Petition for law change - Ebike Assist Limit

youngoldbloke

The older I get, the faster I used to be ...
My experience is that the vast majority of bike traffic travels at less than (an average) of 25 kph (15 mph).

If you want me to agree to raising the limit then you'll need to convince me why it is a good idea to give Ebikers the ability to get assistance to exceed that average speed.

Again, I have no problem with you getting assistance to exceed 16 mph. I just think you should do it in different places to other bikers travelling at a normal speed.
Hard to reply to you as we seem to be talking at cross purposes and about completely different circumstances. I do not commute. There is little or no cycling infrastructure in the area I ride. All of my riding is for fitness or leisure. I am not asking to ride at average speeds of over 16mph - most of my riding averages 10 -12mph. I agree that e-bikers, or any other bikers should not be blasting along busy shared use paths - but that's not the fault of the bike, it's the rider that's the problem. Assisted bike or otherwise,
 

glasgowcyclist

Charming but somewhat feckless
Location
Scotland
And in the usa cars dont require an mot... Not everything is a good idea just because the usa say... Though we will soon be part of the usa so maybe the petition will be irrelevant.

It's also worth pointing out that the 20mph limit in the US isn't in relation to assistance, it's the maximum permitted speed the bike can be propelled *without* pedalling, i.e. on motor power alone, so it's not the best comparison.
 

HobbesOnTour

Über Member
Location
The Netherlands
Hard to reply to you as we seem to be talking at cross purposes and about completely different circumstances. I do not commute. There is little or no cycling infrastructure in the area I ride. All of my riding is for fitness or leisure. I am not asking to ride at average speeds of over 16mph - most of my riding averages 10 -12mph.
In fairness, it is a remarkably poorly put-together petition with no reasons given, so I think it is important to tease out the arguments on both sides.
I see the fact that we are literally in 2 different places in terms of infrastructure and purpose as a positive.


I agree that e-bikers, or any other bikers should not be blasting along busy shared use paths - but that's not the fault of the bike, it's the rider that's the problem. Assisted bike or otherwise,
Agreed.
 

Scaleyback

Well-Known Member
Location
North Yorkshire
[QUOTE="youngoldbloke, post: 5649030, member: 2740" I agree that e-bikers, or any other bikers should not be blasting along busy shared use paths - but that's not the fault of the bike, it's the rider that's the problem. Assisted bike or otherwise,[/QUOTE]

You make a relevant point Peter but if you put a 'tearaway' in 15 year old Ford Escort he is a threat to others, put the same 'tearaway' in a
Porsche carrera and they become a far greater threat to others. Experience shows me that if the performance is available some drivers will
use it inappropriately. I doubt idiots on bikes are any different.
 

youngoldbloke

The older I get, the faster I used to be ...
[QUOTE="Scaleyback, post: 5649055, member: 85386"

You make a relevant point Peter but if you put a 'tearaway' in 15 year old Ford Escort he is a threat to others, put the same 'tearaway' in a
Porsche carrera and they become a far greater threat to others. Experience shows me that if the performance is available some drivers will
use it inappropriately. I doubt idiots on bikes are any different.[/QUOTE]

Agreed - but that 'tearaway' poses a much bigger threat in the Escort than on an ebike (which they'll probably 'clock' anyway), and kids are very capable of causing 'wheelie' havoc on unassisted bikes too. It's the driver not the vehicle.
 

rivers

How far can I go?
Location
Bristol
I have no issue with ebikes. My wife has an ebike and it allows her to commute to work and us to go on longer rides together. When we go out, we cruise along about 12-13 miles an hour. If I want to go on a ride faster than that, I go out with my friends. I do not support raising the speed limiter on e-bikes. As I said earlier in the thread, I've been overtaken by people on de-restricted bikes who have the bike handling skills of a drunk chimpanzee. I can cruise along on a flat at around about 20mph for several miles, and a gradual downhill faster than that. However, I did not attain those speeds immediately upon getting a bike. It took hard work and effort on my part to attain those speeds, and with that hard work and effort came the bike handling skills to ride at those speeds safely. Someone who has never cycled before goes and buys e-bike that can do 20mph right off the bat won't be able to handle the bike safely at that speed. My wife can put her sit up and beg dutch style e-bike into turbo and hit 15.6mph and cut out easily and quickly on a flat, and has been able to do so since the day she got the bike. As a fit cyclist, I've had the assist cut-out going up uphill.
 

