Shakespeare and stuff

[Piemaster]

If I went to see 'Romeo and Juliet' but the actor started singing 'Maria' from West Side Story would is that Shakespeare or a west end musical?

Not as though I'd go to see either, BTW.

 

[srw]

If I went to see 'Romeo and Juliet' but the actor started singing 'Maria' from West Side Story would is that Shakespeare or a west end musical?

Not as though I'd go to see either, BTW.

Depends on the context. Since West Side Story was based on R&J, I can see that a production of R&J set in an urban jungle and using some of Bernstein's songs would work well. Watch Baz Luhrman's Romeo and Juliet (starring Leonardo di Caprio). It's got that grimy feel, and some imaginative use of updating - "Put up thy sword" is accompanied by a close-up of a pistol, branded Sword.

And don't get me started on soundtracks and incidental music. I'm assuming that the impossibly pedantic @Cunobelin wouldn't recognise the difference between genuine 1920s music and the pastiches used by the production team...

 

[winjim]

What? Every word is tedious drivel? Every line? In every play? Even, for instance, Henry V?

Every production I've seen. And all the little sketches you see on things like the birthday celebrations. Boring and usually overacted, with a nod and a wink like you need to be in on the joke.

I di t get theatre at all. The suspension of disbelief is never achieved and for me its just luvvues pretending.

But not with Shakespeare. Perhaps its the text, or the period...it must be something because its the only form of theatre I ever actually enjoy.

Still not convinced try these two.

1. Get a ticket for mid summer....etc... in the park in London. Its an outdoor event and is a very pleasant night out (take a picnic)

2 go for full on Luvvie aversion therapy and watch Henry V or much ado about nothing, by Kenneth Brannagh's renaissance film company, on Netflix (or your viewing weapon of choice) Henry V is like die hard in tights, its bloody awesome and much ado is probably Keanu reeves best performance.

Brannagh does a fab job of bringing the text to life with a modern pace and within minutes you are washed along with it all.

Watch all that and then realise the connections and plot devices used today by some of the best screenwriters, directors and film makers....tarantino, Hitchcock, Abrams they must all be massive fans of Shakespeare ...either that or their lecturer's were

See I can't really be bothered any more. It just means absolutely nothing to me so I'm not going to spend another two hours of my life trying. We recently had one last crack at it with Coriolanus but it was dull, meaningless shite and I couldn't make any sense of it at all so I gave up. But I acknowledge the influence Shakespeare has had on other writers and directors. (although Tarantino is a bad example because all he does is regurgitate and repackage other people's ideas anyway). I do enjoy Kurosawa .

However, since I watched Wolf Hall I am a bit in love with Mark Rylance, so I'd be willing to have him change my mind .

 

[jonny jeez]

Every production I've seen. And all the little sketches you see on things like the birthday celebrations. Boring and usually overacted, with a nod and a wink like you need to be in on the joke.

See I can't really be bothered any more. It just means absolutely nothing to me so I'm not going to spend another two hours of my life trying. We recently had one last crack at it with Coriolanus but it was dull, meaningless shite and I couldn't make any sense of it at all so I gave up. But I acknowledge the influence Shakespeare has had on other writers and directors. (although Tarantino is a bad example because all he does is regurgitate and repackage other people's ideas anyway). I do enjoy Kurosawa .

However, since I watched Wolf Hall I am a bit in love with Mark Rylance, so I'd be willing to have him change my mind .

Tarantino is an awesome example. His plots are often disparate and unlinked until the last moment when everything just comes together in a superbly suspensive chaos...very shakespear-esque

Trust me, if you ever fancy watching a film one night, watch Henry V by Brannagh, its proper awesome, not in the slightest bit pretentious or cliquey and is a superb action flick.

Henry V is a full on hardnut, with a devious mind and a superb spirit of leadership, the opening scene where he sets up a corrupt seaman is awesome,


its worth one last go.

 

[jonny jeez]

Downton Abbey set on a council estate sounds like it would be an improvement on the original bit of claptrap. It's basically a soap opera for snobs - using the same text but giving the nobs' lines to the lairy arrogant shoots and the plebs' lines to the people trying to scrape a vaguely honest living sounds like something worth thinking about.

