Randyberlin
Guru
- Location
- Sitka, Alaska
See you very briefly on the starting line.
Edit: this stage looks like its your kind of ride.
Last edited:
Team BKool CycleChat
- Thread starter Peteaud
- Start date
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Edit: this stage looks like its your kind of ride.
Guys,
I hope no-one does think I was cheating mid-week? I feel if someone just read this forum in isolation that's the impression they would get. As someone who's constantly checking my own data for inconsistencies, publicly denouncing my own kit's accuracy and switching to pedal power meters (which make for a totally sh!t experience but I'm tolerating it in the interests of fair play) the messages were I'm sure just people doing the right thing and also some banter and I'm probably being oversensitive but I have to say I did feel a bit judged.
Just for the record here's some of my experience. RGT failed to connect that night so I missed the ride I was intending to do and instead switched to Bkool just to do any ride, I hit the 1st one in the simulator (the CADEX one) and noticed it was in an illogical state with ERG mode on but not functioning, I know Bkool had been meddling in that area as they'd recently added gear buttons for the Watt-bike. Curious as to why I was moving at all with ERG set to zero made me press it and play with it for a bit. Anyhow because of this oddness I binned the ride to check my pedals were the power source and not the Wattbike.
They were, so I jumped back into the same ride to see Goldwolfie again and just go for a spin, later in the ride I remembered the ERG mode and wondered if it could help with my data on the Wattbike vs Garmin Vector comparison. It's a neat idea (at least I thought so) to get the trainer to have me ride to a wattage but see onscreen the wattage returned by the pedals. Not only do I get the direct comparison on screen but I can visibly see (and feel) the lag between asking for more power, the wattbike registering it and backing resistance off but the pedal power barely registering on-screen (due to the ridiculous Vector lag). I was surprised that the trainer was determining it had hit the wattage and not Bkool using the wattage coming back from the pedals so I kept messing about with it. I admit I did crank it up to overtake someone on the hill but that's just a natural reaction to seeing someone slow just ahead ... right?
In all I treated it like any general ride, I didn't give a thought to the CADEX series, usually in a race Bkool holds you at the start till you stop pedaling and certainly doesn't allow ERG mode to be used, this ride had neither behaviour.
As evidenced I was hardly pushing, my average was 141bpm, however I take the point that there may be people I was ahead of in this series who were racing so out of respect to those riders I re-ran the race on Thursday as a chunky warm-up for the Thursday evening race at 156bpm and took over two minutes off.
After seeing these posts within an hour I did contact Bkool asking why ERG wasn't switched off for the CADEX series and why it's not banned in their rules. Just for info though, I certainly wont be using it in anything other than workouts again. https://mobile.bkool.com/en/event/RACE/cadex I wanted to await their response before responding on here but it seems if they dont come back within a couple of days it's not a good sign, if/when they do though I'll be sure to share it.
Keep pedaling...see some of you at 5pm.
I hope no-one does think I was cheating mid-week? I feel if someone just read this forum in isolation that's the impression they would get. As someone who's constantly checking my own data for inconsistencies, publicly denouncing my own kit's accuracy and switching to pedal power meters (which make for a totally sh!t experience but I'm tolerating it in the interests of fair play) the messages were I'm sure just people doing the right thing and also some banter and I'm probably being oversensitive but I have to say I did feel a bit judged.
Just for the record here's some of my experience. RGT failed to connect that night so I missed the ride I was intending to do and instead switched to Bkool just to do any ride, I hit the 1st one in the simulator (the CADEX one) and noticed it was in an illogical state with ERG mode on but not functioning, I know Bkool had been meddling in that area as they'd recently added gear buttons for the Watt-bike. Curious as to why I was moving at all with ERG set to zero made me press it and play with it for a bit. Anyhow because of this oddness I binned the ride to check my pedals were the power source and not the Wattbike.
They were, so I jumped back into the same ride to see Goldwolfie again and just go for a spin, later in the ride I remembered the ERG mode and wondered if it could help with my data on the Wattbike vs Garmin Vector comparison. It's a neat idea (at least I thought so) to get the trainer to have me ride to a wattage but see onscreen the wattage returned by the pedals. Not only do I get the direct comparison on screen but I can visibly see (and feel) the lag between asking for more power, the wattbike registering it and backing resistance off but the pedal power barely registering on-screen (due to the ridiculous Vector lag). I was surprised that the trainer was determining it had hit the wattage and not Bkool using the wattage coming back from the pedals so I kept messing about with it. I admit I did crank it up to overtake someone on the hill but that's just a natural reaction to seeing someone slow just ahead ... right?
In all I treated it like any general ride, I didn't give a thought to the CADEX series, usually in a race Bkool holds you at the start till you stop pedaling and certainly doesn't allow ERG mode to be used, this ride had neither behaviour.
As evidenced I was hardly pushing, my average was 141bpm, however I take the point that there may be people I was ahead of in this series who were racing so out of respect to those riders I re-ran the race on Thursday as a chunky warm-up for the Thursday evening race at 156bpm and took over two minutes off.
