Steel frame bikes

[mustang1]

I'm aiming these questions at steel-lovers, and while I am not one, I'm certainly an at-a-distance steel admirer, more for their looks and paint than anything else. So I dont mean to ask these questions as derogatory...

1. Steel frames weigh more than other materials. While I appreciate it's not all about the weight, where do you draw the line? For example a CF of Al frame maybe weight 1.0kg and a steel frame 1.4kg. Not such a big deal right? But what if it weighed 1.7kg or 5kg? Where do you draw the line for it being too heavy?

2. I've never ridden steel (at least not for such a long time that I've forgotten what it's like) and they tell me 'you just have to try it to admire it'). Ok one day I will, but I dont want to go to the shop to try out a bike i have no intention of buying. So I'll stick with reading reviews for now and some state CF rides both smoother and stiffer than steel. Your comments?

3. If steel is so great, why do many steel-framed bikes come with CF forks instead of steel?

4. If I were looking for a road-bike steel frame for a) £500 or b) £1000, give me two brands you recommend. I may be looking for an Italian or British frame (Passoni and Roberts are too expensive for me, but the Roberts may be do-able though i still prefer far cheaper).

5. If two frame builders use Reynolds 853 (for example, but pick any tube), what would the difference be assuming both builders are highly experienced and have pretty decent quality joinery/lugs/brazing etc?

 

[junglegusset]

Okay, I'll try and answer number 3. Carbon is the preferred material or forks because it absorbs some of the higher frequency vibrations from the road that go through your steering and into your hands.

 

[avalon]

There are lots of good frame builders around and a few that aren't so good. It's probably best to ask around for recommendation and then speak to the builder about your requirements. Roberts frames have been around for a long time and have a good reputation. I've have a Mercian frame since 1980 and its still going strong. I've also had work done by Argos Cycles in Bristol who also build some excellent frames. It was Argos who built Ian Hibel's bike that took him to some very remote places around the world.

 

[vickster]

I am in the process of acquiring the bits to build a Genesis Equilibrium 20 (orange 2013 model). The frame and (carbon) fork cost £400, expect build with SRAM rival to come in at around £1300, same as the off the peg version but I didn't want Shimano gearing

725 Reynolds steel, was very comfy on test ride over the mean streets of Wimbledon and I didn't try to avoid any of the rough stuff as I do on alu. I am looking for comfort for dodgy limbs, hence steel

I also have a CF bike which is pretty light but not exactly practical for commuting and touring, hence the steel (to replace alu/carbon)

As you're in London, go have a lust at some of Condor's offerings, Pearsons do steel frames too

 

[BSRU]

Both my steel bikes have steel forks.
I only notice the extra weight when I pick the bikes up but then both my steel bikes have mudguards and a pannier rack.

 

[HLaB]

My seel bike has steel forks too but its a cheap Viking fixie so it wouldn't be air compare.

 

[snailracer]

...
3. If steel is so great, why do many steel-framed bikes come with CF forks instead of steel?
...

A lot of those CF forks aren't even light, so I reckon marketing plays a part in the choice. But the main reason is manufacturing economics.

CF is a material suited for low-volume manufacturing. Steel is suited for high-volume, due to the cost of tooling. It's possible to make an absurdly light steel frame or fork, if a manufacturer could afford to buy the specialized tooling to bend/swage/cut/form/weld/process the "difficult" high-strength steels.

If a bike manufacturer was confident it could sell 10 million high-end, ultra-lightweight road bikes, the most cost-effective material would almost certainly be some type of steel, because, once the tooling is made, you can make a run of them with the same tooling. In contrast, each CF frame is laboriously made by hand, fabricating each of the other 9,999,999 requires as much work (and cost) as the first one. It's just too bad that there isn't enough demand for high-end road bikes to make the case for ultra-lightweight steel in terms of manufacturing economics.

As a material, CF is truly superior to steel in only one aspect: tensile strength. But compressive strength is markedly inferior. As a bike frame handles both tensile and compressive forces in equal measure, it can be seen that a steel frame, in theory, can be stronger than a CF one - it's just that the manufacturing economics precludes it.

 

[fossyant]

Overall the weight of the frame really doesn't matter that much, within reason. Most steel frames and forks will probably weigh in between 2.5 and 3kg, where as a super light carbon frame and fork will be nearer 1.5 kg, so you are looking at a 1-1.5kg weight penalty.

Thing is, many carbon and alloy frames are now churned out by factories in the middle east. It's mass produced and cheap.

Steel does ride differently. A high end steel frame won't be flexy, but does offer fantastic 'zuzzing' of poor road surfaces - it's quite 'marked' the difference in ride quality.

both my steel road bikes (about 20 years old) come in at 9kg's and I don't have any weight weenie parts on them. One is full Dura Ace the other Ultegra !

 

[threebikesmcginty]

...and I don't have any weight weenie parts on them. One is full Dura Ace...

Nobody likes a show off!

 

[vickster]

I am not exactly light so an extra kilo or two not an issue. I actually find my carbon bike harder to propel at speed as it's light!! I am sure it does move quicker but it doesn't feel easier!

 

[fossyant]

Nobody likes a show off!

Oh and it was custom built for me and had a custom paint finish by C&G of Liverpool, and made out of the finest Columbus SLX !

 

[threebikesmcginty]

bah!

 

[Hacienda71]

My steel frame bike has steel forks. Mainly because they didn't build carbon forks in 1980.

It is very comfy, certainly on a par with my carbon bike. It is about 2.5 kg heavier. I reckon I could lose between half to a kilo from it fairly easily.

 

[mustang1]

Okay, I'll try and answer number 3. Carbon is the preferred material or frames because it absorbs some of the higher frequency vibrations from the road that go through to your body.

Fify

 

[mustang1]

I am in the process of acquiring the bits to build a Genesis Equilibrium 20 (orange 2013 model). The frame and (carbon) fork cost £400, expect build with SRAM rival to come in at around £1300, same as the off the peg version but I didn't want Shimano gearing

725 Reynolds steel, was very comfy on test ride over the mean streets of Wimbledon and I didn't try to avoid any of the rough stuff as I do on alu. I am looking for comfort for dodgy limbs, hence steel

I also have a CF bike which is pretty light but not exactly practical for commuting and touring, hence the steel (to replace alu/carbon)

As you're in London, go have a lust at some of Condor's offerings, Pearsons do steel frames too

Thanks for the Condor recomendation I checked out their Acciaio. IDK, there's something about Condor...