Road skills - do you signal left turns?

[John the Monkey]

There are two things that sometimes go wrong signalling left.

The most dangerous, I think, is the left hook ... and I think its very rare when you're turning left from primary position.

I'm usually in primary at junctions (would be at roundabouts, but my commute no longer includes any) because of bad experiences early on in my commuting - (thank heaven for this place, or I'd still be pootling along at the kerb all the time).

The other one, almost as dangerous, is when someone accelerates at you because you're about to get out of their way. You signal, they speed up, someone steps out from the path in the junction where you want to go so you have to stop, and you're screwed. Had several very near misses like that, so now if there is traffic behind me I signal to turn left very late.

Gotcha - good info Cab, thank you.

 

[alecstilleyedye]

one time i always signal left is on the fast down hill down to a set of lights. if they're green and i'm doing 30ish mph then i think it would be suicide not to let cars behind know that you will be slowing down imminently.

agree with cab on the turning left from primary thing too.

 

[Cab]

In my experience people don't change their behaviour because of "being taught a lesson" by other raod users, it does often results in resentment and aggression against the "teacher" or the road user group he is in.

Depends on how the lesson is taught I think. I see many of the same vehicles day in, day out, and a lot of the drivers do learn from being asked not to do something dangerous again. Not all of them, but I'm sure it does work.

Respect on the roads is regrettably very much related to size of the vehicle and the damage it can do.

With you so far...

People might "respect" an 18 wheeler articulated truck, cyclists should IMO be very careful before attempting to assert their rights, it may backfire. If not against you there and then, they may take it out later against some other innocent cyclist.

...but here you're just plain wrong.

If you don't assert your right to be in an appropriate, safe road position even if that does inconvenienve someone else then (1) you're risking your life needlessly, (2) you're reinforcing to the motorist the false impression that we're meant to be in the wrong place and other cyclists in a safer road position will continue to get more aggro, and (3) you're setting a bad example to inexperienced cyclists.

I'm not saying be a tit on the road, but don't be afraid to assert your rights where you should do so.

 

[Membrane]

...but here you're just plain wrong.

If you don't assert your right to be in an appropriate, safe road position even if that does inconvenienve someone else then (1) you're risking your life needlessly

Certainly, as I said before, if safety is at stake then assert your rights. But in context of what I replied to (teaching someone a lesson for its own sake), it doesn't work in my experience and is likely to result in aggression. I'd rank aggression by motorists as big a risk to cyclists as driving incompetence.

My experience is probably coloured by living in a busy city with poor infrastructure.

 

[BentMikey]

But in context of what I replied to (teaching someone a lesson for its own sake)

Yes, I would never advocate teaching a lesson to anyone on the road. The most I might do is write a letter afterwards to a company about their driver, or perhaps in a non-confrontational way ask for a driver to give cyclists a little more room next time they overtake one.

To be fair to Jan though, I'm not sure he meant that comment in the way it could be interpreted.

 

[Chuffy]

I've never, ever, been 'left-hooked' in the manner described and I always signal left. I have a real problem with the idea that by being ambiguous you are forcing other road users to give you more space and that this is a good thing. I'd much prefer to give out clear and unequivocal signals, including my road position. I expect other road users to be courteous and signal their intentions, so I return the courtesy. No doing so is rude and invites misunderstanding, not to mention feeding into the perception of cyclists being an erratic menace.

 

[Terminator]

Signal with two fingers.It really turns them on.

 

[BentMikey]

Chuffy, I think you must be extremely lucky then, because either the left hook or the oncoming right turner is not that unusual a situation. It's happened to me a couple of times, enough that it's a risk to take avoiding action for.

I don't think I'm wrong here either, because other experienced cyclists whose opinions I respect have covered exactly the same sort of approach, as well as it being in Cyclecraft.

 

[BentMikey]

"The best way not to be noticed is to wear urban camouflage - dark clothing, no lights,no reflectors and a no helmet." Says the average motorist.[/SIZE]

You do realise that this is wrong, because of all the people that complain about ninja cyclists, they've all seen them, LOL! It's the ones you never saw that you need to worry about.

 

[John Ponting]

6 pages to read through? I'm sure it's already been said but ... I always signal if I feel there is some benefit to it. Decisions are/should be based on need not habit. Are you approaching a potential hazard ? decide on course of action; if you need to change direction CONSIDER a signal; rear observation before changing position or direction; repeat rear observation just before turning as a life saver - check over left shoulder when turning left (that's where another cyclist will creep up inside if you are in primary).


shamelessly paraphrased from a 1985 copy of motorcycle road craft. Can't all be wrong, I've ridden/driven 2 wheelers for almost 45 years and never yet hit, or been hit by, another road user. Quite a few years of regular commuting from Herts in to Brent and Vauxhall.

More than my fair share of luck as well, I suspect.

 

[Terminator]

They overtake and then throw a left anyway...not quite a left hook as a left hook is more deadly.

 

[Terminator]

You do realise that this is wrong, because of all the people that complain about ninja cyclists, they've all seen them, LOL! It's the ones you never saw that you need to worry about.

Shame I didn't have a helmet cam on tonight mikey I had a bendy bus overtake and cut right in front of me to get to the bus stop.Of course when a bus overtakes me I almost always expect that to happen but I reckon it would have turned you on.

 

[yenrod]

I let a cardriver know if they're waiting... if not phuc'em. the **** me over plenty !

Here's a question for you. Do you signal left when turning left? I'm interested in not only what you do, but in what situations and why.

 

[Terminator]

Mikey have you been smoking the Jamacian woodbines mate?

 

[catwoman]

For some reason I can't signal a left turn in the conventional way. When I take my left hand off the handlebars I lose my balance!
I'm proficient at signalling right however and I think a right-hand signal is more important for obvious reasons, changing lanes etc.
When I approach a left turn I change my road position from primary and slow down. If someone's going to cut across me I'll let them go, can't be bothered to get indignant at certain points of the ride, particularly when my movements may be misinterpreted.
I do have alternatives to the conventional left signal though. My road position changes from primary, I slow down and if there's someone waiting to come out I will point across with my right hand my intention to turn left. Drivers and pedestrians in front of me seem to have no problem with that signal. No-one has rear-ended me because I change my road position leaving as much room as possible for overtaking.
You lot may think I'm a rank amateur for not being able to take my left hand off the handlebars without feeling like I'm going to fall off ( again) but I've been riding for nearly 25 years in heavy London traffic and have never had any mishaps on a left turn. Plenty of drivers have acknowledged my unusual left turn signal as they are coming out of my intended turning if there's any eye contact and seem OK with it.