Specialized x 2 Anyone Got Feedback On Them?

[MacB]

First up the Sirrus - I know plenty will be familiar with this but I see that the top end is no longer just a road frame with flat bars but now has its own carbon frame with a more realistic ETT for flat bar use:-

http://www.specialized.com/us/en/bikes/multi-use/sirrus/sirrus-pro-carbon-disc

Only bit I'm not sure on is the 1x11 gearing - range seems fine 40t up front and 10-42 at the back. Just seems like you could do nearly the same with a 1x9 11-36 setup and not have a ridiculous price for chains and cassettes.

Second up, and perhaps more interesting, is the Diverge series a proper multi surface road/endurance bike with decent tire clearances, up to 700x32 with guards and 700x35 without:-

http://www.specialized.com/us/en/bikes/road/diverge/diverge-expert-carbon#specs

So what do we know about these and what's similar from other manufacturers?

 

[SWSteve]

Well the Diverge has replaced the Secteur (which was an allow Roubaix) with it's own specific role, allow frame at lower end, carbon frame at higher. It's meant to be a relaxed geometry, 'sportive' style bike. I'm sure you'll also read how it 'feels responsive' and 'accelerates nicely', you can pick all the stock phrases you want tbh.
If you want a flat bared roadie then look at Scott Solace (if budget allows) or Speedster, as both of these offer FB (flat bar) options. Someone will be along with some more in a mo.

What do you want it for? What will it be doing?

 

[MacB]

I would be for fast(by my standards) unladen riding, but social not competitive

 

[Mo1959]

Well the Diverge has replaced the Secteur (which was an allow Roubaix) with it's own specific role, allow frame at lower end, carbon frame at higher. It's meant to be a relaxed geometry, 'sportive' style bike. I'm sure you'll also read how it 'feels responsive' and 'accelerates nicely', you can pick all the stock phrases you want tbh.
If you want a flat bared roadie then look at Scott Solace (if budget allows) or Speedster, as both of these offer FB (flat bar) options. Someone will be along with some more in a mo.

What do you want it for? What will it be doing?

The Solace looks a lovely bike. I think if I ever decided I only wanted a flat bar bike this would be it.
http://www.drakescycles.co.uk/m1b0s18p5037/SCOTT_Solace_40_FB_Disc_2015

 

[vickster]

Planet X do a good looking carbon flat bar

http://www.planetx.co.uk/i/q/CBPXXLSFB/planet-x-xls-shimano-tiagra-flat-bar-road-bike

 

[MacB]

The Solace geometry indicates it's just a road frame with flat bars put on, as the high end Sirrus models were before the 2015 editions. I've tried flat bars on a frame designed for me for drop bars and it just didn't feel right. I was out to a 130mm stem and it was still a bit cramped, but then the bike with drops had taken a 120mm stem before.

That was with a 570mm ETT, I reckon my ideal for flat bars is about a 615-620mm ETT.

 

[MacB]

Planet X do a good looking carbon flat bar

http://www.planetx.co.uk/i/q/CBPXXLSFB/planet-x-xls-shimano-tiagra-flat-bar-road-bike

shame, again it's a drop bar frame with flats put on, longest ETT is 568mm

 

[vickster]

I don't know what ETT is

Whyte Montpellier? http://whyte.bike/gb/models/commuterroad/r7-fast-urban-series/montpellier/

 

[MacB]

I don't know what ETT is

Whyte Montpellier? http://whyte.bike/gb/models/commuterroad/r7-fast-urban-series/montpellier/

effective top tube, what the top tube would measure horizontally taking account of the sloping top tube. So if 568mm is the longest and I already use 616mm with a 100mm stem then I would need a stem of 148mm to match the reach.

 

[vickster]

How tall are you? From the Whyte link

Medium Large Extra Large
5’9″ – 6’0″ 6’0″ – 6’3″ 6’3″ – 6’6″
175 – 183 cm 183 – 191 cm 191 – 198 cm

The Whyte link also has all the geometries but won't paste

 

[Crackle]

effective top tube, what the top tube would measure horizontally taking account of the sloping top tube. So if 568mm is the longest and I already use 616mm with a 100mm stem then I would need a stem of 148mm to match the reach.

The feel of that is influenced by the seat angle though.

 

[MacB]

The feel of that is influenced by the seat angle though.

only to a point as I will want to retain the saddle relationship to BB/pedals. If you imagine a vertical line from the centre of the BB rising up through the TT. The steeper the seat tube the more ETT will be forward of the BB and vice versa.

So two bikes with ETT of 600mm but STAs of 72 and 73 degrees respectively will mean a longer reach for the 73 deg ST bike, if you put the saddle in the same position relative to the BB.

 

[MacB]

How tall are you? From the Whyte link

Medium Large Extra Large
5’9″ – 6’0″ 6’0″ – 6’3″ 6’3″ – 6’6″
175 – 183 cm 183 – 191 cm 191 – 198 cm

The Whyte link also has all the geometries but won't paste

It's something that I can't explain beyond some manufacturers have obviously decided that a flat bar road bike is just the same frame with flats rather than drops. Yet all dedicated flat bar bikes, even from the same manufacturers, will have a much longer ETT for the given size categories. For example if I spec up a 29er and a road bike using any manufacturers site I would expect there to be about a 50-60mm difference in ETTs.

To me that's just laziness as it's not hard to figure out. If you ride on drops and mainly on the hoods then measure how far ahead of the stem those hand positions are. If you then just put flat bars on the hand position will be 60-100mm further back. It's offset slightly by the wider triangle but nowhere near enough.

Specialized with the Sirrus model are a good example, in previous years their high end models just shared road frames so shorter top tubes. Then for 2015 it's the first year that they've brought out a carbon frame specifically for the Sirrus. What's the biggest change? yep, a far longer top tube.

 

[vickster]

You've completely lost me, sorry

 

[SWSteve]

You've completely lost me, sorry

I think what he is saying is that hybrids are too short compared to roadies, as road bikes have: longer stem, hoods even more out front due to drop bars. So when a hybrid has a short stem and no outward bars it's too small for him.