Potential front end changes to my current bike - advice sought!!

[Time Waster]

I am considering changing my annoying Tiagra 4600 shifters to a rear exit / concealed cabling set of shifters. I am sick of the older side exit cabling and how it is in the way. So I am looking into the cost to change this. I do not NEED to do this but want to so I cannot justify a high expense. Basically the cheapest decent option will do. My current research suggests that I have two options';

• Older model 105 or Ultegra shifters that have the concealed cable routing and same pull ratio as my existing 4600s
• Change to the 4700s or others with the new pull ratios and concealed cabling. This needs at least a new rear derailleur, but the front shifters are less fussy about the pull ratios I have read so possibly not needed. Is this true or is it still better to replace the front derailleurs too.

I might not find the older model shifters and if I do I might be getting used ones or some other slightly iffy issue. I do not have much spare cash I want to allocate to this so I need a cheap but good enough option that will not create more issues later on. I will not be doing the work myself as I have my reasons for that namely I can do the work technically but it would take me such a long time to do and no doubt I need to buy tools such as cable pliers and the like. I prefer to pay my local, reasonably priced and good bike repair shop (as in they do not sell bikes just repair them and perhaps a few component or accessory sales to support existing customers). They are good at their job and do not overcharge or do uneccesary work because it is in some kind of job list at set prices.

So my main ask is how cheaply can I get it done to get a good result? What should I get fitted for reliablilty and lower cost?

A supplimentary question is that I am thinking of swapping the bars at the same time. I do not think my standard / stock PlanetX London Road set of handlebars (44 sized) is comfortable, I think the drops are too far down for me. I have always been used to a high seat and low bars setup but I think with the longer stem and these bars the drops are too low for most of my riding. So I rarely use the drops which does not give me as many different hand positions that is needed on longer rides (when I actually do them). I need a variety of comfortable hand positions due to iffy elbow needing me to ride with a different hand/arm position every so often.

I have never changed a saddle or bars away from as supplied ones on a bike before so really know very little about bars. I can cope with the current ride height on the hoods. I am wondering if my stem could do with being a little shorter. I think I got the longest stem that PX offered on that bike 8 or so years ago when I got it. The number 70 comes to mind but I cannot be certain that is related to the stem. I like the idea of flared / gravel bars but I guess shorter drop bars are also as good. My existing bars feel like the drops are too straight in that it feels like my arms are tight against the ends of the bars when on the drops. This makes me think a little flare might be a good idea as well as the shorter drop.

So what do you think the handlebar shape I need to get? What drop and flare should I look for? Also, should I swap out the stem for a shorter one?

I am 196cm tall and average torso / leg / arm lengths for my height. I guess that made them think XL bike size (which I knew I wanted) with wider bars and longer stem (I did not know there was these options). I am currently riding an XL London Road bike with 440 wide bars and a longer stem as recommended by the bike fitter I spoke to in customer support at PlanetX back then. Well I also ride a Brompton with telescopic seatpost and occasionally a HPV SMGT touring recumbent bike too but they are rarer rides these days.

So any advice or recommendations for changing to neater and concealed cable shifters (plus other components needed for this change) and potentially a new handlebars for increasing comfort (without changing to something weird like butterfly bars or those riser drop bars with a second, attached lower tube to put in your stem to lift the bars 70mm or so). i do not think I need higher bars at the tops as my hoods are ok to reach (might be able to improve that but it is ok for me), but I think I need drops that are easier to reach hence less drop and possibly flare is being thought about. I do not know enough about this. Also, cannot afford a bike fit so that is out and this needs to be cheaper than expensive. Bars a lot less than £100 and shifter / derailleur options to be decent/reliable but to the Tiagra end not the Ultegra end.

 

[Dogtrousers]

I think your best bet on a budget would be second hand/refurbed 105 10s shifters (5700?). But it's always a risk as brifters are such finniky things with a lot of complexity to go wrong.

I think you'd need a new RD but they aren't the most expensive items. They aren't complicated machinery and are very reliable so should be easy to pick up cheap with little risk.

I was going to suggest Microshift as a budget alternative to Shimano. It's worth investigating further but I just spent a whole 10 seconds looking aren't what I would call cheap.

I've never looked on Temu but I do hear from adventurous people on here that there are cheap things with suspicious names like Shamino for little money. That will probably fall to bits.

 

[roubaixtuesday]

On rear derailleurs, there's a thread here including compatibility charts for the rear.

https://forum.cyclinguk.org/viewtopic.php?t=154869

For front cable pull, info is hard to come by; most people seem to think front be made to work acceptably x groupset with limit screws etc. You could always try and replace derailleur later if you can't get it to work.

