Read all of Iain M Banks 'Culture' novels... what now?

[MacB]

Fair enough. And on that point I'd argue the 'aliens' in The Algebraist are...words fail. They spend most of their time channeling bad Brian Blessed character acting, with the whole interesting (they *hunt*their*own*young*to*kill*them*) biological points being entirely glossed as if entirely uninteresting. It's frankly like watching a bunch of teenagers playing some 'space' role-playing game, where the people taking the role of aliens are doing it for the bonuses and perks rather than the interest of exploring/playing/portraying something fundamentally unhuman.


I'm not familiar with that one at all, but have you read at least the first two 'Rama' novels by Arthur C Clarke? After that I can't speak, but the first in particular (Rendezvous with Rama) is a great exploration into what we could possibly deduce from what I'd term a truly 'alien' spacecraft's builders or occupants based on a limited sample of its interior.

Hey, not arguing on the Algebraist, one of the few Banks novels I haven't re-read along with Against a Dark Background.

Yep read all the Rama books and actually enjoyed the first and the last more than the others. Agree totally re the extrapolation around designs etc, that's fleshed out in much greater detail later on. Something I also found with Dune, I like the first and the 5th and 6th but not the other 3....I haven't tried the follow on stuff that's been cobbled together.

The 'what is a believable/good' alien debate can actually be quite interesting, it's just there really isn't a right/wrong answer....or at least not yet Some of the efforts that seem to be more critically acclaimed have struck me as just as formulaic as using an earth lifeform as a basis or playing with some sort of parallel evolution idea. They tend to rely on being inscrutable in some manner a bit like an author using the 'I can't explain XYZ as the words don't exist in earth languages'. Always makes me want to say...go on, have a go, it's what you're paid for after all.

For example I have really tried to like Gene Wolfe and failed every time, I have 5 of his books and I just don't get the popularity. Without a re-read I could barely flesh out the storyline, let alone any detail, they were just instantly forgetable for me. Other popular authors I can find I like one or two books but the rest leave me cold, Orson Scott-Card springs to mind for this.

 

[Norm]

Other popular authors I can find I like one or two books but the rest leave me cold, Orson Scott-Card springs to mind for this.

Yes to this. I was thinking of adding OSC but his books are really variable. I liked, for instance, Ender's Game and Xenocide but not Speaker for the Dead.

 

[Canrider]

That's interesting (Norm and MacB), Ender's Game and Speaker for the Dead are the only ones of that series I can stand. The Piggies are probably the high-water mark of writing 'aliens' that I've encountered. Whatever you do, do *not* read any of the Shadow series--he just craps all over the plot of Ender's Game in those.

Writing aliens--they don't have to be inscrutable, just noticeably different from anything human. We can rope fantasy into this as what are elves, dwarves, halflings and orcs if not 'aliens'? So: Elrond is a X000-year-old being who can't die unless he really wants to, how does that affect your mindset and approach to the world?

I'm afraid I've never even *heard* of Gene Wolfe..

 

[MacB]

But that's just it, why do they have to be noticeably different from anything human? The main criticism tends not to be on actual form anyway but rather the application of a familiar mindset/motivation. Larry Niven comes in for a lot of flack for his aliens yet I found some of his ideas fascinating, especially his spin on the origins of man and the Pac.

If intelligence is an evolved survival trait then those that rely on a human template probably aren't too far off the mark.

 

[just jim]

I've just read Joe Abercrombie's First Law trilogy and really enjoyed it - this was my first dip into Fantasy's shimmering waters. Sort of "if Alan Bleasdale wrote fantasy". Now that I am more comfortable around wizards I might see what else there is. My arms can't really cope with another Peter F. Hamilton novel, unless it's on Kindle.

 

[Inertia]

Some great suggestions, most I've never heard of. I stumbled across Banks purely by accident - was given his book of short storys 'State of the Art'.

I think I'll be working my way through them soon - thanks again all.

