NHS Trust to charge staff £220 to park cars at work, forget about job cuts this is even worse.

[jonesy]

Ever tried getting a Trust to implement one.....?!

It was a rhetorical question...

 

[domd1979]

I know...

Equally it is frustrating trying to get across the importance of public transport for hospital users, and that its not all about car parking. Since the introduction of the new national concessionary passes for over-60s in April, a hospital I work with has seen a 20% increase in the number of bus passengers to its site.

It was a rhetorical question...

 

[jonesy]

I know...

Equally it is frustrating trying to get across the importance of public transport for hospital users, and that its not all about car parking. Since the introduction of the new national concessionary passes for over-60s in April, a hospital I work with has seen a 20% increase in the number of bus passengers to its site.

The inability to see beyond car travel to hospital lies behind the decision by the Wales parish council to effectively abolish hospital travel plans...

http://news.bbc.co.uk/1/hi/wales/7323027.stm

 

[walker]

you sure this is the right place to put this, shouldn't this be in politics and life?

 

[Nigeyy]

This might be more political than cycling talk....

I understand that if where you work there is a private facility a charge has to be applied. But if the car park is part of the facility, I have to wonder if this is a good idea. I know we're all cycle commuters here, but some people can't cycle to work through no fault of their own, or because of other issues.

You have to be careful of the "nickel and diming" (meaning you start getting charged for the little things and it keeps going). Sooner or later they'll figure out that if you are cycling to work, you should pay a bicycle security fee, road safety risk factor fee or similar. Or a fee for having brown eyes, or that you emitted wind in the hallway. Living in the states with the health system (FYI, not always great IMHO and if you're really sick then forget about it -only healthy or very wealthy Americans think it's great -and usually because they've never travelled outside their own country and they're brainwashed into thinking "USA-number-1/best country in the world" but I digress) here has taught me this -they start charging for everything they can. It's the thin end of the wedge argument.

 

[Tetedelacourse]

I take great pleasure in listening to my colleagues moaning about having to cruise around for 10 - 15 minutes before they can find a parking space at my place of work, as the council have double-yellowed most of the surrounding streets. My smug reply "plenty space in the bike racks today".

 

[Tetedelacourse]

Oh, might as well reply to OP too while I'm here. I think it's about time. I moved from the private sector into NHS and cannot believe how hard done by career-long public servants feel, considering that they (and now I) are treated relatively very well by their employers. They don't know how good they've got it! On second thoughts, maybe I was treated particularly badly before - but no, not hearing some of my pals' terms and conditions.

 

[domd1979]

There's lots of reasons why car parking at work should be charged for. We (currently) have a large free car park at work. The car park has a cost to the organisation both in terms of maintaining it, and the opportunity cost of doing something else more useful with the land. A person using their car to drive to work and parking for free is being subsidised. If I don't have a car and get to work in another way, then I cost the organisation less. Why should someone who chooses to drive to work receive that additional benefit? Effectively I get poorer terms and conditions from my employer for choosing to cycle. Charging introduces an element of equity between car users and non-car users. There's also plenty of evidence to suggest that people who walk/cycle to work are (generally) healthier and tend to have less time off sick, so there's another cost to the organisation.

This might be more political than cycling talk....

I understand that if where you work there is a private facility a charge has to be applied. But if the car park is part of the facility, I have to wonder if this is a good idea. I know we're all cycle commuters here, but some people can't cycle to work through no fault of their own, or because of other issues.

 

[marinyork]

There's lots of reasons why car parking at work should be charged for. We (currently) have a large free car park at work. The car park has a cost to the organisation both in terms of maintaining it, and the opportunity cost of doing something else more useful with the land. A person using their car to drive to work and parking for free is being subsidised. If I don't have a car and get to work in another way, then I cost the organisation less. Why should someone who chooses to drive to work receive that additional benefit? Effectively I get poorer terms and conditions from my employer for choosing to cycle. Charging introduces an element of equity between car users and non-car users. There's also plenty of evidence to suggest that people who walk/cycle to work are (generally) healthier and tend to have less time off sick, so there's another cost to the organisation.

Absolutely. At the hospital I worked at they could get rid of all car parking and they'd have an opportunity to expand the hospital in ways they wanted or just design it much better. At the other end of the scale they could knock down the entire main building and have no hospital and they still wouldn't have enough parking by a large factor for everyone!