Must admit, I'm a bit mystified as to what the cables are in the way of. Unless you want a bar bag, I think there's very little benefit from concealed cabling, and it makes changing cables more difficult.

I think if it were me, and it mattered, I'd consider CUES, which can give a much wider gear range, though 2nd hand 105 might be a lot cheaper I guess.

https://bike.shimano.com/products/components.series_cues.seriesGeneration_cues_drop_bar.html

On the setup, I'm a similar height to you, and stock bikes are often far too low in the bars as a result. I doubt the stem is really too long. It's worth looking at stems with more rise, and often you can flip the stem over to achieve this. But you need to measure both rise and length of the current stem to understand better. And you can also vary how far forward the saddle is. I'd certainly look at stem rise and length before new bars.

 

[Dogtrousers]

I didn't think of CUES. I don't know anything about it.

 

[Time Waster]

Yes, I have used a bag with existing setup and the cables get in the way. The last change in cables has resulted in excessively long loops out front that really do get in the way and I doubt I would get the bag in there without reducing the length and refitting them, possibly those tube bend / noodle (?) things I have read can be used to help guide the cables out of the way. Not ideal. I used to find my old touring bar bag was rigid enough to just push the cables out of the way, but I always thought it was interfering with them too much.

Personally I find the side exit cables have always been annoying out front. Plus the shadow in the lights annoys the hell out of me. Seriously, whoever fitted them at the bike repair place must be on a bonus for cable length used. They put way too much cable length in there. Each side reaches right up high and almost to the other side!! Looks ridiculous and something I would want to change on its own even if I kept the current setup.

No idea if retaping bars is that much of an issue. I don't usually do it that often so each time I do it is like doing it the first time again. Even with that in mind the first side takes a fair bit of time but the second tape is pretty quick. IMHO it is not a big deal for me other than perhaps needing to buy tape more often. The bike shop does not charge much for it so no big deal compared to the annoying side entry cables I have right now. Personal choice but the market does seem to be going completely to the concealed cabling so perhaps I will need to go that way one day anyway if I replaced the bike at some point in the future.

Thanks guys. Need to look at what cues is.

 

[Drago]

Just out of interest, one of my bikes has those shifters (the long throw really suit my big hands so Ive stuck with them) and I was just curious as to what the cable gets in the way of for you?

Edit. Im a berk.

 

[roubaixtuesday]

Yes, I have used a bag with existing setup and the cables get in the way.

Ah, that makes sense. I'd deffo change if I wanted a bar bag.

 

[Dogtrousers]

Just had a look at CUES, specifically ST-U3030-10

Is the cable pull the same as 105 (5700)?

Weirdly no one seems to sell them as pairs. It's all L&R separately Looks like a new pair would be £160-200 ish which is about the same as a similar Microshift offering. A pair of new 105-R7000 (yes I know they are 11s) is £170 at Sigma sports. I don't know what new 5700s cost but I'd guess it's in the same ballpark.

So if you're looking for new shifters it doesn't look like there's a standout cheap option (unless there's something dodgy on Temu).

But you might be able to get lucky with an as-new bargain.

Is it time for me to have a rant about how we've all been hoodwinked by Big Shifter and how great down tube friction shifters are? Or should I wait for a few pages?

 

[figbat]

I’m in the same boat and had the same dilemma. I have 4600 on my road bike and have picked up some 5700 shifters to replace them, just haven’t got around to it yet.

 

[Punkawallah]

Have you considered looking at Chinese mail order suppliers? There are obvious caveats, but more than one YouTuber has done reviews on bike bits.

 

[Sharky]

Another strategy, is to switch to bar end shifters.
Keep your current levers for brakes only.
Seems to be less than £80.

 

[All uphill]

Just here to mention that I have a pair of Sora brifters (9x2) for sale in the relevant area of CC. These are the ones with the cables under the bar tape.

Edit to add that the shifters are currently on drop bars at the moment, and I'd include the bars in a sale at the asking price of £45 plus £5 p and p.

 

[Dogtrousers]

Here's a nice compatibility chart
https://productinfo.shimano.com/en/compatibility/C-454

It may or may not be the one referenced by @roubaixtuesday above

 

[Ming the Merciless]

Blimey an essay on changing brake levers

 

[midlandsgrimpeur]

With regards handlebars, Deda Zero 2 RHM has one of the shortest reach/drop combinations you will find. You can usually find them online for around £40. The shorter reach may also negate the need for a shorter stem.