Route planning rules of thumb?

[Dogtrousers]

I don't know when you did this LEJOG but that old air field track was resurfaced late 2018 / early 2019. Nice smooth tarmac last time I passed that way.

Others comments about NCN hold true though. You are never sure of exactly what you are going to get. Other than surprised that is!

It was 2021

You are right, Checking my route with Streetview, the path we took through Burn airfield is nice and smooth. So I can't remember where it was that we had our "call this a national route?" moment of outrage and planned to write to the Daily Telegraph, or our MPs. It was somewhere that day.

My memory has let me down and I apologise to the lovely NCN people who laid that path through Burn Airfield

 

[presta]

I made it up as I went along, based on a combination of:

• Prior knowledge
• What looked promising on my road atlas
• Time and energy available
• Bagging new hostels that I hadn't visited before

Sometimes I missed out on seeing something I didn't know was there, but generally that was far outweighed by not being committed to advance plans, not having to spend ages researching beforehand, and discovering things by complete surprise (eg: Caen Hill locks). On the occasions that I've tried planning, I generally end up losing the will to live when it becomes apparent that I'm spending longer on it than the ride or walk will take. It's a particular chore if you're dependent on public transport and trying to fit it to a formally defined trail as well.

That said, in my fellwalking days I'd spend the whole winter with my Wainwright guides working out how to bag as many summits as possible in a week's holiday.

(Re prior knowledge above: I used to like cycling in the places I already knew well from walking.)

 

[presta]

Another tip is that you may find there are busy roads or motorways that intersect the route you would like. Search for places where minor roads either cross directly or use a bridge or tunnel to get past. Then tweak your route to use those crossing places and minimise time interacting with busy roads. If my route joins a busy road for a bit in a town / 30 zone I am less concerned about it. You need to be pragmatic as well.

Rivers, first find the river bridges.

For example if you're cycling from Thurlby YHA to Sherwood YHA there are only three bridges on the twenty odd mile stretch of the Trent that bars your way, and they're all main roads. Cycling from Woody's Top to Beverley, your only options are the Humber Bridge (52 miles) or Goole, 88 miles.

 

[Ming the Merciless]

For example if you're cycling from Thurlby YHA to Sherwood YHA there are only three bridges on the twenty odd mile stretch of the Trent that bars your way

There is cycle route 647 along the old railway that crosses the Trent along there.

 

[dimrub]

Let me try and change the course of the conversation a bit. What I'm looking for I guess is a list of points I must not miss while en-route. I can then take a subset of those points and build a route around them.

To be more specific, I'm thinking of tackling this route in 3 installments (maybe more), with 1st one being tentatively planned for the upcoming April. I'm thinking of dedicating a week or so to reaching Birmingham (this may be a bit too ambitious, but it's a reasonable initial goal). I'll definitely want to spend some time in Bristol and Glocester (I've passed through last year, and I want a closer look at both). Would it be considered a reasonable detour to go through Bath? In terms of the kind of places I'm looking for - historical landmarks, cathedrals, ancient pubs with nice food, beautiful nature are all good things to experience during the day. I'll be staying at B&Bs and the likes, so accommodations are rarely a limiting factor - although if there's a special historical hotel, that's also something to consider.

 

[nogoodnamesleft]

Let me try and change the course of the conversation a bit. What I'm looking for I guess is a list of points I must not miss while en-route. I can then take a subset of those points and build a route around them.

I'd do that on https://cycle.travel by setting start and end to the overall start and end of the entire journey. Then add those "must not miss" poiunts as "Via Points" (the route always goes through via points). You can also add overnight stops as "via points" as well as flag them as stops.

You can also add notes to a "Via Point" and they should pop-up on your GPS device. I used this feature once cycling a set route where I had to take a photo at pre-determined points to prove I had cycled the route. From my notes on a ride using the feature ("Via Points" with notes on my Garmin 1040):

If a cycle.travel route has via points with notes added when cycling a course the Garmin creates an extra page to the left of the map (swipe left, between map and solar info pages) called "Course Points" that lists all cycle.travel via points on route that have added notes, incl for each one distance to point and ETA at point. As you get close the map page shows a small icon (not very noticeable) and when you are at the point it beeps and pops-up the added note text. Only shortcoming is it only notifies when you are at the point, no advanced notice like Garmin does for navigation turns - but that's a Garmin thing not cycle.travel.

Something I do (not neccesary, just me) when cycling a multi-day route using cycle.travel is load and setup the entire route and then duplicate the route and split it into separate days eg a 3 day route would me "Master (everything) Route" and 3 duplicates "Day 1" (delete after 1st night stop), "Day 2" (delete before 1st night and after 2nd night), "Day 3", etc. but that's just because I like seeing the "Distance to destination" and ETA on my GPS as I ride each day.

