The Football.....

[bluenotebob]

makes it impossible for the big countries not to qualify.

Well, Sweden haven't qualified and Italy haven't guaranteed their place yet.

I guess it depends on what you mean by "big countries".

I've enjoyed watching Tuchel's England (apart from the friendly against Senegal). There's something about the current England team that I've never seen before - perhaps it's the lack of some big names or, to use Stevie Gerrard's phrase, "egotistical losers".

Shame there are only two more WC qualifiers to come before friendly matches/the actual tournament.

 

[Alex321]

Well, Sweden haven't qualified and Italy haven't guaranteed their place yet.

I guess it depends on what you mean by "big countries".

I don't think most people would class Sweden as a "Big Country", but Italy certainly are.

In Europe, I think only France, Germany, Spain, Italy, England, are really what would be classed by most as "big" countries.

Shame there are only two more WC qualifiers to come before friendly matches/the actual tournament.

Wales will almost certainly have playoffs as well, after losing to Belgium.

 

[spen666]

England are the first UEFA team qualified for World Cup.
They managed to narrowly escape their group of death. With teams like Andorra Latvia Serbia and Albania
Having 12 qualifying groups and 16 spaces almost makes it impossible for the big countries not to qualify.
The first World Cup I remember was Spain 82 which had 24 teams. They now have 48, so double the size! It’s too big.

 

[PaulSB]

I don't think most people would class Sweden as a "Big Country", but Italy certainly are.

In Europe, I think only France, Germany, Spain, Italy, England, are really what would be classed by most as "big" countries.

I think defining "big" is close to impossible but I see where @Beebo is coming from. I briefly scanned the groups and came up with 12 countries I would expect to or not be surprised to see in the finals; Germany, Switzerland, Sweden, Denmark, Greece, France, Spain, Portugal, Netherlands, Italy, Norway, England. I don't know if all these sides have or will qualify but it wouldn’t be surprising if they do. We can argue if some other countries fit this group, they probably do.

Then we have sides such as Scotland, Wales, Belgium, Poland, ROI, NI and others who given a decent draw and campaign have a good chance of qualification. These aren't surprising either.

Malta, Gibraltar, Faroe Islands? That would be novel.

I'm inclined to agree with Beebo all the major or "big" countries should qualify and if they don't need to ask questions of themselves. It's no different than any other modern football competition. All have been repeatedly expanded to be more "inclusive." What this really means is more games equals more TV equals more money. Where do we find the cannon fodder to feed this while ensuring the "big" sides qualify so we can generate even more TV money at the finals?

As a consequence the fans get a meaningless qualifying competition which is of very little interest. What do I know of this week's results? I know England have qualified. I guess they played two games this week? I don't know who against or the results. I know Tuchel had a rant about the lack of Wembley atmosphere. ***

I am a genuine football fan, 60+ years of watching, but the endless dilution of all competitions into a largely meaningless procession is a complete turn off. My interest in the WC will start in summer 2026 and probably increase if England progress to the quarter-finals. Till then FIFA have made it all irrelevant.

*** a manager's rant left a bigger impression on me than his team's result. That sums up the modern game quite neatly.

 

[AndyRM]

I can see a future where there's a kind of two tier (to use the parlance of our times) World Cup. Club football is pretty much there already, with the rejigged Champions League being the European Super League in all but name.

 

[Alex321]

I think defining "big" is close to impossible but I see where @Beebo is coming from. I briefly scanned the groups and came up with 12 countries I would expect to or not be surprised to see in the finals; Germany, Switzerland, Sweden, Denmark, Greece, France, Spain, Portugal, Netherlands, Italy, Norway, England. I don't know if all these sides have or will qualify but it wouldn’t be surprising if they do. We can argue if some other countries fit this group, they probably do.

The difference there to bme is between "expect" and "not be surprised". Big difference.

To me, a "big" country is one you would expect to be there. Those you wouldn't be surprised to see are the next step down, and I would largely agree with your list of those, but with the addition of at least Belgium and Croatia.

Then we have sides such as Scotland, Wales, Belgium, Poland, ROI, NI and others who given a decent draw and campaign have a good chance of qualification. These aren't surprising either.

I'd put Belgium close to the "expect" but not quite. The rest I agree.

Malta, Gibraltar, Faroe Islands? That would be novel.

Very

I'm inclined to agree with Beebo all the major or "big" countries should qualify and if they don't need to ask questions of themselves. It's no different than any other modern football competition. All have been repeatedly expanded to be more "inclusive." What this really means is more games equals more TV equals more money. Where do we find the cannon fodder to feed this while ensuring the "big" sides qualify so we can generate even more TV money at the finals?

