The bicycle zenith

[Alex321]

Then tell us what has gotten better.

Almost everything, apart from aesthetics, which of course is always in the eye of the beholder.

Changing gears without having to move your hands from the bars, with much better defined changes. Though I thought that by the late 80's indexed gears were actually the norm, you just didn't have as many of them as modern mid range systems.

Brakes which work FAR better (even modern rim brakes are a lot better than those from that period, and disc brakes are on another level).

 

[matticus]

There was a similar thread a few years ago

I doubt you need to go that far back.

Somewhere on the internet, every day, someone starts a discussion like this.

 

[Sharky]

I think the zenith was in the late 60's, when my avatar photo was taken, since then bikes have got slower and slower.

 

[Dogtrousers]

I doubt you need to go that far back.

Somewhere on the internet, every day, someone starts a discussion like this.

Once our beer was froffy,
now it's froffy coffee

Fings ain't wot they used ta be

 

[Fredo76]

My cables don't flap; they soar on the thermals. And I like the no-cables look, too, on a track bike! But to me they're not worth the trouble of hiding, for all the complications that causes during service. And wrapping bar tape over cables is a kludge and always has been. I've done it myself when components require, but it's still a kludge.

My notion of 'form follows function' implies that one can see how it works, and a '70s racing bicycle embodies that principle more than any contraption since the canoe. When Cinelli hid their bolt and instead showed that black dot logo, 'twas the beginning of the end.

[No bicycles were crushed in the formation of these opinions.]

 

[matticus]

My cables don't flap; they soar on the thermals.

Love it!

When Cinelli hid their bolt and instead showed that black dot logo, 'twas the beginning of the end.

Forgive me: which bolt is this? Quill stem?

 

[Fredo76]

Love it!



Forgive me: which bolt is this? Quill stem?

Thanks!

Yes, the handlebar bolt on their quill stem, when it went vertical, from underneath. A black, recessed circle with a logo was added to the front, but from a distance, it just looked like a dot.

 

[DogmaStu]

My cables don't flap; they soar on the thermals. And I like the no-cables look, too, on a track bike! But to me they're not worth the trouble of hiding, for all the complications that causes during service. And wrapping bar tape over cables is a kludge and always has been. I've done it myself when components require, but it's still a kludge.

My notion of 'form follows function' implies that one can see how it works, and a '70s racing bicycle embodies that principle more than any contraption since the canoe. When Cinelli hid their bolt and instead showed that black dot logo, 'twas the beginning of the end.

[No bicycles were crushed in the formation of these opinions.]

The issues you refer to occurred with previous generation bikes that are themselves outdated now.

Cables aren't wrapped in bar tape nowadays, they are inside the bars themselves emerging neatly behind the brake lever housing. Easily threaded in - a few seconds. SRAM Red / AXS is wireless to the derailleurs. No cables to run through the frame. Shimano Di2? Never needed to touch a cable in over 40 000km.

 

[Drago]

Ahead sets are a retrograde step! What could be simpler than a stem which can be raised or lowered. They sometimes seize but due to lack of grease on assembly. Ahead sets have to have a stack of spacers. If you somehow lose one you are stuck! If you lower your stem you have a lovely hard object projecting for you to hit if you go over the handlebars. Water entering the stem by the handlebars is channeled directly towards the bearings causing them to rust. Brilliant idea!
Indexing of gears isn't without it's faults! They need adjustment from time to time. The old clatter, clatter, silent variable down tube gear shifter didn't require constant adjustment. There can be confusion with indexed gear changers from one side up and down the gears is opposite to the other. This can sometimes bring you to a grinding halt on a steep hill where you have accidentally selected the high range gears.
Non standardisation has crept in . Manufacturers like to bring in their own systems which aren't interchangeable with others. I often swap bits from one bike to another on my old bikes . It makes sourcing spare parts so much easier.

Although headsets permit larger diameter steerers and frame tubes, and thus an accordingly stiffer assembly.

