The Fridays Tour 2012

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mmmmartin

Random geezer
a start from Brighton or elsewhere on the south coast
I am thinking along the same lines - more specifically, of starting at Dungeness because:
  • It is the start of the Dungeness-Cape Wrath route (ie, the "other" LeJog).
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  • It is sort of (by which I mean "not at all") a southernmost point.
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  • It has a cafe for a nice healthy fry-up before the start.
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  • It is easy to get to (train to Hythe, then pan flat across Romney Marsh to the cafe)
  • There is a nice pretty nuclear power station there, which adds immeasurably to the rustic charm.
    wacko.gif
  • It is possible to ride from there to HPC during the day.
    icon_rolleyes.gif
  • There is a kind of daft warped logic to it that fits in perfectly with the ethos of The Fridays.
    icon_twisted.gif
 

frank9755

Cyclist
Location
West London
Stuart,

It’s not a question of one way is right and the others are wrong. It’s perfectly possible (for anyone who is fit enough for an FNRttC) to do a cycling tour with a support vehicle or without. All I am saying is that, having done both several times over the last couple of years, I have come to the conclusion that more is lost than is gained through having a vehicle driving alongside.

What I’ve experienced is that having the vehicle can create the temptation to push the daily mileages up and to make it into more of a race. Breaks get scheduled around the vehicle and its stops rather than around what is in the towns and villages you pass through. There is more pressure on people to cycle at a similar pace to maintain contact with the vehicle – which can annoy both the faster and slower riders – and pressure is put on the slower ones to go in the vehicle when they would have been perfectly capable of riding on at their own pace, and have got more satisfaction from doing so, had it not been there.

On the other hand, without a vehicle chugging along I have had much more a feeling of escape, self-sufficiency and connection with the terrain I've been passing though - and hence greater satisfaction and enjoyment. And there are always other options available to deal with the problems that can arise on the road.

If you’re struggling with the thought of being able to pack light enough, have a look at this site. It shows how and what to pack to get touring luggage weight, excl camping equipment, food and water, to below 5kg.
 

StuAff

Silencing his legs regularly
Location
Portsmouth
I am thinking along the same lines - more specifically, of starting at Dungeness because:
  • It is the start of the Dungeness-Cape Wrath route (ie, the "other" LeJog).
    mellow.gif
  • It is sort of (by which I mean "not at all") a southernmost point.
    rolleyes.gif
  • It has a cafe for a nice healthy fry-up before the start.
    dirol.gif
  • It is easy to get to (train to Hythe, then pan flat across Romney Marsh to the cafe)
  • There is a nice pretty nuclear power station there, which adds immeasurably to the rustic charm.
    wacko.gif
  • It is possible to ride from there to HPC during the day.
    icon_rolleyes.gif
  • There is a kind of daft warped logic to it that fits in perfectly with the ethos of The Fridays.
    icon_twisted.gif

Dungeness would be good....
 
U

User482

Guest
Stuart,

It’s not a question of one way is right and the others are wrong. It’s perfectly possible (for anyone who is fit enough for an FNRttC) to do a cycling tour with a support vehicle or without. All I am saying is that, having done both several times over the last couple of years, I have come to the conclusion that more is lost than is gained through having a vehicle driving alongside.

I've never toured with a support vehicle, and I've never felt the need to. My regular touring buddy would not describe himself as fit - indeed, on our lejog he was both unfit and suffering from a cold, yet because we were independent, we could schedule in plenty of breaks, and arrive at our destination when we wanted to. The only day on our lejog that felt difficult and unpleasant was 95 miles between Lockerbie and Loch Lomond, in rain and a headwind. One difficult day out of twelve doesn't sound too bad to me...

But even then, we were done by 6pm, allowing plenty of time for a shower and a hearty pub tea, followed by an early night.

All of this is somewhat academic, as I suspect the chances of negotiating a pass for this ride are negligable, but you never know...
 