 

[dimrub]

Thanks! What I meant though is not the technical aspects of how to mark the points of interest, but rather whether anyone has any specific points of interest to share, between Land's End and Bristol (and maybe also between Glocester and Birmingham).

 

[dimrub]

So here's my trick: I went ahead and consulted Gemini. And now I'll present the route it built for me here, and perhaps you folks will have a thing or two to say about it.

I only asked for a route till Birmingham, and here's what it came up with:

Day 1 Detail: The Cornish Tip to the Cathedral City​

Total Distance: ~65km (40 miles)

• Total Elevation: ~900m (Expect "sawtooth" profile)
• Terrain: 90% Tarmac, 10% coastal gravel/paths.

Mapping Waypoints (for Komoot/Strava):

1. Land’s End Signpost (The iconic start)
2. Sennen Cove (Beautiful descent and climb back out)
3. Mousehole (Narrow, quaint fishing village—stop for coffee)
4. Penzance Promenade (Flat spin past the lido)
5. Marazion (View of St. Michael’s Mount)
6. Truro Cathedral (Finish at the High Victorian Gothic spire)

Day 2: Truro to Tavistock (The Gateway to Devon)​

Leaving the cathedral city, you’ll traverse the "backbone" of Cornwall into the historic stannary town of Tavistock.

• Distance: ~78km | Elevation: ~1,100m
• Waypoints: 1. Ladock (Quiet valley lanes) 2. Lostwithiel (Ancient capital of Cornwall; check out the 13th-century bridge) 3. Lanhydrock House (Stunning National Trust estate with cycle trails) 4. Minions (Highest village in Cornwall; see "The Hurlers" stone circles) 5. Gunnislake (Crossing the River Tamar into Devon)
• Point of Interest: The Bedford Hotel in Tavistock. It’s built on the site of a 10th-century Abbey—very historic.

Day 3: Tavistock to Tiverton (The Granite Way & Red Valleys)​

A spectacular day using the "Granite Way" to bypass the steepest parts of Northern Dartmoor.

• Distance: ~82km | Elevation: ~950m
• Waypoints:
  1. Lydford (Visit Lydford Gorge and the medieval castle)
  2. Meldon Viaduct (Incredible views from a disused railway bridge)
  3. Okehampton (Stop for "elevenses" near the castle)
  4. Crediton (A historic town with a magnificent collegiate church)
  5. Tiverton Canal Path (Finish with a flat spin on the horse-drawn canal towpath)
• Point of Interest: Bickleigh Castle near Tiverton offers a very "Old England" stay.

Day 4: Tiverton to Wells (The Smallest City)​

Transitioning from the rolling hills of Devon to the flat Somerset Levels, ending at the most beautiful cathedral in England.

• Distance: ~85km | Elevation: ~600m
• Waypoints:
  1. Wellington (See the monument on the hill)
  2. Taunton (Historic Somerset town; good for a mid-day refuel)
  3. Langport (The heart of the Levels)
  4. Glastonbury Tor (A spiritual/historical detour; a short hike up if you have time)
  5. Wells Cathedral (The West Front is a masterpiece)
• Point of Interest: Vicar’s Close in Wells. It is the oldest purely residential street with its original buildings all surviving intact in Europe.

Day 5: Wells to Bristol via Bath (The Heritage Loop)​

A shorter day with high "Interest Density." We’ll use the Strawberry Line and the famous Bristol-Bath rail trail.

• Distance: ~68km | Elevation: ~550m
• Waypoints:
  1. Cheddar Gorge (A world-famous limestone gorge—a spectacular climb or ride-by)
  2. The Strawberry Line (Former railway line through orchards)
  3. Bath Abbey & Roman Baths (Spend 2 hours here; it’s worth the detour)
  4. Bristol & Bath Railway Path (13 miles of traffic-free gravel/tarmac)
  5. Clifton Suspension Bridge (Iconic Brunel engineering)
• Point of Interest: Hotel Du Vin Bristol City Centre, housed in 1700s sugar warehouses.

Day 6: Bristol to Gloucester (The Severn Vale)​

Heading north along the River Severn. The terrain flattens out here, allowing for higher speed.

• Distance: ~65km | Elevation: ~400m
• Waypoints:
  1. Berkeley Castle (Where King Edward II was murdered; very atmospheric)
  2. Slimbridge (Famous wetlands and nature reserve)
  3. Frampton-on-Severn (Claims to have the longest village green in England)
  4. Gloucester Docks (Fascinating Victorian warehouses)
  5. Gloucester Cathedral (Find the cloisters used in the Harry Potter films)

Day 7: Gloucester to Birmingham (The Final Push)​

A scenic route through the Malverns and the historic heart of the Midlands.

