Pan Celtic Race 2023

[matticus]

I think his point is that while the ultra races may be "easier" for those who only want to complete within the time limit, they aren't easier for those who are actually racing them, or even who are just trying to complete them as fast as they personally can.

That is a heck of a lot more specific than the rather vague comment you are translating from! God bless you for trying though ...

But still, who the hell can know? 10 day race, even if you're aiming for the podium, requires very careful pacing; vs a 300km audax, which the same rider might ride much closer to flat-out. That's just an example of how there are way too many variables. OK, here's another one:
we see "Ultra races" that are well under 1000km. I know from riding 600km+ in a race that doing a 1500km audax event took a lot more out of me.
As I said, too may variables ...

 

[Dogtrousers]

Kinda weird to see a willy waggling contest "my audax is harder than your ultra neh neh" on this subject.

For me, ultras and 600k+ Audaxes are precisely the same level of difficulty: Impossible.

 

[matticus]

Kinda weird to see a willy waggling contest "my audax is harder than your ultra neh neh" on this subject.

I do generally try to keep my mouth shut about what apparently daft things people choose to spend their time+money on, if they're harming no-one, getting outdoors, having fun etc ...
but when the issue of cost comes up, it's a clear no-brainer to point out that audaxes are in a different class to the average "Ultra".

 

[Dogtrousers]

but when the issue of cost comes up, it's a clear no-brainer to point out that audaxes are in a different class to the average "Ultra".

Audaxes are undeniably cheap This gives them the great advantage that there is very little loss when you decide to bail out and DNF. Or indeed look at the weather forecast and DNS. (In my experience of course)

 

[Alex321]

Kinda weird to see a willy waggling contest "my audax is harder than your ultra neh neh" on this subject.

For me, ultras and 600k+ Audaxes are precisely the same level of difficulty: Impossible.

That's about my level too

 

[Ming the Merciless]

I think his point is that while the ultra races may be "easier" for those who only want to complete within the time limit, they aren't easier for those who are actually racing them, or even who are just trying to complete them as fast as they personally can.

Since we are now talking about the sharp end. First back on London Edinburgh London audax last year averaged 551km every 24 hours. How does that compare to those racing ultras?

 

[ColinJ]

Since we are now talking about the sharp end. First back on London Edinburgh London audax last year averaged 551km every 24 hours. How does that compare to those racing ultras?

I thought it was against the ethos of audax to compete on speed? Any idea of competition was more on length/number of rides?

 

[Ming the Merciless]

I thought it was against the ethos of audax to compete on speed? Any idea of competition was more on length/number of rides?

It’s not competing , there isn’t a winner, that’s just the rate of ground covered by the quickest audaxers. For PBP the rate is over 600km per 24 hrs and for some over 700km every 24 hours.

 

[ColinJ]

Ah, so it is more like...

"Obviously, we were not racing, but I had to be back to take my dog to get his claws trimmed, so I rushed round the last 600 in 21 hours 3 minutes and 37 seconds."

 

[Ming the Merciless]

Ah, so it is more like...

"Obviously, we were not racing, but I had to be back to take my dog to get his claws trimmed, so I rushed round the last 600 in 21 hours 3 minutes and 37 seconds."

Audax attracts a wide range of riders with different abilities. There’s this stereotype that we all have beards and pootle round eating cake. That’s it’s not difficult. But it’s really quite tough, the sharp end as sharp as anything in ultra racing, even the blunt end is covering over 300km a day. It tough but there’s no big focus on who is first back, the last ones back often get more TLC as they’ve been the ones who’ve had to fight the hardest to stay in the time limits.

If audax did instagram , it’d be those in the middle or back who’d feature not those at the front.

 

[Dogtrousers]

Audax attracts a wide range of riders with different abilities. There’s this stereotype that we all have beards and pootle round eating cake. That’s it’s not difficult. But it’s really quite tough, the sharp end as sharp as anything in ultra racing, even the blunt end is covering over 300km a day. It tough but there’s no big focus on who is first back, the last ones back often get more TLC as they’ve been the ones who’ve had to fight the hardest to stay in the time limits.

Is it really as "us and them" as that? Aren't they all just various different long distance events that long distance riders may or may not choose to do?

You're not debarred from one if you do the other, so surely you'll get people who both? Or do the beardie audaxers withhold cake from people who have done an ultra? (Obviously sharing cake with other riders is forbidden in Ultras)

 

[Ming the Merciless]

Is it really as "us and them" as that? Aren't they all just various different long distance events that long distance riders may or may not choose to do?

You're not debarred from one if you do the other, so surely you'll get people who both? Or do the beardie audaxers withhold cake from people who have done an ultra? (Obviously sharing cake with other riders is forbidden in Ultras)

Not at all, we were just pointing out that ultra racing isn’t more difficult than audax. So if you can’t afford ultra racing, but want a similar challenge, do an audax for not a lot of money.

 

[Dogtrousers]

I know we're going way off topic but some time ago I worked on a control about 150-200k-ish into a 400. I was surprised at the number of riders who turned up on the DOT of the control opening time which showed great pace judgment as well as just riding ability (unless, of course they'd been hiding round the corner waiting for us to open).