StuAff

Silencing his legs regularly
Location
Portsmouth
Stuart,

It’s not a question of one way is right and the others are wrong. It’s perfectly possible (for anyone who is fit enough for an FNRttC) to do a cycling tour with a support vehicle or without. All I am saying is that, having done both several times over the last couple of years, I have come to the conclusion that more is lost than is gained through having a vehicle driving alongside.

What I’ve experienced is that having the vehicle can create the temptation to push the daily mileages up and to make it into more of a race. Breaks get scheduled around the vehicle and its stops rather than around what is in the towns and villages you pass through. There is more pressure on people to cycle at a similar pace to maintain contact with the vehicle – which can annoy both the faster and slower riders – and pressure is put on the slower ones to go in the vehicle when they would have been perfectly capable of riding on at their own pace, and have got more satisfaction from doing so, had it not been there.

On the other hand, without a vehicle chugging along I have had much more a feeling of escape, self-sufficiency and connection with the terrain I've been passing though - and hence greater satisfaction and enjoyment. And there are always other options available to deal with the problems that can arise on the road.

If you’re struggling with the thought of being able to pack light enough, have a look at this site. It shows how and what to pack to get touring luggage weight, excl camping equipment, food and water, to below 5kg.


I see your arguments, Frank...it's two sides of the same coin. Call it self-centred, but I'm pretty sure I get more of a feeling of 'escape' when I don't have to lug several kilos on my back and on the bike. The only bike of the three I have that can take panniers is also the least sensible for climbing (small matter of four or five kilos extra before you put the rack and bags on....). Neither the Viner or the Condor can take panniers (carbon) and why on earth would I want them on either bike anyway? So that will be most of the weight on my back...I'm sure you won't mind if curse your name loudly on every climb? :smile: Likely n+1 will be able to take rack and panniers, and would be still pretty light...but I'd prefer to keep it light.


As far as the bit I've put in bold- let me tell you from recent experience- I'm not going in a van if I can keep going perfectly well under my own steam. That I was forced to do so last month absolutely disgusted me. My 'team' had the idea that if if anyone was a little behind, in the van. If they were all late for lunch...in the van. One of them, the first day I was sick, went in the van for a bit because it was raining (?!!!). Some of them called me slow because I could only manage 15 mph rolling average- and rather riding as a group, which would have helped everyone, the faster ones (including Mr Scared of the Rain!) just bombed on ahead. Hence people getting lost (I ended up in Inverness because I turned right instead of left at one junction, three others went to one of the other two Premier Inns in East Kilbride..) and me getting thoroughly hacked off (I wasn't the only one, I just got more hacked off more often). Not one person rode the whole way, we didn't even have one person on the road every mile of the route. The first full day I was back on the bike after the bonk and illness, it was like nothing had happened, they kept on giving me grief rather than support or accepting that what they did had to be learnt from. On the afternoon penultimate day, I rode about 36 miles, alone, into a headwind. Some of the others decided to stop off at a distillery (?!!). First I got held up because the support guys (who were brilliant) didn't know how long they were going to be there. I was eventually allowed to continue. The aforementioned 'comrades' passed me with a somewhat insulting 'keep up' and left me alone, again. Not a thought about me or my feelings. There were enough hours in the day for me and everyone else to do the daily mileage, but prevarication, laziness and poor scheduling (hotels that didn't serve breakfast early enough, inflexible lunch stops, etc) meant it never happened. And this ride was hard enough without having to deal with all that **** (pick expression of your choice).

That is part of the reason I want to do LeJOG (or at least something much like it) properly, ASAP. And I wouldn't want anyone to feel pressurised the way I was. I'd only want a van to (a) carry luggage and (b) be there in the event of problems. No reason for it to act as a 'pace car' or prevent us stopping as and where we feel the need. It's to support the riders, not rule over them.
 

frank9755

Cyclist
Location
West London
Sounds like you had a particularly poor experience. Those are the sort of things I've seen bits of with a support vehicle in the equation, but never to that extent

But why do you want to lug panniers if you're not camping: why not travel light?
 

