Should truck drivers have their licences suspended for using mobile phones?‏

[Trevor_P]

I'm not saying that doesn't happen, but I am saying the number of cyclists and car drivers that creep up the blind side of trucks at junctions and roundabouts is very high. Almost a daily occurrence. In my experience.

Are you saying lorry drivers don't turn across cyclists!!!

I was cycling in a Bus lane to the left of the line of traffic. Stopped in the ASL, lorry pulled up behind and in main line of traffic (right hand lane). When lights when green, both of us set off going straight on, and he decided to pull over into my lane to stop on double yellows. Luckily I was aware of the danger and realised what could potentially happen and stopped. Otherwise I would have been another accident statistic. I stopped to talk to him and he apologized and said he hadn't seen me. And there are plenty of videos on the web to show that lorry drivers make mistakes (as do cyclists), but it will be the cyclist who comes off worst in both situations. If you carried out a poll on here I suspect you would find that most cyclists had had problems with lorries at junctions even when the cyclist was correctly positioned.

 

[theclaud]

I'm not saying that doesn't happen, but I am saying the number of cyclists and car drivers that creep up the blind side of trucks at junctions and roundabouts is very high. Almost a daily occurrence. In my experience.

Funny that truck drivers don't learn to anticipate this, then. You might have a little think about the term "blind side" and ask yourself if a large vehicle whose driver describes it as having a "blind side" should be on the road at all.

 

[summerdays]

I'm not saying that doesn't happen, but I am saying the number of cyclists and car drivers that creep up the blind side of trucks at junctions and roundabouts is very high. Almost a daily occurrence. In my experience.

I agree that they do go up the side of lorries, I would have done so myself perhaps if I hadn't read on a forum warning me of the dangers just when I stared cycling 7 years ago or so. But I've had a number of occasions when lorry drivers have put me in positions of danger, and I've seen them on the phone fairly frequently. They aren't going to spot someone doing anything stupid or even just spot a cyclist if they are looking down at their mobile. They are supposed to be professionals so their behaviour and skill level should be above the average driver. And therefore the penalty for breaking the law should be higher.

 

[theclaud]

[QUOTE 3100049, member: 30090"]They do or I did. And blindside is a term not used with respect to what you are referring to.[/QUOTE]
Trevor just used it...

 

[theclaud]

[QUOTE 3100076, member: 30090"]Clever Trevor.

There is the near side and offside, and when reversing, open and blindside.

Stands to reason that if the driver does not check thier mirrors then potentially both the n/s and o/s can become 'blindsides'

Some interesting points been raised. Never thought about the false economy regarding drivers mates Claudine so thanks for that.

I still say that there no blind spots around the n/s drive axle of the tractor unit and front wheel if your mirrors are set up correctly. I still say this is down more to driver error. Why the majority have not been proscuted I don't know, and it is a tradegy when this happens, as it would appear that no one is fault which I find hard to accept when someone has died.[/QUOTE]

It's a big "if", and it doesn't address the problem of inadequate design. There was a Brake Bros lorry pulled up in Mumbles the other day (I know, I was shocked too...) with one of those "if you can't see my mirrors I can't see you" stickers. It was this sort:

I was held up by sh1te Mumbles driving anyway, so I decided to stand in a few different places around it, and couldn't see the mirrors from most of them, which effectively turns the sign into "don't come anywhere near me". Of course, I frequently choose to pass quite near such vehicles (on the offside), because there is almost always something loading in that spot, and often a constant stream of oncoming traffic. Part of the point of being on a bike is that you can make progress when cars can't, and that involves passing all kinds of vehicle.

 

[MontyVeda]

Streets are social spaces. For many children in urban and suburban areas, the street is the centre of their social lives. Why should they be constantly pushed to the sidelines?

I grew up on a relatively quiet street... at the end of that was a busy main road, on the other side of which was my junior school... i played constantly in/on the street on which I grew up... but put myself on the sidelines of the busy main road. In the absence of whatever Utopia you or I envisage, keeping to the sidelines of a busy road is the wise thing to do. Like i say, It's shared responsibility... i look out for them and hopefully they'll look out for me too.

 

[glenn forger]

Link to the available statistics. I can provide a link to the highway code which quotes the current law. Unfortunately, we have no means of recording near misses except hearsay. If we did you'd see just how much bad/inconsiderate road use we are obliged to allow for, tolerate and anticipate all the time. Amongst the professional driving community it is a widely discussed topic. It really is a travesty that no other road users are subject to the rigorous scrutiny and training that LGV and PCV drivers are forced to undergo (A good thing). If they were, the number of incidents would fall significantly.

The lorry driver who killed cyclist Catriona Patel was drunk and chatting on a mobile.

The lorry driver who killed Eilidh Cairns had faulty eyesight (the police didn't even bother to discover this until the same driver killed another woman.)

The lorry driver who killed cyclist Brian Dorling turned across his path.

The lorry driver who killed cyclist Svetlana Tereschenko was in an unsafe lorry, failing to indicate and chatting on a mobile. The police decided to charge him with..nothing.

The lorry driver who killed cyclist Deep Lee failed to notice her and smashed into her from behind.

The lorry driver that killed cyclist Andrew McNicoll failed to notice him and side swiped him.