Down on Abbeywood!

there we go, we have a title, a treatment, all we need is some cash!

 

[GrumpyGregry]

Every production I've seen. And all the little sketches you see on things like the birthday celebrations. Boring and usually overacted, with a nod and a wink like you need to be in on the joke.

Go and see the RSC doing Henry V at some point.

Or watch the BBC's Hollow Crown series of plays.

 

[Profpointy]

Every production I've seen. And all the little sketches you see on things like the birthday celebrations. Boring and usually overacted, with a nod and a wink like you need to be in on the joke.

See I can't really be bothered any more. It just means absolutely nothing to me so I'm not going to spend another two hours of my life trying. We recently had one last crack at it with Coriolanus but it was dull, meaningless shite and I couldn't make any sense of it at all so I gave up. But I acknowledge the influence Shakespeare has had on other writers and directors. (although Tarantino is a bad example because all he does is regurgitate and repackage other people's ideas anyway). I do enjoy Kurosawa .

However, since I watched Wolf Hall I am a bit in love with Mark Rylance, so I'd be willing to have him change my mind .

There are a few dull productions sure, those old BBC shakespeares we were subjected to as kids for instance, never mind reading it iut in class.

Branagh's movie of Henry V is pretty good, but for me somewhat spoiltt by cheesy music over the St Crispin's day speech. My favourite movie adaptions include Raif Fiennes' Coriolanus, a "traditional" rendering complete with M16s and Kalashnikovs. Brilliant from start to end. And the other one is McKellern in Rich 3. Cunobelin wouldn't make it past the opening scene where a gas masked McKellern shoots riding on a tank shoots the Lancastrian King with his Mauser pistol. Looks fantastic, and very filmic (if that's the word) but it's still really about the words.

You are missing out, and though I guess not everyone likes everything, someone who highky rates Kurasawa's work clearly has some taste!

A recent stage (RSC) production of Titus Andronicus made Kill Bill look like Camberwick Green. This was Shakespeare's first big hit apparently so violence and mayhem was obviosuly the way to get the punters in.

What brought Shakespeare's worth home to.me was my first live production. Drama students doing Macbeth. Bare stage, and the actors themselves brought in a table or a throne for indoors, and carried them off for outdoors. As a 12 year old I was gripped all the way through. Unfortunately the recent film version, though it looks good manages to turn an action play into a bit of a bore, which is quite an achievement.

The other thing I remember from school is studying A Man for All Seasons, which is a rather good (modern) play about Thomas More and Henry VIiI but after year I was sick of it. a year of Midsummer Nights Dream, which is an easy romp really, and I was still seeing new things in each line.

Anyhow, getting carried away now...

 

[Profpointy]

I would find fault with a perfectly good piece of fish, if I had ordered steak

Equally I would find fault with a holiday in Brighton if I had paid for New York

Sounds to me like you've found fault with the steak because the plates it's served on were a different colour on the website

 

[r04DiE]

There's no polite way of putting this but you are an idiot

That's the second sig I've found today. Thanks Ha ha ha.

EDIT: But, damn and blast - I can't link it.

 

[winjim]

Tarantino is an awesome example. His plots are often disparate and unlinked until the last moment when everything just comes together in a superbly suspensive chaos...very shakespear-esque

Trust me, if you ever fancy watching a film one night, watch Henry V by Brannagh, its proper awesome, not in the slightest bit pretentious or cliquey and is a superb action flick.

Henry V is a full on hardnut, with a devious mind and a superb spirit of leadership, the opening scene where he sets up a corrupt seaman is awesome,


its worth one last go.

So there's a single decent production of a single Shakespeare play? Much the same as there's a single good Tarantino film*.

Go and see the RSC doing Henry V at some point.

Or watch the BBC's Hollow Crown series of plays.

Well no, I shan't be doing that. Mainly because I don't enjoy Shakespeare.

My favourite movie adaptions include Raif Fiennes' Coriolanus, a "traditional" rendering complete with M16s and Kalashnikovs. Brilliant from start to end.

That was the one I tried to watch when I was giving Shakespeare one last chance. Did absolutely nothing for me.