• Distance: ~85km | Elevation: ~700m
• Waypoints:
  1. Tewkesbury Abbey (A massive Norman abbey that survived the Dissolution)
  2. Upton-upon-Severn (Classic riverside town)
  3. Great Malvern (Victorian spa town; refill your bottles at the Malvern Spring)
  4. Worcester Cathedral (Contains the tomb of King John)
  5. Worcester & Birmingham Canal (Follow this traffic-free route directly into Gas Street Basin in central Birmingham)

---

The actual distances are somewhat longer, but I can still keep it at a manageable distance by either adding a day, or cutting out a couple of detours.

 

[Ming the Merciless]

but rather whether anyone has any specific points of interest to share

A point of interest for one rider, is a point of disinterest to another. What kind of thing specifically do you want to see?

 

[mikeIow]

I do 1, but to be fair I did build my own routing software to choose the sort of routes I like, which might be going a bit far!

Even then, my 800-mile ride across France last year had about 100 via points to tweak the ride. Lots of map and Street View research. Ultimately I would like to make cycle.travel better at choosing that sort of route without the via points, but it’s a never ending task.

I did 1 & I used your software - thanks 🙏
Not sure why Mike above says “definitely not 1” 🧐

My short thread linked in my signature below.

IMHO, cycle.travel is a fantastic tool for planning: picked the quiet roads for the distances I wanted, easy to use 👍
Slightly fiddly to get to my Wahoo, but by the time I left I had 19 days perfectly planned (avg 55 miles per day, but a couple of 84s in there - by far the furthest I had cycled in a day!).
Also had little printed route cards per day to have in the handlebar bag in case of issues: a career in data protection couldn’t let me rely 100% on one device🤣 ….but my wahoo kept me on track the entire route 💪

Cards for Part 1:

Mine as a ride of 3 parts, with some camping in the middle bit (& a 35kg hybrid bike 🫣)

I then played around a little to suit overnight stops….mostly b&bs from LE to Leicester (brief break to wash things at home!), b&bs plus a couple of nights camping from Leics to Edinburgh….couple of nights (wash, relax at son’s uni digs) before the final gentle leg to JoG 💪

Sure, you have to help it decide where to stop, but it can work things it as much or little as you want.

My route:

 

[Dogtrousers]

Thanks! What I meant though is not the technical aspects of how to mark the points of interest, but rather whether anyone has any specific points of interest to share, between Land's End and Bristol (and maybe also between Glocester and Birmingham).

That's a really interesting question. I really enjoyed my chunk of Lejog (actually Weymouth to York) that I rode but I couldn't really name you a single "point" that I found interesting (Does Gregg's count?). It was more about changing landscapes for me. But that's just my opinion.

Between Gloucester and Birmingham I'd say you have the opportunity of visiting the Cotswolds which are beautiful but will slow you down, beat you up and tire you out with hills, or doing what we did and broadly following the flatness of the Severn and the Avon, which we did (or you could do something else altogether, of course).

We ride from (approx) Bristol to near Coventry which was a long day, dictated by the location of friends who were putting us up. Hence we had a route dictated by the needs for flatness and directness that day.

 

[presta]

I can vouch for Lanhydrock and Lydford Gorge, but whether you'll have time to do them justice and cycle is a different matter. I thought Gloucester docks looked promising, but I didn't have time to see them as I passed through.

 

[dimrub]

A point of interest for one rider, is a point of disinterest to another. What kind of thing specifically do you want to see?

Good question! I like to learn about the history of the places I'm going through. Give me my cathedrals and my National Trust maintained estates any day. I also like the nature, the more varied the better. I like staying in old hotels too - that pub/hotel in Winslow - The Bell I think - was a great addition to our route last year.

Between Gloucester and Birmingham I'd say you have the opportunity of visiting the Cotswolds which are beautiful but will slow you down, beat you up and tire you out with hills, or doing what we did and broadly following the flatness of the Severn and the Avon, which we did (or you could do something else altogether, of course).

We rode a bit of that last year, from Bristol to Cheltenham, then onwards to Oxford. Frankly, if I had to guess, I'd say that 'O' in the CAONB stands for "OK", but that one brutal climb out of Cheltenham did not bother us all that much.

I can vouch for Lanhydrock and Lydford Gorge, but whether you'll have time to do them justice and cycle is a different matter. I thought Gloucester docks looked promising, but I didn't have time to see them as I passed through.

Ditto. We should have stopped and explored, but it was either that, or visiting the cathedral. We went with the latter, and managed just barely.