 

[Fredo76]

The issues you refer to occurred with previous generation bikes that are themselves outdated now.

Cables aren't wrapped in bar tape nowadays, they are inside the bars themselves emerging neatly behind the brake lever housing. Easily threaded in - a few seconds. SRAM Red / AXS is wireless to the derailleurs. No cables to run through the frame. Shimano Di2? Never needed to touch a cable in over 40 000km.

From a simplicity perspective, everything electrical is post-zenith.

 

[DogmaStu]

Ahead sets are a retrograde step! What could be simpler than a stem which can be raised or lowered. They sometimes seize but due to lack of grease on assembly. Ahead sets have to have a stack of spacers. If you somehow lose one you are stuck! If you lower your stem you have a lovely hard object projecting for you to hit if you go over the handlebars. Water entering the stem by the handlebars is channeled directly towards the bearings causing them to rust. Brilliant idea!
Indexing of gears isn't without it's faults! They need adjustment from time to time. The old clatter, clatter, silent variable down tube gear shifter didn't require constant adjustment. There can be confusion with indexed gear changers from one side up and down the gears is opposite to the other. This can sometimes bring you to a grinding halt on a steep hill where you have accidentally selected the high range gears.
Non standardisation has crept in . Manufacturers like to bring in their own systems which aren't interchangeable with others. I often swap bits from one bike to another on my old bikes . It makes sourcing spare parts so much easier.

We can imagine problems with anything if we think hard enough. Who loses headset spacers? You may as well say people can lose stem bolts.

Lower the stem and you will have a protruding steerer tube - cut it to the size you need it to be. Who leaves them long if they need them lower? If for some reason one wants to, it's a choice.

Down tube shifters need servicing too. Cables stretch. Now they don't if you go wireless. Even with cables, nowadays the electronic versions don't need as much attention due to zero tension stress; they simply supply a signal. Indexing is easy and can be micro-managed by pressing a button. Adjusting the derailleurs themselves on initial set up is the same as it has been for decades.

You'd have to be pretty inept to make the accidental errors you allude to when using gears - its inventing excuses.

As for non-standardisation, it's a minority issue. Unless you are running Campagnolo, Sram and Shimano parts are often interchangeable.

 

[DogmaStu]

From a simplicity perspective, everything electrical is post-zenith.

That's the view of those who have zero actual experience with electrical systems and imagine them to be more complicated. The opposite is true.

I have 5 bikes, 2 are mechanical, 3 electronic. The electronic systems require less servicing. No more complicated to set up. Zero cables in Sram's case. Di2 cables only send a signal, zero tension, zero stretching, no maintenance.

Just to add: I've been taking bikes apart and re-building them since I was 14 yrs old. That's over 30 years of experience with bikes from the early 1980's to today so I understand the differences between what I'm riding today compared to the bikes I owned yesteryear.

 

[biggs682]

permit larger diameter stiffer assembly.

With a bit of poetic licence 🤣

 

[Drago]

I have 5 bikes, 2 are mechanical, 3 electronic. The electronic systems require less servicing. No more complicated to set up. Zero cables in Sram's case. Di2 cables only send a signal, zero tension, zero stretching, no maintenance.

And in years to come when the firmware is unsupported and your shiny new computer doesn't run a suitably retrograde version of windows?

Don't scoff, it's already happened to very early systems.

In 5 decades time you'll still be able to tweak and adjust a cable without any problem.

Not every step forward is progress.

 

[matticus]

The issues you refer to occurred with previous generation bikes that are themselves outdated now.

Cables aren't wrapped in bar tape nowadays, they are inside the bars themselves emerging neatly behind the brake lever housing. Easily threaded in - a few seconds. SRAM Red / AXS is wireless to the derailleurs. No cables to run through the frame. Shimano Di2? Never needed to touch a cable in over 40 000km.

Aaaaaand theeeeeeeey're OFF!!

View: https://www.youtube.com/watch?app=desktop&v=dCct4koXMrA