do charge extra money for a special edition above the worth of the extra bits for the first time with a special edition. Given the reselling prices of Brompton special editions they probably would be kind of stupid not to (and it would in comparison to the reseller offers be a modest extra price tag), though I do absolutely dislike it.

The Bags are extra and there's more avail. than in the page I linked yesterday:
weekender bag as in the pictures GBP 200
small front bag (sizewise similar to the Tarras of the first Barbour Edition): GBP 175
small tartan saddle/stem bag GBP 40
Barbour Brompton Jacket GBP 380 :ohmy:
• a couple of T-Shirts and other Jackets (not of any interest, to be honest)
Have a look:
Bags: https://www.brompton.com/shop/bags?category=barbour&stock=0
Clothing: https://www.brompton.com/shop/clothing?brand=barbour&stock=0

I notice there is a little tartan bag too which is at the front in most of the unfolded photos but has become a saddle bag in the folded photos. What a faff!
It mounts magnetically to the saddle and to the stem - whatever you prefer.
 
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berlinonaut

Veteran
Location
Berlin Germany
BTW: Before complaining about Brompton's pricing of the Barbour Edition have a look at ebay.co.uk. Reminder: Sales start of the edition was today, Brompton sell it for GBP 1895.

This is what's listed on ebay uk just now, a couple of hours after the bike was first available - 13 offers so far and prices vastly above what the sellers themselves paid today for the bike:

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rogerzilla

Legendary Member
Brompton tooted out a marketing email on Friday about "something new on Sept. 26th". Stupidly the tracking code within the mail included "Email_Global_TEASER_Barbour%20Launch_Sep%202022" - so this was that. How stupid can one be?

Turns out: even more stupid! Google and Bing do have various country sites of Brompton indexed that already show the new special edition, when you search for "Brompton Barbour special edition 2022". A lot of dealer sites as well - but while all the links to dealer webpages end up in a 404 (as the bike will only be officially launched on Monday) Bromptons own country web pages show their underpants: While the special edition does not show in the site navigation yet the according webpage is directily accessible from the search engine links. Here i.e. the Brompton Oman site for the special edition (which is identical with all other country sites) including spec and pics, so if interested feel free to have a look earlier as intended:

https://om.brompton.com/shop/bikes/barbour-x-brompton-c-line-explore

Still waiting for Brompton to hire somebody in marketing who knows what he or she is doing...

The frame color of the bike is btw. "Porridge" despite Brompton calling it "Amble Sands gloss powder coat".
Surly's marketing department are equally fanciful when naming colours. The box in which my Taiwanese-built LHT turned up called the blue colour "Lagoon". Surly called it "Grandpa's Thermos".
 
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