As a consequence the fans get a meaningless qualifying competition which is of very little interest. What do I know of this week's results? I know England have qualified. I guess they played two games this week? I don't know who against or the results. I know Tuchel had a rant about the lack of Wembley atmosphere. ***

I am a genuine football fan, 60+ years of watching, but the endless dilution of all competitions into a largely meaningless procession is a complete turn off. My interest in the WC will start in summer 2026 and probably increase if England progress to the quarter-finals. Till then FIFA have made it all irrelevant.

*** a manager's rant left a bigger impression on me than his team's result. That sums up the modern game quite neatly.

All good points.

 

[No Ta Doctor]

Well I managed to get down a rabbit hole, but as we're talking about European countries, the definitive list of "BIG" countries should be:

Big Country:
Germany (14, 3)
Spain (12, 4)
Russia (12, 1)
Italy (11, 2)
France (11, 2)
Netherlands (11, 1)
Czech Republic (11, 1)
England (11, 0)


Bubbling under (Little Feat?):
Denmark (10,1)
Portugal (9,1)


Recency bias (reasonable number of appearances but weighted towards more recent editions):
Croatia (7,0)
Belgium (7,0)
Sweden (7,0)
Switzerland (6,0)
Turkey (6,0)


Plucky minnows:
Scotland (4, 0)
Wales (2, 0)
N. Ireland (1,0)
Ireland (3, 0)


Won but forgotten:
Greece (4,1)



My basis for this is appearances in Euros finals (rather than World Cup, mainly because that's just what I looked at first) and wins in the tournament.

Now it was a bit weird, because it was four teams only from its start in '60 until expanded to 8 in '84, 16 in '96 and 24 in 2016. But given the proliferation of actual countries since '95 that's also unsurprising. UEFA now has 55 member organisations (remember, no less than FOUR of these are from UK ). Croatia, for instance has missed only a single tournament since their first in '96, while three of the Czech Republic's appearances (and their win) cames as Czechoslovakia (though they still have five more appearances than their neighbours)

UEFA Members:

 

[Chislenko]

Well I managed to get down a rabbit hole, but as we're talking about European countries, the definitive list of "BIG" countries should be:

Big Country:
Germany (14, 3)
Spain (12, 4)
Russia (12, 1)
Italy (11, 2)
France (11, 2)
Netherlands (11, 1)
Czech Republic (11, 1)
England (11, 0)


Bubbling under (Little Feat?):
Denmark (10,1)
Portugal (9,1)


Recency bias (reasonable number of appearances but weighted towards more recent editions):
Croatia (7,0)
Belgium (7,0)
Sweden (7,0)
Switzerland (6,0)
Turkey (6,0)


Plucky minnows:
Scotland (4, 0)
Wales (2, 0)
N. Ireland (1,0)
Ireland (3, 0)


Won but forgotten:
Greece (4,1)



My basis for this is appearances in Euros finals (rather than World Cup, mainly because that's just what I looked at first) and wins in the tournament.

Now it was a bit weird, because it was four teams only from its start in '60 until expanded to 8 in '84, 16 in '96 and 24 in 2016. But given the proliferation of actual countries since '95 that's also unsurprising. UEFA now has 55 member organisations (remember, no less than FOUR of these are from UK ). Croatia, for instance has missed only a single tournament since their first in '96, while three of the Czech Republic's appearances (and their win) cames as Czechoslovakia (though they still have five more appearances than their neighbours)

UEFA Members:
View attachment 790223

An interesting fact, 8 of the Czechoslovakia team in the final that won Euro 76 were Slovaks.

 

[T4tomo]

Italy - famously poor at qualifying for tournaments of late.....

 

[Joey Shabadoo]

The best player in Italy is Scottish. Let that sink in.

 

[No Ta Doctor]

Wish I hadn't done quite so much work on the post above, when Wikipedia has a brilliant page on European teams at the world cup

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/European_nations_at_the_FIFA_World_Cup

While it's a far older tournament (thus reflecting e.g. Hungary's change in fortunes), some of the differences are quite marked. Here's everyone with over 10 appearances

 

[Alex321]

Wish I hadn't done quite so much work on the post above, when Wikipedia has a brilliant page on European teams at the world cup

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/European_nations_at_the_FIFA_World_Cup

While it's a far older tournament (thus reflecting e.g. Hungary's change in fortunes), some of the differences are quite marked. Here's everyone with over 10 appearances

View attachment 790228

Without having looked anything up at the time, it turns out the five I listed as "big countries" above are the only 5 European teams to have won the world cup.

I'm a little surprised the Netherlands never won it when they were at their best.