I agree with mjones that annual is a bad idea and a lower division is the way to go. I've also wondered with many colleagues what the impact of a proper car share scheme would be as in such a large organisation many people who even come into contact with each other live close to others. There's also the idea of a nominated don't drive day, through a large organisation this could save upto a theoretical 20% capacity.

 

[Jaded]

This might be more political than cycling talk....

I understand that if where you work there is a private facility a charge has to be applied. But if the car park is part of the facility, I have to wonder if this is a good idea. I know we're all cycle commuters here, but some people can't cycle to work through no fault of their own, or because of other issues.

Its possible that in the States employees don't get taxed for benefits in kind. Here if a business provides benefits for an employee (with some exceptions) the employee is taxed on the value of that benefit. A car space at a hospital is provided for the patients and the visitors. An employee will fill a car park space for 40 hours a week - you'll get many more visitors and patients using the space in the same time, so it is a very poor use of the resource.

We are very short of space in the UK and land is expensive. Over providing for car parking is expensive and not the best use of public money when building hospitals. It is quite possibly different in the States, where there is much more land and healthcare is largely private.

Taking your last point simplistically there will be two reasons why people cannot cycle to work. 1) They have chosen to live too far away for their capabilities and 2) they are disabled in some way.

The former can be resolved by individuals considering where they work and live and here the latter is often resolved with disabled parking facilities.

 

[Jaded]

I've also wondered with many colleagues what the impact of a proper car share scheme would be as in such a large organisation many people who even come into contact with each other live close to others.

Car share once a fortnight and you reduce your commuting by 10%

 

[summerdays]

I had to go to hospital recently ... and was sent a nice leaflet about how to get there.... there was nothing about getting there by bike. I ended up ringing up to enquire where there was cycle parking... and found a very cramped bike shelter when I arrived - with about 5 stands. (I'm sure there were others).

I felt that there should of been a larger area and signposted and added to their transport leaflet too. The doctor commented that it was good that I had cycled.

 

[marinyork]

I had to go to hospital recently ... and was sent a nice leaflet about how to get there.... there was nothing about getting there by bike. I ended up ringing up to enquire where there was cycle parking... and found a very cramped bike shelter when I arrived - with about 5 stands. (I'm sure there were others).

I felt that there should of been a larger area and signposted and added to their transport leaflet too. The doctor commented that it was good that I had cycled.

There might not have been. There were only two at the hospital I worked at and none that could be accessed by the public. Patients going by bike had to park using a couple of stands in a nearby park, 5 mins down the hill or at the university. They recently got forced to provide some outside A&E.

 

[marinyork]

Car share once a fortnight and you reduce your commuting by 10%

The two schemes go together, well spotted! No what I really meant was it is already regulated and with a closeknitt community like that it would actually work. A 10 or 20% gain is huge when you consider how desperately short the hospital was for parking spaces (something like 30 spaces official spaces and about the same semi-official ones).

 

[Nigeyy]

There's lots of reasons why car parking at work should be charged for. We (currently) have a large free car park at work. The car park has a cost to the organisation both in terms of maintaining it, and the opportunity cost of doing something else more useful with the land.

Even as a cycle commuter, allowing people to park close to their work in their cars doesn't sound too wasted to me, not for them, not for who they work for -assuming they cannot commute in by other more efficient means.

A person using their car to drive to work and parking for free is being subsidised.

Last I heard running a car means you do pay rather a lot in taxes. Way more than the actual cost -which means they are subsidizing someone as well (may well be you in another aspect of your lifestyle as well). Taxes are taxes.

If I don't have a car and get to work in another way, then I cost the organisation less. Why should someone who chooses to drive to work receive that additional benefit? Effectively I get poorer terms and conditions from my employer for choosing to cycle.

Though it is your choice to do so. But just remember, you don't use one half of the toilets at work either, so why should approximately half the work force receive that benefit?

Charging introduces an element of equity between car users and non-car users. There's also plenty of evidence to suggest that people who walk/cycle to work are (generally) healthier and tend to have less time off sick, so there's another cost to the organisation.

Agreed, but to some it's not possible. But got to be honest, I'm nitpicking for the fun of it with my above comments.

What I'm serious about is that once they charge for cars, your bike and bike space will be next....... And don't believe it won't be so.