If anyone's read them, I've also had someone at work banging on to me about the fantasy novel series 'Malazen Empire' which I am going to give a try as well, as he's bringing book one in for me

I was going to suggest those, Im up to book 4 at the moment, it can be confusing in the first book as there are SO many characters introduced in one go that its hard to keep up but its worth it IMO. The world he creates is incredibly well done and detailed. He also doesn't pull his punches so don't get too attached to anyone

Enders game is a really good sci fi series, The Forever war is one of my all time favourite books not just sci fi. Finally Naomi Noviks Temeraire series is really good, its a re-emagined history of the Napoleonic wars with an air force of dragons thrown in

 

[Flying_Monkey]

If you're into properly alien aliens / first contact novels, then I can recommend three fairly recent novels - Blindsight by Peter Watts, Embassytown by China Mieville and Learning the World by Ken Macleod. You might also want to read Vernor Vinge's ongoing series that starts with A Fire Upon The Deep.

Incidentally, Ken Macleod has also written two very interesting SF series, one which starts with The Star Fraction, and another with Cosmonaut Keep. Both are, unusually for much US-dominated SF, very socialist...

 

[Norm]

As an aside, FM, I think I remember that you're into Fanfic.

Have you anything you could recommend in this genre as it's difficult fishing anything worth eating from the lake of dross that is fanfic.

 

[Paul.G.]

As above. I've recently read all of the above books, and absolutely loved them, and now I'm looking for my next books.

I'd prefer a series rather than a standalone novel, and sci-fi would be good too. Again, preferably a new author that I haven't read before. If it helps, my other all time favourite books are Terry Pratchetts Discworld, and Bernad Cornwell's Sharpes.

Anyone got any suggestions?

Take it you have read all the "dexter" books !!

 

[CopperCyclist]

Lol, yes. I felt that the third one (I may have lost count here) got a bit too silly when they made the dark passenger a more 'real' supernatural being rather than a metaphor. The most recent novel was better again though.

 

[Andrew_Culture]

Sorry to resurrect an old thread but I too have now read all the Culture novels; today I finished re-reading 'Consider Phelbas' (makes much more sense second time).

I was planning on Dan Simmons next but will review the entirety of this thread with interest.

Have you read Banks' non-Culture sci-fi? I thought The Algebraist was great.

 

[Andrew_Culture]

Not much help to the OP but the character of the ship "Falling Outside The Normal Moral Constraints" in Surface Detail is just brilliant. As is the book imho.

John

I agree entirely, I think 'Surface Detail' is the best Culture novel for very many reasons. I love the ships / minds, although I need to re-read the mind-centric 'Excession' as I'm not sure I understand the plot

 

[Dan B]

Incidentally, Ken Macleod has also written two very interesting SF series, one which starts with The Star Fraction, and another with Cosmonaut Keep. Both are, unusually for much US-dominated SF, very socialist...

Macleod may be writing in a field dominated by US writers, but he himself is - as far as I know - Scottish. Just like Iain Banks ...

(You might also check out Charlie Stross, but his stuff often tends more towards the silly than the grandiose)

 

[Melonfish]

Excession is my fave culture novel, followed closely by Consider Phlebas. two brilliant books, must admit though i could never get more then halfway through Feersum Endjinn.

i've read Dan Simmons's stuff and i love that brilliantly huge operatic style sci-fi he does, i actually started with illium/olympus and got hooked there, then read the hyperion omnibus then the Endymion omnibus. cracking stuff!
Larry niven is a fave, the ringworld trilogy was brilliant, and i've just spotted he's done 4 prequals, i'm about to grab them because i can't wait to get my fix again
i can also recommend his books rainbow mars and destiny's road.
S.M Stirling is one i'd also recommend, the nantucket and emberverse books are very good indeed.
they're tied into each other, one deals with an island being transported back to something like 3500bc and having to survive. the other is the world left behind and the failure of all technology etc where man is thrown into a medieval existence.
then of course there's asimov's foundation and empire books, just plain epic and should be on any sci-fi geeks reading list!!

if you've not read much Arthur C clarke then 2001, 2010 and 3001 are good reads, Childhoods end is my favourite however, its just spot on imo.

oh and honorable mention to the Hitchikers Guide to the Galaxy because its still a damned good read no matter how many times you read it.
pete

 

[Andrew_Culture]

I've not read any reports of Feersum that inspire me to read it; I don't think I can be doing with made-up languages!

Macleod sounds great, which title should I start with?