StuAff

Silencing his legs regularly
Location
Portsmouth
Sounds like you had a particularly poor experience. Those are the sort of things I've seen bits of with a support vehicle in the equation, but never to that extent

But why do you want to lug panniers if you're not camping: why not travel light?



I want to travel light....by putting the weight in a van.... I don't want to lug panniers, because I can't. If I took either the Viner or the Condor, panniers are simply not an option. So that means everything I do carry has to go on my back or in the Carradice, and that can't hold much either, it's pretty rigid. And makes my sports car handle like a tank when full. So pretty much everything on my back, and me cursing whoever had the bright idea to not have any support on every single incline.

I'll say it yet again, because it seems to go clean over people's heads...this is supposed to be fun. Fun in my book does not mean having to scrutinise every single thing you're taking for weight and bulk, or then having to lug it up 13,14, 15% drags........
 
U

User482

Guest
I want to travel light....by putting the weight in a van.... I don't want to lug panniers, because I can't. If I took either the Viner or the Condor, panniers are simply not an option. So that means everything I do carry has to go on my back or in the Carradice, and that can't hold much either, it's pretty rigid. And makes my sports car handle like a tank when full. So pretty much everything on my back, and me cursing whoever had the bright idea to not have any support on every single incline.

I'll say it yet again, because it seems to go clean over people's heads...this is supposed to be fun. Fun in my book does not mean having to scrutinise every single thing you're taking for weight and bulk, or then having to lug it up 13,14, 15% drags........

But Stu, plenty of us enjoy touring regardless of the fact that we're carrying luggage. It's not a race, or even a club run, so the effect on bike speed and handling is perhaps of lesser importance than you are suggesting. In any case, going up a climb with 85kg of rider and bike, vs 95kg of rider bike and luggage - is it really such a big deal, given the lack of pressure to finish by a prescribed time?
 

StuAff

Silencing his legs regularly
Location
Portsmouth
But Stu, plenty of us enjoy touring regardless of the fact that we're carrying luggage. It's not a race, or even a club run, so the effect on bike speed and handling is perhaps of lesser importance than you are suggesting. In any case, going up a climb with 85kg of rider and bike, vs 95kg of rider bike and luggage - is it really such a big deal, given the lack of pressure to finish by a prescribed time?

But you'd still get up that climb a lot better without that weight.....and the weight will be a constant burden all day, every day. Some people have enough bother on FNRttCs without sticking a load of kit on their bike...and I just don't want to.

Tell you what, you and me do a LeJOG together. You get to carry all my stuff. See who enjoys it more......
 
But you'd still get up that climb a lot better without that weight.....and the weight will be a constant burden all day, every day. Some people have enough bother on FNRttCs without sticking a load of kit on their bike...and I just don't want to.

Tell you what, you and me do a LeJOG together. You get to carry all my stuff. See who enjoys it more......


Stu I think you might be over reacting a little, and extra 10kg or so in panniers really doesn't make that much of a difference, I wouldn't want to carry it on my back though - could you borrow a bike that would take a rack?
 

srw

It's a bit more complicated than that...
And having done three days in a group with a van with no pressure at all on anyone to do anything other than ride, it was very useful. The group divided itself up into three or four small subgroups (plus one or two occasional anti-social so-and-sos), the van provided lunch and elevenses and meant no-one had do anything other than think about enjoying the ride. The subgroup thing didn't make any difference to the overall cohesiveness of the ride - the whole lot regrouped most lunchtimes and in the evenings.
 
U

User482

Guest
But you'd still get up that climb a lot better without that weight.....and the weight will be a constant burden all day, every day. Some people have enough bother on FNRttCs without sticking a load of kit on their bike...and I just don't want to.

Tell you what, you and me do a LeJOG together. You get to carry all my stuff. See who enjoys it more......


No, you'd get up the climbs a bit better. As I said, it's not a race...

Thing is stu, I've done a LEJOG carrying my own stuff, and enjoyed it immensely. You did a supported LEJOG and hated it. There might be a message in there...
 
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