The lorry driver that killed cyclist Daniel Cox was in a truck which did not have the correct mirrors and whose driver had pulled into the ASL on a red light and was indicating in the opposite direction to which he turned.

Keep your ill-informed garbage to yourself.

The RHA routinely block safety ,measures and spout the same victim-blaming nonsense that you are spouting. Tell me this, if the road haulage industry strictly vets drivers how come a bloke who'd been banned from driving over twenty times get a job driving lorries in the capital? Dennis Putz is a good example of the casual disregard for safety among road haulage operators.

 

[333]

You know that 30 is the maximum, right? And that it's your responsibility to anticipate that pedestrians looking to cross the road might. er... cross the road?

Sorry chap, that was a stupid typo, it was meant to say 25-30 not 30-35, infact I was only going 25mph when he decided to walk out infront of me and 28mph before I started braking (this is what is logged in Strava). To be honest I actually thought he was going to get run over by the car that overtook me with the way he was walking purposefully but instead he chose to wait for that and walk right infront of me!

 

[Trevor_P]

[QUOTE 3100502, member: 30090"]The design issues can be addresses but this would still require drivers to look, if they don't look then it makes sweet FA difference.

I'm surprised that you could not see yourself in the above mirrors, the below is about the right set up that I'd have:

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The first picture is about right regarding the positioning of the main mirror taking in about a third of the trailer. The wide angle mirror I'd have pointing down a bit more. Remember as well that newer tractor units you'd have a class IV mirror which would be attached just above to the top left corner of the windshield which would then look down at the n/s front axle/corner.

The second picture the kerbside mirror in this instance is positioned wrong. The mirror reflects way to much of the cab and in the instance of the main mirror should have roughly 1/3 of the unit and the rest should be the highway. With this set up there simply is no blind spots around the cab, when stationary in a straight line.

As I've said before I think that the majority of incidents are down to driver error in not checking the mirrors before pulling away. And I think the whole blind spot thing is a bit of a smokescreen where the TfL, CTC, RHA and any other organisations can have their say without directly pointing the finger politically. And whilst this is happening people are getting killed because like you say no-one really wants to take responsibility (haulage companies) and those in power are spineless buffoons who imo need to stand up, put the cat amongst the pigeons and create some destructive conflict. Which I hope will force haulage companies to take some responsibility and for the law to be changed. Sticking some stickers on a trailer and a poncey ''this vehicle is turning left'' is crap tbh.[/QUOTE]

I'd have the wide angle mirror a tad higher, so you can see just above the horizon in the top inch. It helps with lane changing on motorways. The main mirror slightly lower, I never understand why people want to look at so much sky. First thing after the sun comes up it can be blinding. If the adjustment works, you can always move it up 'on the fly' for scaffolding / overhanging buildings etc. The top or step mirror is always a pig to get far enough out for a reasonable ground view particularly on Mercs. The class IV mirror is a godsend for the n/s front corner. Always dirty though. Forever cleaning that one. We are lucky enough to have a couple of DAF XF's with n/s cab camera's but it takes some getting used to changing focus from mirror to screen. Do you have a mirror check routine at junctions? Do you mentally go through the hazards in advance? I was lucky in 84' to have a brilliant instructor. I've been out with some drivers who scare the living daylights out of me.

 

[Trevor_P]

Similar for me. The wide angle is useful on the M25 j13-12 when its busy. 5 lanes and moving from 2 to 3 you get cars going from 4/5 to 3 at the same time. Other similar junctions too. The extra wide just gives me the edge.

Motorway I'm thinking about the layout of the next junction, plenty of spacing, don't overtake. How the muppets exit/enter how heavy is the traffic and getting over to lane 1 at the earliest opportunity. In town thinking about whats behind me how close it is, looking for pedestrians motorcycles and cycles. If I've been there before (Usually have, what happened then, how the locals mis-use the junction etc.

I double up on the mirrors at junctions and like you scan them whilst waiting. Doubling up allows your brain time to note any changes which draws your attention to small differences quickly (like cyclists sneaking up on you. From 1984 that one.).

Your DAF an auto? Lovely box (not). Makes pulling away an art in itself.

 

[Mugshot]

[QUOTE 3100502, member: 30090"]

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[/QUOTE]
Good pics, looks like they were taken while the truck was barrelling along the road

 

[marknotgeorge]

How do they cross the road in a busy town/city where there can be almost constant traffic, especially near their school at the time they are travelling to school?

If the traffic is that heavy, there should be a crossing there.

 

[summerdays]

If the traffic is that heavy, there should be a crossing there.

I can think of plenty of schools without a crossing that would be difficult to cross due to there not being any traffic coming (since they can't judge car speed accurately), for a start something like 40% of pupils travel by car to the school. And even those with crossings don't have enough of them, expecting pupils and parents to take detours to use.

 

[MontyVeda]

[QUOTE 3103664, member: 45"]And how old are you?[/QUOTE]
That's irrelevant to the point of my post.

Or is it one of those loaded question thingies?

 

[theclaud]

That's irrelevant to the point of my post.

Or is it one of those loaded question thingies?

Not really. You confessed to being a devotee of Tufty. There have been concerted efforts at particular historical moments to get people out of the way to make way for the motor car.