youngoldbloke

The older I get, the faster I used to be ...
I have no issue with ebikes. My wife has an ebike and it allows her to commute to work and us to go on longer rides together. When we go out, we cruise along about 12-13 miles an hour. If I want to go on a ride faster than that, I go out with my friends. I do not support raising the speed limiter on e-bikes. As I said earlier in the thread, I've been overtaken by people on de-restricted bikes who have the bike handling skills of a drunk chimpanzee. I can cruise along on a flat at around about 20mph for several miles, and a gradual downhill faster than that. However, I did not attain those speeds immediately upon getting a bike. It took hard work and effort on my part to attain those speeds, and with that hard work and effort came the bike handling skills to ride at those speeds safely. Someone who has never cycled before goes and buys e-bike that can do 20mph right off the bat won't be able to handle the bike safely at that speed. My wife can put her sit up and beg dutch style e-bike into turbo and hit 15.6mph and cut out easily and quickly on a flat, and has been able to do so since the day she got the bike. As a fit cyclist, I've had the assist cut-out going up uphill.
You could argue that 15mph is too fast.
 

classic33

Legendary Member
Quick question

As the rule, if changed, would apply to all cycles, who would be willing to be a passenger in an e-assist trike taxi?
 

Scaleyback

Well-Known Member
Location
North Yorkshire
Crikey ! can you imagine the outrage from the ‘lycra set’ and ‘mamils’ if the assist level was raised to 20mph. Many are apoplectic now at the thought of being overtaken on a hill climb.
 

Smudge

Über Member
Location
Somerset
I would probably be in favour of rising the cut off speed to 20mph, if it could be ensured that these bikes would only be used on the road. But i cant see any way that that could be implemented.
I still think 15.5 mph max motor speed, is a good compromise between not too fast and not too slow to mix with unassisted bicycles in all the places they are allowed to use.
 

Rusty Nails

We remember
Location
Here and there
I was in a bike shop this morning and listening to the owner talking about e-bikes, saying he sells as many of them as non-powered.

He said to the customer that soon the law will be changed to increase the speed restrictions. I didn't hang around to ask him if he knew something or was just using his sales spiel.
 

Smudge

Über Member
Location
Somerset
I was in a bike shop this morning and listening to the owner talking about e-bikes, saying he sells as many of them as non-powered.

He said to the customer that soon the law will be changed to increase the speed restrictions. I didn't hang around to ask him if he knew something or was just using his sales spiel.
When i first started getting interested in ebikes about 7 years ago, i went to shop that sold ebikes to check them out. The salesman told me that i should definitely only buy a crank drive and this technology is so good that its making hub drive motors pointless and they'll be obsolete within a couple of years.
Always assume a salesman is bullsheeting..... because they usually are.
 

lazybloke

Veteran
Location
Surrey Hills
You could argue that 15mph is too fast.
Yes, exactly; fast for one person is slow to another. Hence the current limit is set somewhere between extremes, and is intended to be acceptable to a majority whilst giving an appropriate nod to safety concerns.

There presumably* would have been a consultation prior to setting the current limit. Anyone who advocates a higher limit would need to argue (to a similar level of detail) why that consultation was wrong. A petition is not an argument.

*a quick search didn't find it.


Reductio ad absurdum: Usain Bolt was once measured running at 27.8mph. So jowwy's logic suggests that mobility scooters should be capable of the same speed instead of the present 4mph.
 
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