You are missing out

Quite possibly, but there's so much other entertainment and culture to get stuck into, including that inspired and influenced by Shakespeare himself, that I don't think it's leaving such a large hole in my life.


*Jackie Brown, which he didn't even write.

 

[Dave 123]

Ve

Well, @Dave 123, did you enjoy your Shakespeare play?

Very good @Katherine .
I don't often go to a thatched, open air theatre so that was a pleasant experience.

The performance was set in the1880-1900 era going by the costume. The cast were all Irish, so I wasn't expecting that.

The story was easy enough to follow, with enough toilet humour to satisfy me!

Mrs Dave has seen different productions of it and she says it was more aggressive than the other ones she's seen.

I enjoyed it, Mrs Dave thought it was fabulous. This is what I'd hoped for when I had the idea to get the tickets.

I also knew where Palestine is....

 

[Dave 123]

And here is the Gazza strip

 

[Profpointy]

Ve


Very good @Katherine .
I don't often go to a thatched, open air theatre so that was a pleasant experience.

The performance was set in the1880-1900 era going by the costume. The cast were all Irish, so I wasn't expecting that.

The story was easy enough to follow, with enough toilet humour to satisfy me!

Mrs Dave has seen different productions of it and she says it was more aggressive than the other ones she's seen.

I enjoyed it, Mrs Dave thought it was fabulous. This is what I'd hoped for when I had the idea to get the tickets.

I also knew where Palestine is....

Tricky play taming of the Shrew and quite uncomfortable viewing for a modern audience as Kate can seem totally broken at the end. Only seen it once nearly 40 years ago on a school trip to the RSC, but it was very good for all that.

Much ado about nothing is I think my favourite of the comedies, and Beatrice can certainly get the better of any man. the word play and insults are just great. Must have seen that one three or four times - the best being modern(ish) dress one in Oxford.

 

[Pale Rider]

I can't get away with the plays - they are all Greek to me - but Shakepeare's contribution to the written and spoken word is immense.

As Bernard Levin put it:

If you cannot understand my argument, and declare ``It's Greek to me'', you are quoting Shakespeare; if you claim to be more sinned against than sinning, you are quoting Shakespeare; if you recall your salad days, you are quoting Shakespeare; if you act more in sorrow than in anger; if your wish is farther to the thought; if your lost property has vanished into thin air, you are quoting Shakespeare; if you have ever refused to budge an inch or suffered from green-eyed jealousy, if you have played fast and loose, if you have been tongue-tied, a tower of strength, hoodwinked or in a pickle, if you have knitted your brows, made a virtue of necessity, insisted on fair play, slept not one wink, stood on ceremony, danced attendance (on your lord and master), laughed yourself into stitches, had short shrift, cold comfort or too much of a good thing, if you have seen better days or lived in a fool's paradise -why, be that as it may, the more fool you , for it is a foregone conclusion that you are (as good luck would have it) quoting Shakespeare; if you think it is early days and clear out bag and baggage, if you think it is high time and that that is the long and short of it, if you believe that the game is up and that truth will out even if it involves your own flesh and blood, if you lie low till the crack of doom because you suspect foul play, if you have your teeth set on edge (at one fell swoop) without rhyme or reason, then - to give the devil his due - if the truth were known (for surely you have a tongue in your head) you are quoting Shakespeare; even if you bid me good riddance and send me packing, if you wish I was dead as a door-nail, if you think I am an eyesore, a laughing stock, the devil incarnate, a stony-hearted villain, bloody-minded or a blinking idiot, then - by Jove! O Lord! Tut tut! For goodness' sake! What the dickens! But me no buts! - it is all one to me, for you are quoting Shakespeare.

 

[Tail End Charlie]

Trust me, if you ever fancy watching a film one night, watch Henry V by Brannagh, its proper awesome, not in the slightest bit pretentious or cliquey and is a superb action flick.

Henry V is a full on hardnut, with a devious mind and a superb spirit of leadership, the opening scene where he sets up a corrupt seaman is awesome,


its worth one last go.

I totally agree, it's a superb film. My favourite scene is where the "Dolphin" sends him some tennis balls and Henry's reply starts very quietly and gradually builds up to a full blown declaration of war.