After seeing these posts within an hour I did contact Bkool asking why ERG wasn't switched off for the CADEX series and why it's not banned in their rules. Just for info though, I certainly wont be using it in anything other than workouts again. https://mobile.bkool.com/en/event/RACE/cadex I wanted to await their response before responding on here but it seems if they dont come back within a couple of days it's not a good sign, if/when they do though I'll be sure to share it.
Keep pedaling...see some of you at 5pm.
Well I enjoyed that. I found myself lone for about 3 miles.. alone on a five mile course with 80+ riders..
. Anyhoo.. a group caught me up and I jumped on their wheels.. Averaging in the low 20’smph, I hung on, nearly got dropped a couple of times and managed to come 3rd in the sprint.I’m pooped noo...
Good fun..
shimceltic
Veteran
I was 3rd overall. Stayed in front group. Its hard when u lose a group and you may as well ease right off for the next group
I didn’t read past the first line as I don’t have an attention span..
I don’t think you cheated and to be honest I don’t really care. I can however understand that playful or otherwise accusations could wound and offend. If I was to be drawn into the discussion of what I thought of cheating, I’d probably say it’s almost as bad as throwing stones in greenhouses - never been a fan of that...
Keep cycling Sir..
St Jim
I wouldn't worry about it Andy, from what I saw from the video you were in ERG mode to begin with but when you restarted you wern't so you didn't do the ride in ERG mode. If bkool wanted it as a pure race they would block that feature, I think it is just a series to get as many people riding as they can with the incentive of some good prizes for taking part.
shimceltic
Veteran
Sounds like no matter how much you spend on equipment, you can't trust the results.
I looked at the kickr bike ( can't afford it) and dc rain maker comparisons. Looked OK but when he gave it a bit of power it didn't look very sturdy compared to a few others.
Brusgaard
Über Guru
- Location
- Skive, Denmark
Like I said, using ERG in a race would be considered cheating, and it was served as a Warming.
It is rule no. 1 in the Danish league, but those rules probably originates from back when it was actually possible to use ERG in races. I didn’t know it wasn’t possible (anymore) as I had never used it.
As I tried it Thursday, it was the ERG controlling the resistance of the trainer and not the % shown. I only tried it for like 1 minute, but I imagine it would be most helpful going up a steep mountain as it would effectively flatten the climb.
That is why I wrote if you know how and where to use it, it would allow you to get a good time, and in particular on that stage in the video, as it has decent amount of climbing at the end.
I know I have the equipment that shows pretty accurate watts, and it has cost me a pretty penny, as I’m sure your Vectors and the Wattbike has too. I started with the BKOOL Pro, then bought the Elite Direto as it was deemed accurate in the DCR/GPLama tests. But I soon realised the anything based on a belt can’t be accurate over time. So when it started acting up and the belt snapped, I bought the NEO2 instead. Later I bought the Assiomas DUOs to see how the two compares. They are very alike, taking into account the drivetrain loss.
So my only wish is that people ride fair and don’t use the known tricks to get an unfair advantage.
Randyberlin
Guru
- Location
- Sitka, Alaska
No way. If that starts throwing stones I’m saying the EPO I got was purely for medical purpose.
We know you weren’t trying to cheat.
shimceltic
Veteran
Like 50mm tyres pumped to 140psi?Like I said, using ERG in a race would be considered cheating, and it was served as a Warming.
It is rule no. 1 in the Danish league, but those rules probably originates from back when it was actually possible to use ERG in races. I didn’t know it wasn’t possible (anymore) as I had never used it.
As I tried it Thursday, it was the ERG controlling the resistance of the trainer and not the % shown. I only tried it for like 1 minute, but I imagine it would be most helpful going up a steep mountain as it would effectively flatten the climb.
That is why I wrote if you know how and where to use it, it would allow you to get a good time, and in particular on that stage in the video, as it has decent amount of climbing at the end.
I know I have the equipment that shows pretty accurate watts, and it has cost me a pretty penny, as I’m sure your Vectors and the Wattbike has too. I started with the BKOOL Pro, then bought the Elite Direto as it was deemed accurate in the DCR/GPLama tests. But I soon realised the anything based on a belt can’t be accurate over time. So when it started acting up and the belt snapped, I bought the NEO2 instead. Later I bought the Assiomas DUOs to see how the two compares. They are very alike, taking into account the drivetrain loss.
So my only wish is that people ride fair and don’t use the known tricks to get an unfair advantage.
Brusgaard
Über Guru
- Location
- Skive, Denmark
That is one of the reasons, wheel-on trainers are not allowed in the official Danish league ranking. You are allowed to use a wheel-on, only if you have a different powersource, like a crank or pedalbased powermeter.
Is there a way of finding out where one finished overall Jimmy?
shimceltic
Veteran
What's the cheapest way to get pedalbesed?
shimceltic
Veteran
Go on the app and my events, should have results. I'm never in the front group and this was an easier pace to sit with.
